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Old 04-13-2003, 09:03 PM   #1
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too much pressure?

Just got back from a few days out in my Overlander and while setting up I hooked up the water hose and water just started running nonstop out of the rear. Found it was coming out of a small drain hose which went to a small pressure relief valve downside of the regulator. Shut the water off and depressurized the system to see if it would reset, maybe I had put too much pressure on it too quick? It would never reset, I ended up putting a 1/2 inch plug in it to keep it from running for the next two days. What's up with that? I don't use a separate inline regulator, used to with the "white boxes" but figured I wouldn't need them with the plumbed inline A/S regulator. So , I guess I have a bad regulator and a bad pressure relief valve? They look like Watts brand stuff, right? Good thing I had the soldered copper lines and fittings, everything held together just fine!!

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Old 04-13-2003, 09:25 PM   #2
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Even with the in coach pressure regulators I use the marshall 40 PSI regulator at the tap. Park pressure can be over 100 PSI, and I do not want to have my hose burst in the middle of the night . I have stayed in parks where that has happened and the hose is like a living thing flying all over and wacking people and trailers. Think of the wriggly snake thing that some kids have as a summer time water toy only this one is on steroids. Sometimes the internal one will get stuff in it and once it opens it will not close. Then it is time to get out the torch
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Old 04-13-2003, 09:35 PM   #3
 
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Pix of the one from our 1971 (looks a lot like the one we have in the 1974). We have the same leak in the 1974. If you solve your problem, please let us know.
Mike think that this could have happened on ours when he blew out the lines for winterizing. Maybe that's a time when the pressure could be exceeded.

----------------------------

Watts:

No 25A
Set STD
Range 30-75
relieve valve 60psi
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Old 04-13-2003, 09:40 PM   #4
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Yeah that hose was pretty hard! I guess I have never run into a problem of too much pressure. Never thought about the blown whipping hose scenario though to my credit I do turn off the water at the hose bibb if I am going to be away. I think I have one of those inline Marshall gadgets stashed away somewhere around here. I believe I am going to have to remove the regulator and pop off valves, possibly replace them?

femuse, yes, that is the critter!! Quick with the pics there, ain't ya?

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Old 04-14-2003, 10:29 AM   #5
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That type of water leak is coming from the "high pressure pop off valve."

It is also called the 111 valve around the Airstream lingo.

Simply replacing it solves the problem.

Some owners choose to cap that valve off. Not very wise, but that is their choice.


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Old 04-16-2003, 08:40 AM   #6
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I removed both the pop off valve and the pressure regulator. I took apart the pressure regulator just to satisfy my curiosity and from what I saw it looks bad, the rubber seats were chewed up and everything else was scaled up pretty good. Looks like I wil be getting both replaced. It makes sense that if your pop off (111 valve) starts running it is most likely caused by a bad pressure regulator. There is a industrial plumbing place here in town that is a Watts dealer so I will see if they have the regulator, maybe even the 111 valves or similar. I always had exceedingly high pressure in the trailer at all the faucets anyways, maybe now the toilet won't wake me up in the middle of the night?

(femuse, the numbers you list are for the pressure regulator, the larger device in your pic, the pop offs are made by Webster? and are basically just a 60 psi pop off relief valve)

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Old 04-16-2003, 07:47 PM   #7
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That's funny

I am having a similar problem. My 72 Ambassador leaked at a high rate from the right "IN" side of the regulator. Looked to be from the bottom and did so whether it was on city water or when I started the pump for tank water. On initial observation it seemed to have a gap in the bottom of that inlet, not where the pipe comes in but directly under. It appears that a wrench would fit on it. Could it have had some water pooled in it that froze? I drained the lines but did not use air pressure to blow them out.

Has anyone fixed a problem like this?

