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Old 04-17-2006, 10:04 AM   #29
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As for black tank repair, check out TomW 's website for repairing it. In this bath configuration it is my opinion that the black tank is insufficiently supported, as it is with the galvanized pan. It rusts and does a poor job. I ran a length of angle iron along the bottom of the pan and bolted it to the frame, for added support.

Looking forward to those pics and how-to's!

John
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Old 04-19-2006, 04:50 PM   #30
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My black tank has two 1" x 1" angles in either side of the galv box to support it. This seems like enough as long as the box is OK. Of course mine was literally rusted away, so the I'll have to make a new one.

The toilet replacement that Streamin 65 showed on post #8 is the best solution for replacing the toilet that I've seen thus far for this configuration. This is the way I'm leaning.
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Old 04-20-2006, 12:48 PM   #31
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You asked for it...here's the update!

John and all:

Just finished uploading some of the pics we have taken of our black tank and toilet removal and repair process. I think the following link should take you to where the photos start in my gallery:

http://tinyurl.com/rbs9n

If anyone cares to review the images and comment, I'd be thrilled.

We are trying to decide if this tank is worth salvaging. I'd like to try, as it's not in brittle condition. (Is this an original or a replacement? Anyone know?)

It already has one patch, with what I assume may be Scotchweld Epoxy - anyone know where to get that? I read it was recommended for sealing the fittings and it seems someone used the same thing to patch a hole and the patch has held. We tried a test patch with some hardware store plastic epoxy that is supposed to work for most plastics but are not crazy with the results. I also think the top of the tank and the bottom are of two different materials.

We have two cracks and two holes to patch. Considering encasing the whole thing in fiberglass? Or, perhaps using Bondo? (I know, the desperate grasp at straws.) Or maybe trying welding? It seems like that might be a viable option but not sure.

It we determine it is not worth patching then we will have a tank made to fit. I need to price that out, but assume it's not cheap for a tank of this shape. I am also aware that Inland sells a matching tank so that is an option on the table.

I have been impressed with some of the repairs people have done, and since we would like to try and get this up and running by Mid May, I am interested in patching. Suggestions are welcome.

The toilet update is I think it only needs a new gasket and we should be in business. Don't ask how I am going to get it back in, I'll let you know when we actually get that accomplished! It was very hard to get out, and if we get to the re-installation point there may well be a lot more plumbing and stuff that will be in the way. Very tight quarters.

Will keep ya'll posted - please ask questions if you need more pics for your own restore.

Tamara
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Old 04-20-2006, 03:31 PM   #32
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Tamara,
My 66 Safari tank is the same as yours. Mine was very cracked on top. I chose to replace it with a new one from Inland RV. http://www.inlandrv.com/parts/91324-blackh20tank.jpg
$445.00 is a bit steep, but I'll know I have a good tank. I haven't installed it yet so I still need to learn how to install the mounting plate for the toilet itself into the tank at it's not already installed.
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Old 04-30-2006, 03:41 PM   #33
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Burnzee,
Please let us know when you figure out what you are going to do. I also have a 66 Safari with a bad black water tank I am going to have to strip out the bathroom to replace. Probably upgrade a lot more while I am in there. Any chance you figured out how to check the toilet water problem after you got it pulled? I want to check mine before I pull it. The mechanism looks and works good, I hate to replace it.
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Old 04-30-2006, 03:47 PM   #34
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Burnzee please let us know when you figure out what you are going to do. I also have a 66 Safari with a bad black water tank I am going to have to strip out the bathroom to replace. Probably upgrade a lot more while I am in there. Any chance you figures out how to check the toilet water problem after you got it pulled? I want to check mine before I pull it. The mechanism looks and works good, I hate to replace it.
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Old 05-19-2006, 08:24 PM   #35
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1966 24' Tradewind
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Replacing toilet in 66' Tradewind

