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Old 10-19-2011, 10:47 PM   #1
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EU1000i Stumbles ....advice

Great forum, long time lurker. Wanted to share something here and hopefully learn a bit.

SO, I pick up a spare 1000eu. I found it on CL for 350, claimed 50hrs, lights indicate as such for the most part. Either way, Figured I couldn't go wrong at that cost. So i get it. Looks pretty good. Have a fairly good gut feeling from the seller and it runs like a top. So i run it for a couple hrs (not consecutively) and decide i'll do an oil change and do a thorough review so i'm comfortable with what's what.

Oil was like tar. Gone, 5w30 M1 synthetic since that's what's laying around for the vehicles. (oddly enough, no longer need full choke to start after this change) toilet paper tube(best idea ever) and 10 minutes, 2 beers. All set.

Here's the catch:

I ran and got a fresh gallon of gas. I added red sta-bil, WHICH I NEVER EVER USE, but have read a lot of good things about it so figured let's be safe. Do the oil, fill the fuel, clean the filter, review the plug. Tip top. Feeling good about my 350 deal.

Couple days later figure i'll run it on a marginal load, one of those yellow work/flood lights while i'm splitting wood, just to run it though a bit. It just doesn't want to work. Wouldn't run longer than 2 minutes before fumbling about and stopping. WTF. Cheapest first...tip it over and get rid of the doctored sta-bil fuel. Fill it with no sta-bil fresh pump derived fuel...back to running like a top status. Ran it for 45 minutes w/o a hick-up before i turned it off. My experience tells me that is fine to know what to expect next time. However i will run it the next couple of nights for at least an hour, a tank or two....SO

anyone have any insight or idea's as to what the hell(wth) was causing it to crap out? I don't believe i over sta-bil'ed it, based on the sta-bil numbers to use.

Also, hitting the switch quick to eco didn't matter, it just crapped out. It would start right up again, just not really run and would shut off, loaded or non loaded.
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Old 10-20-2011, 12:23 AM   #2
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Of course there could be several possibilities, but my first guess is there is a bit of debris in the carburetor. On a small engine, the passages of the carb are tiny. If fuel sat in it for a while, some of it will harden into a varnish and cause deposits. It is possible this may clear on its own, and you'll know it if it keeps running OK. But you may have to take the carburetor apart and physically clean it.

I've had quite a bit of experience with ATV engines and frequently after a lot of lay up the carbs are clogged if not properly stored.

BTW Welcome!
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Old 10-20-2011, 12:24 AM   #3
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Couple of comments...

Honda's manual says... "SAE 10W-30 is recommended for general, all-temperature use."

The 5W-30 is for very cold weather running - you might want to change it out, especially since the old oil was 'tar' like - flushing a couple of times after running might get some more of the 'sludge' out of the engine...

Some here have recommended using mid-grade octane fuel instead of the base 87 octane grade - I switched a couple of years ago, and find that our 2K Honda runs like a top...I've never used a fuel stabilizer in our genny - but I've learned to make sure and drain the carb float bowl before storage...

The proper carb jet in such a small engine is critical for proper operation - that fuel stabilizer must have effected the mixture enough to cause your problems...

Happy runnings'....
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Old 10-20-2011, 12:26 AM   #4
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I kn this probably is not the answer, but did you have the gas cap in the "on" position so it can allow air into the gas tank? If it's closed up tight it will choke and die. I've forgotten to do that a couple of times and it dies if you don't give it air.
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Old 10-20-2011, 05:44 AM   #5
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"Claimed 50 hours.. oil was like tar"

Does not compute.
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Old 10-20-2011, 06:51 AM   #6
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My 2000 did the same thing after I had stored it for a year. It ran good for a while, then started cutting out and surging. I found it would run acceptably, though a little rough, with the choke partly on. I ran most of a fresh tank of gas through it in several sessions, under varying loads, and by the time I was ready to refuel it, it was again running normally.
I also agree that sludge in a 50 hour engine would be pegging out my BS meter.
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Old 10-20-2011, 08:12 AM   #7
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Thanks for the replies. Yeah the "tar sludge" is what it is. I checked it quickly when buying but it just seemed dark. Oh well. As for the cap, yeah it was in the on position.

Also after the oil change it starts much better and needs only a little choke if any, as before it needed full choke, not sure on that one. The manual is fine with 5w30, which I'll run a tank of gas through and then change the oil again as suggested below. I did notice that no matter how "tight" i make the oil cap, it still seems to seep a very small amount.

I'll give the 89 octane a try. It does seem however by getting rid of the fresh "treated" fuel and going back to normal gas has pretty much straightened it out. I'll still run a tank or two of better fuel 89, why not and give the oil another swap.