I don't intend to hijack this thread, just thought they might be closely related.

thanks
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Old 04-16-2003, 08:01 PM   #8
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Dave-O,

Does it still leak? By what you are describing it sounds like it is coming from the strainer plug, an integral part of the regulator. It shouldn't be leaking from there unless it is cracked or otherwise damaged. I found a new replacement Watts regulator and hope to get it plumbed in soon. I think I will test the old pop off valve and reinstall it for I am not sure if I can find one locally, I checked with my A/S dealer today and he acted like he knew what it was but couldn't produce one. Here is the info on a new replacement Watts regulator, they come preset at 50 psi, the pop offs are set at 60 psi. Watts 1/2 25AUB STD

(BTW, they are also rebuildable)

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Old 04-16-2003, 08:24 PM   #9
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I had the same problem at the first campground I stopped at on a trip last fall.....water coming out full steam from the pop off valve. I couldn't figure it out, so I just turned the water on and off at the spigot when needed for the one night stay....the rest of the trip and all the other campgrounds were fine, so I guess it was my first experience with high incoming water pressure.
It seems to be fine now everywhere else, so I'm assuming the pop off valve was just doing it's job and is still ok, but I bought an external regulator anyway.
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Old 04-17-2003, 02:02 PM   #10
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Chas,
Yes, mine is still leaking. I haven't had a chance to get further into it yet. The reason I ask about freeze damage is last week was the first time I had it out since December and we had a hard freeze later on in Jan or Feb. I can't use the water system at all due to this problem.
Tell me more about your replacement regulator, where and how much if you would be so kind. Looks like I may have to replace/rebuild mine.
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Old 04-17-2003, 07:31 PM   #11
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Dave-O,

The models numbers are in one of my recent posts. Just find a plumbing supply that handles the Watts brand, I found it on the shelf of my local Ferguson Supply, a southeast based national supply house. It was right around fifty dollars. Be sure to put your original check valve back on the inlet side so when you use your demand pump the water won't run back out thru the outside hose connection. As far as a new pop off I haven't had any luck finding an exact replacement, the Webster manuf. rep told me the 111 valve was discontinued so I got a 75 PSI one in the same pipe size and put it on, better than nothing I guess.

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Old 04-27-2004, 08:30 AM   #12
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Testing the system

Quote:
Originally Posted by thenewkid64
Even with the in coach pressure regulators I use the marshall 40 PSI regulator at the tap. Park pressure can be over 100 PSI...
With the new floor coverings installed in my Overlander, I am now ready to reinstall the plumbing, and I thought it would be a good idea to test the check valve, regulator, and overpressure relief valve.

The check valve: Is its purpose to just to keep the water pump from pumping water out where the hose is connected, or is it also there pursuant to some code?

Is 40 psi the recommended regulator set pressure?

Is 60 psi the recommended pop-off valve set pressure?

And finally, when the water heater heats water, it will expand, and pressurize the system. With the check valve in place, this pressure cannot exit out the hose. Is it common for the overpressure valve to vent this pressure? I have heard that RV water heaters usually have a bubble of air in the tank that will compress to relieve the overpressure condition. Should I count on it?

Thanks,
Tom
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Old 04-27-2004, 09:46 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tcwilliams
And finally, when the water heater heats water, it will expand, and pressurize the system. With the check valve in place, this pressure cannot exit out the hose. Is it common for the overpressure valve to vent this pressure? I have heard that RV water heaters usually have a bubble of air in the tank that will compress to relieve the overpressure condition. Should I count on it?

Thanks,
Tom
I have also heard about the air in the tank being a method to prevent dripping of the water heater safety valve. Some folks say that it occasionally is beneficial to allow some air into the tank. I'm not sure about the operation of the check valve.

I do know that if you have a "closed" system, water heater pressure safety valves can open up slightly near the end of the heating cycle. I'm battling that issue on a new water heater at home. The county plumbing inspector noted that my 17 year old home water pressure regulator is most likely malfunctioning and not allowing the pressure from the hot water heating cycle to go back through the city water lines. Apparently there is a small passage on the regulator that allows a small amount of backflow. He said that replacing that should take care of the problem. I looked at a cutaway drawing of the home regulator and there does seem to be a springed valve that is set up to allow a tiny amout of outflow back into city water.

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Old 04-27-2004, 10:10 AM   #14
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I do count on the Air gap. I also try to augment it.

Normally when connecting to a city water source the hose has some air in it. I flush the air out of the system by turning on the hot water faucet. This allows air that was in the hose to enter the water heater. Thus maintaining the air gap. If the water heater manufacturer did not want an air gap they would have plumbed the tank so no air could remain in the tank when the tank was under pressure.

Your internal overpressure valve will allow the excess pressure to be relived should you get to the point that your plumbing has reached the 55 or 60 PSI setting on the pressure valve. This is the small valve in line after the pressure regulator as the piping comes in from the exterior. The T&P valve on the water heater will pop off if you are too hot, or too high a pressure, but I don't know the actual set points on it.
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