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Old 04-16-2012, 05:45 PM   #1
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Thetford Macerator pump: Box Mounted??

I am wanting to get a Thetford SANI-CON permanently mounted on a 25' International-- where in the heck should it go? There isn't a utility nook to mount it in? Has anyone ever installed a "BOX mounted System" in an international?

Could use some advice because I DO NOT want "Camping World" to screw up my trailer!!

Thanks...

Thomas
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Old 08-13-2013, 07:04 PM   #2
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Came across this old post while searching for ideas myself so thought I'd post to maybe help others coming across this.

As far as I can tell from my initial research, the only place to put most pumps is at or below the tank level so gravity can feed the pump. That seems to leave the belly pan as the only real viable place to install a pump permanently. I have come across a few posts showing such installations.
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Old 08-14-2013, 07:28 AM   #3
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You may be over-thinking it. The best place to put the pump is exactly the same place you would hook up your slinky if you didn't have the pump. If you've already got enough gravity feed for waste to run out of a slinky, you've got enough to feed the pump, too. You may have to cut back on the pipe/hose between the tank and the new pump in order to get the pump inside the skin of the trailer, but that's it.
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Old 08-14-2013, 09:14 AM   #4
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Whatever you do, put it in a place you can easily get to for diassembly/cleanout. I don't have a macerator, but my B-I-L installed one in a vintage A/S. A darling grandchild put something in the toilet that wouldn't grind up. Oh, and this has happened before. If you have absolute control of who uses your "facility" it's not an issue, but one guest can ruin your day...
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Old 08-14-2013, 09:43 AM   #5
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MOUNTING MACERATOR
Mount the macerator pump on a shelf in your garage ! Get a SEWER SOLUTION, no breakdowns, easy mounting, works great with no mechanical, electrical problems ever ! Simple, easy, effective. [gets rid of the "slinky too"]
just offering a viable, simple alternative, your choice.
good luck with your project,
Chip
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Old 08-14-2013, 10:19 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chipster View Post
MOUNTING MACERATOR
Mount the macerator pump on a shelf in your garage ! Get a SEWER SOLUTION, no breakdowns, easy mounting, works great with no mechanical, electrical problems ever ! Simple, easy, effective. [gets rid of the "slinky too"]
just offering a viable, simple alternative, your choice.
good luck with your project,
Chip
Sewer Solution does require a water source at your dump station that you can hook up the jet pump to, though. A macerator doesn't require a water hookup, just 12v electricity.

My Interstate came with a macerator, so I didn't have much choice, but aside from blowing a fuse once (on my first camping trip with it), I've had no problems with it.

A Sewer Solution does mount in a smaller space, though, so if you can live with the limitation of needing to feed it clean water to work the jet, it can be a better solution for a retrofit.
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Old 08-14-2013, 10:39 AM   #7
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Special compartment built for a Waste Management System

See posts 526 and 529 on my main thread here:

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f227...-18448-38.html



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Old 08-30-2013, 01:38 PM   #8
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That link from Sergei is broken but here is a better one to those posts....

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f227...-18448-38.html

I may have been incorrect about the pump needing to be below or at the same level as the dump valves, though Sergei's is. I have purchased a pump to permanently install and I am trying to decide if I will mount it within the belly pan or perhaps up at floor level. My pump specifications talk about priming to 4ft dry or 5ft wet --- so I am thinking it can suck up to the pump and of course it can push uphill after the pump.

I bought the jabsco 18590.

What I'm trying to do is turn the old generator compartment on my center bath 1977 excella 500 into a dumping compartment. The hose will store inside and there will also be controls to open the dump valves. I purchased some valterra valves with flexible cables so u can put the handles at a more convenient location. I am tempted to get electric valves instead -- there are some electric adapters you can put on regular valterra or thetford valves. They would fit better than the cable actuated valterra valve in the space I have for my black valve. The cable valve might work but its too close in fit to be comfortable, and the cable has to be routed carefully to operate correctly. Electric would be easier to install.

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Old 08-31-2013, 09:03 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CA_Tallguy View Post
I may have been incorrect about the pump needing to be below or at the same level as the dump valves, though Sergei's is. I have purchased a pump to permanently install and I am trying to decide if I will mount it within the belly pan or perhaps up at floor level. My pump specifications talk about priming to 4ft dry or 5ft wet --- so I am thinking it can suck up to the pump and of course it can push uphill after the pump.
The pump MAY be able to suck liquids up to it if used as a lift pump, but there is a problem you might want to consider. Some effluent will not be sucked up, and you will always have unmacerated effluent that you can't get rid of. We experience something similar with sump pumps mounted above floor level. When the water column in the inlet pipe starts to get shorter than the pipe itself, all of the remaining water cascades back down because the pump starts sucking up air bubbles. This leads to a suck/drop/suck/drop cycle that repeats until the pump is shut off.