Well we finally found the perfect toilet to fit in our 66' tradewind. We found a Sealand Traveler 910 which I am not sure if it is discontinued or not. By finding this toilet was like hitting the lottery. The only things we had to do was to place it on a Thetford riser (which we had to cut to fit around the plumbing), cut the fiberglass opening for the toilet (we dropped the toilet bowl down from the top) and the flush pedal opening was perfectly matched to the old opening so we had to cut the fiberglass opening a little longer in length and extend the foot pedal. This toilet was almost as identical to the old porcelain toilet. We researched all different toilets sizes and after being sent on a wild goose chase for a Thetford Aqua Magic IV high profile which we thought would be the closest in size, we spotted this Sealand and measured it and it was exactly what we needed. It just so happened that the rv center had it for about a year and told me they couldn't get that particular one anymore. I'm not sure about that, so if you want a toilet like this one, you need to call around to rv centers and see if they have any in stock. This toilet was made like the old one in which you could mount the bottom part of the toilet to the riser, then drop the bowl in and mount the bowl to the bottom part. (2-piece toilet). When Mark mounted the bottom part that has the pedal flush arm, I couldn't believe my eyes when I saw the pedal flush arm was exactly in line with the fiberglass opening for the old toilet pedal flush arm. It went in so fast we didn't take any pictures. If you ask me, there is not a toilet more suited than the one we bought. I have read all of you comments and appreciate all the effort everyone put forth. If any one wants any pictures of the afterwork, let me know. Thanks
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Old 05-19-2006, 11:28 PM   #36
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The sealand toilets are an excellent choice .A high quality product.We have the traveler lite 110 in our 60 tradewind .I like the porcelin the best

Scott
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Old 05-19-2006, 11:43 PM   #37
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Well we finally found the perfect toilet to fit in our 66' tradewind. We found a Sealand Traveler 910 which I am not sure if it is discontinued or not. By finding this toilet was like hitting the lottery. The only things we had to do was to place it on a Thetford riser ...................... If you ask me, there is not a toilet more suited than the one we bought. ............................. If any one wants any pictures of the afterwork, let me know. Thanks
I would love to see pictures - I have the Traveler 910 (my paperwork says Mansfield Sanitary Inc. - I think Sealand bought them out) Anyways the P.O. installed this toilet, but it of course is to short on its own - he "engineered" a fix by glueing in a house closet flange that brought it above the floor, then cutting wood to place around the flange supporting it. He also used a homemade wooden spacer between the flange and the gasket at the bottom of the toilet - it leaked - D'oh!
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Old 05-21-2006, 11:05 PM   #38
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Hello greatpumkin,

did you check out the thetford (I think) 2 " risers they have for raising the toilet properly? I had posted to you about those ,thought it would help solve your problem without the poorly designed setup the po did,did you ever get that closet flange unglued?

Scott of scottanlily
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Old 05-21-2006, 11:28 PM   #39
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Hello greatpumkin,

did you check out the thetford (I think) 2 " risers they have for raising the toilet properly? I had posted to you about those ,thought it would help solve your problem without the poorly designed setup the po did,did you ever get that closet flange unglued?

Scott of scottanlily
Thanks for the replies - I think I'm going to give one of those risers a try. I haven't yet tackled trying to remove the closet flange - I just didn't have the time (or courage) before we went camping that weekend. I think I'm a little afraid of what I'm going to find. If the P.O.'s previous "fix" screwed up the threads into the black tank am I looking at complete replacement?

I'm going to have to tackle it pretty soon though, or my other half says no camping

I've been working long hours this week and haven't had time to even visit the AS except to go check on the leaky skylight after the rains we've been having. Both vents/skylights are not original and need replaced. The front long one is broken on the outer layer, but no leaks. The smaller rear one is cracked where the hehr lifter attaches to it.
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Old 05-22-2006, 08:39 PM   #40
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We had to remove the cast iron flange because the toilet mount holes were not aligned properly. The flange would not budge. We tried using a heat gun that was suggested by an rv tech, but that wouldn't work either. Soooooo, Mark got out his grinder and hack saw and went to work. He grinded off all that he could asnot to ruin the plastic threads. Then when we got to the inside part of the flange he used a hack saw and cut in 3 or 4 sections very carefully as not to go to deep. Then used visegrips to clamp on a section and started to wiggle it. He did have to make a cut about an 1/8" from another cut and tap that small piece out with a screwdriver so there was room for the bigger piece to come out. He worked from the outside and I helped from the inside because I could see with a light how deep the cuts were. It was a little time consuming, but well worth it. Then we replaced the flange, added the 2-1/2" Thetford riser, then the toilet. When we had everything together he said it looked "sweet". I will take some pictures because he has to remove toilet again so a friend can sweat in a copper line that came loose. As soon as that is going to happen (hopefully in the next week) I'll put in some pictures. If there is anything else we can help with, we'll do the best we can to answer.
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Old 05-23-2006, 01:10 AM   #41
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Hello Gingergirl,

Mark an myself must have the same ideas going on because thats exactly the way to do it ,basically word for word .I had to remove the old Y tail piece to restore my brass gate valve and build a new tail Y piece from brass this time.
Had to do what you guys did ,laying under the curbside rear of my 60 trdwnd.
GreatPumkin ,Gingergirls answer is your answer to get that apart.