Whatever way i look at it, i'm still way ahead with the 350 price tag. Having owned several honda's i'm pretty confident this thing wasn't beat.

I'll let y'all know

Thx again for the welcome.
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Old 10-20-2011, 08:58 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by broham View Post
I did notice that no matter how "tight" i make the oil cap, it still seems to seep a very small amount.
I'm not trying to be a fear monger, but could it have bad rings and it is getting blow back pressure in the crankcase? That would make the oil ugly too.
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Old 10-20-2011, 09:25 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by broham View Post

I'll give the 89 octane a try. It does seem however by getting rid of the fresh "treated" fuel and going back to normal gas has pretty much straightened it out. I'll still run a tank or two of better fuel 89, why not and give the oil another swap.
I am not a fan of Sta-bil not because it causes problems (I doubt that it does) but because I haven't seen any evidence that it solves anything. Fuel decay is mainly a matter of temperature and exposure to water and oxygen, and sta-bil doesn't help with that.

I believe that, as others have implied, there was some particulate matter in the carb, and the process of draining and refiling the fuel tank got it out of the way.

My guess is that, based on the condition of the oil, it had way more than 50 hours on it. But these things run for a long, long time so it probably doesn't matter much.
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Old 10-20-2011, 09:32 AM   #10
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Kindly read the owners manual.
Use the right oil.
Use the right gasoline.
Don't use a stabilizer. Stabilizers are almost pure alchohol. That combined with the ethanol in most available gasoline is too much alchohol for these generators.
If it is like my 2000ei, it will have two gasoline shut-offs; the gas cap and on the control panel.
Does it have the automatic load moniter? If so, you start it with the load monitor "Off" and run it with the load monitor "On." If you run it for a prolonged period without load and with the load moniter "Off" that is bad for the generator and could cause an auto-shut down to protect itself.
Hope this helps.
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Old 10-20-2011, 12:11 PM   #11
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Letsee... First congratulations on getting a deal on a Honda

Umn, your profile location of City...bro ; State/Province... ham doesn't help diagnose this problem..

I use Stabil or its equal since I hate finding my cans reeking of turpentine - but up here in Minnesota there is summer/winter gas mixtures, trying to use summer gas near or below freezing in 1 out of 3 small motors is a lesson in frustration, and using winter mix in warm temps is a guaranteed vapor lock the first time it gets shut down and then try to restart. You said the second batch was 'pump-derived' so maybe the first gallon was a different seasonal mix?

If its running now the following is just academic

If it had run less than the 50 hours and had some/all of the fuel tank contents drain down into the crank and allowed to evaporate, when it was next run it the fuel shellac might've gummed up the rings, so to getting to the 50 hours usage there was a huge amount of blow-by carbon put in the oil, plus turned the crankcase fuel dregs into what you called sludge.

You still have the old oil? Does it reek of gasoline? Even synthetic oils get diluted by blow-by over time, probably the only real reason to change it out more often than advertised. Does the new oil have a gasoline smell already?

Anyhow - if the oil was sludge, fuel shellac gumming up the piston rings and it ran hot the rings could be/have been frozen and not hugging the cylinder walls. Can you peek inside the cylinder to see if the bore is smooth and clean? The fresh oil layer boosted compression so easier starting. Dumping the fuel tank once dislodged a slug of water. Who knows.

Good luck!
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Old 10-20-2011, 11:41 PM   #12
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thank you everyone, the responses are well informed and thought out. It ran straight for 4.3 hours powering a flood light and the 2nd tank on 89. It will no longer powers the fridge (an older fridge) but it did in the past, prior to this oil change/sta-bil shenanigan...that is curious.

I also have a champion 2k from costco that still seems to be covering the misses of the 1k. it'll power the super old power hungry fridge as well as the new "eco" fridge, at the same time. Pretty slick unit. They claim it's modeled after the yamaha "eu" gen. Whatever. I understand the 1k is what it is and the champion 2k is just a silly deal for the cost and can handle considerably more. See costco or sam's.

The champ 2k was sort of an experiment due to the very low cost and similar specs to the honda and yamaha, so after extensive forums and many, many pages of reading i grabbed one. No complaints. Impressed if nothing else given the cost and construction/support. On about 64 hours and 3 oil changes, regular gas.

As for the 1k. it seems to be back to normal. I guess that stabil just screwed it up or again i over did it. Whatever the case, i've never used it and i'll never screw with it again. I think i'm going to sell this little one since the champion does such a fine job for my needs and is just as quiet but can simply handle more.
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