Scott of scottanlily
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Old 05-23-2006, 09:24 PM   #42
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Repaired and Working once again!

Well we just got back from our trip to the Buffalo River and I wanted to post an update to our solution for two leaky gate valves (one toilet valve, one tank valve) and a cracked black tank.

As a reminder, we have a '66 Overlander with a Thetford Porcelain toilet. The whole system needed to be fixed or replaced, and we concentrated on repair since we were short on time.

We tracked down a repair kit for the stainless backed thetford valves, and were able to replace the interior gasket on the dump valve. (Took the valve apart and inserted new rubber gasket inside.) We figured this was the most important valve to fix and could only find one kit.

Having previously bought the incorrect repair kit for an all plastic valve, we took one of the o-rings from it to re-seat the toilet valve back into the toilet assembly and merely lubricated the interior valve gasket with silicone as it looked to be in ok condition. This valve still leaks a tiny bit, but quite frankly the toilet bowl does not really need to hold water, so no worries. The leak goes straight into the black tank.

Now, the black tank we sealed with plastic epoxy (about four tubes worth) and it appears to be performing very well so far. When the time comes we will replace the tank with a new one but we were in a hurry to get on the road and the tank is in otherwise very very good condition. The dump valve here still leaks a bit also - I think this is because, even though we replaced the gasket, either the blade is too worn to give a good seal or - the entire assembly is a bit weak due to a couple of the corners where it mounts to the tank were broken. We patched these corners with metal plates before mounting but perhaps the valve just does not seal as well as before due to being a bit "loose".

The fix for that, since we were getting on the road, was quite easy. Found an expandable rubber drain plug at Lowe's, the kind you put in a floor drain and when you screw the wing nut tight on top, it flattens out making it fit snugly into the drain. The outlet from the tank is about 3" ID, bought a 2 1/2" (I think, the large one was too big I recall) plug that fits just GREAT and completely stops the tiny leak. We did have to buy two of the plugs - they have a metal top and bottom, and the top is too big to fit the outlet. The bottom metal plate though is just fine, so we replaced the top plate with a second bottom plate from the other plug. Used long needle nose pliers to tighten after putting the plug into the outlet just past where the grey water outlet joins it, so we could still use the portable grey tank. Held like a charm.

Now, before you think "eww gross...what happened when you opened that plug up?" - let me just say that we only used the toilet for #1 and no paper was allowed in the tank. (By the way Target sells a great stainless steel toilet paper roll holder with a lid that makes a dandy tiny trash can for an Airstream bathroom!!) After adding some tank treatment, and using water to flush, the end result was really nothing much more than water, and only a tiny bit came out when the trailer was level and the plug was removed. Worked for us, but on the way home we went to Colaw's RV salvage on I-44 in Missouri and found a whole bin full of assorted Thetford valves. While nearly all of them were labeled as T-1169 models, they all seemed slightly different but we did actually find a lone stainless one that looks nearly identical to ours and so I hope to replace the tank dump valve with that one and get rid of the plug. $25 pricing was awesome!

They also had a whole box full of the repair kits for stainless valves if anyone needs them. I almost bought a bunch but...we may be going back in July if anyone wants me to pick up some.

This is getting long winded, but hopefully those looking to keep their old toilets and tanks will find the info useful. If you think about it, there is little to go wrong with the old toilets - there are basically a bowl with a valve and it is the valve that generally is going to go bad - specifically the gasket but sometimes the whole valve. If you don't mind getting in there and replacing stuff, you may very well be able to keep your rig original.

I will try to post some more pics and part numbers, etc or feel free to ask any questions. We love our original toilet, and getting it back in, along with the repaired tank, was actually a snap. MUCH easier than getting everything out. It's not a perfect fix yet, but we are content for now and hopefully with the replacement valve we will be back at 99% condition for as long as the black tank holds up! I can't say how much I enjoyed being able to use the toity in our home away from home for the first time - those early morning trips to the pit toilets were not my favorite part of camping!!!

Oh yeah, we had a great trip and look for a post soon about the Buffalo River National Park - it's really not to be missed if you like canoeing!!
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