Also consider that a lift pump will lift floating solids up to it, but not solids that are heavier than water. It's not like a wet/dry shop vac.

That configuration will also create a problem with winterizing; you'll never be able to completely drain the tank.

The best way to install a macerator pump is to put it at the lowest point in your waste system. That way, the amount of water trapped behind the pump is minimized.
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Old 08-31-2013, 11:21 AM   #10
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Thanks for your input! I read in a mother thread where you were talking about a motorized reel in the interstates for the hose so i did a search and found one that I am going to try to use in my retrofit. I started a new thread for my build and I would appreciate your feedback there as it progresses!

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f444...nt-109107.html

I will have to rethink my placement of the pump. It will be easier for me to install in the belly pan but just harder to access of course. In your experience with macerator pumps, is lack of access going to be much of an issue? Access won't be terribly difficult I suppose, as I will just need to drop a patch panel on the belly.
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Old 08-31-2013, 11:49 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by CA_Tallguy View Post
In your experience with macerator pumps, is lack of access going to be much of an issue? Access won't be terribly difficult I suppose, as I will just need to drop a patch panel on the belly.
You'll hardly ever have to access it, unless you break something.
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Old 09-01-2013, 03:58 PM   #12
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I have room below but I'm out under the trailer trying to find a mounting surface. The frame rail there has an oval opening with the wires for the level sensors for the grey tank coming through. And of course that means the grey tank is right on the other side so bolts or screws going through the solid part are not great options either. If my fabrication buddy were not out of town I might try to have him make me a bracket that hung over the bottom part of the oval opening.

The other issue is that the barb for the outlet flow would poke strait up to the floor and I'm thinking it might not be the best place for it to poke through. There might be room for a sharp elbow there but I'm not sure.

On the other hand, putting the pump above the floor in the closet would be very simple. The lift would only be 4 to 6 inches if I did that. Maybe I need to do some testing of the pump before install to get an idea how it might work with a small lift like that.

I realize that there is a huge difference between zero lift and any lift, no matter how small though.
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Old 09-01-2013, 05:30 PM   #13
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Ok, so I did a quick test of my Jabsco pump and it looks like having no gap for air to enter is FAR more important than mounting level. It seems like having a P trap type curve in the line is the best way to go. I had planned on angling the sanitary T downward a small amount for the pump line but now I'm thinking I may go more drastic in angle, even if I have to cut a hole in the belly pan so it can extend down a little more. That would make the line off the main 3 inch dump pipe more of a drain hole than a T junction.

If the pump were to tie straight into the 3 inch pipe with a T then I don't think it would really work much at all except when the pipe was completely full. And since the 3 inch line is essentially at the level of the tanks, that level is probably only there when tanks are full.

The pump is so fast that I might have to cycle it several times during the dump, maybe numerous times at the end. It sucks REALLY fast so no matter what it is going to be hard to get that last little bit out. It will evacuate the P trap in the blink of an eye so if the flow out of the tanks isn't enough to keep up the cycling will have to begin.

The portable type of macerator that hangs off the existing dump tube would be a lot more effective since it is much lower but less convenient to use. It might have a similar issue toward the trickling part as it probably would evacuate faster than the trickle.
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Old 09-01-2013, 09:21 PM   #14
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Tall Guy,

The first rule of plumbing is that **** doesn’t flow uphill. You may learn that from experience but somebody should tell you that now before you ruin your machine.

A macerator can discharge effluent uphill, up quite a few feet actually, but it needs to be gravity fed at the intake.

A guy named Fred Tinsmith some years ago published “poop sheets”, famous in the RV world. Here’s his very good piece on macerators. It bears your reading.

http://manmrk.net/tutorials/RV/phred/macerator.html

Although I installed a macerator system for my outfit I can’t seem to understand what you are doing or why you want to do it that way.

I built a “ waste management compartment” for my Argosy. You refer to it above.

You seem to want to convert your unused generator compartment into something similar, although you might only be using it for storage. I’m not sure.

Why don’t you route your waste lines there? That’s what I did. The valves, macerator and hose are all contained in my compartment.

Your macerator needs to be attached to the main 3” outlet, were the black and gray lines both terminate. That way you pump your black first, and then run the grey through the machine, helping to keep it clean.

The “fast speed” you are talking about is the macerator running “dry”. A macerator must always be grinding and pumping liquid. If it runs “dry” you run the danger of ruining the impellor blades.

Protagonist notes that the macerator hardly ever needs access. Hardly ever is not the same as never.

My JABSCO once let loose a 4” brass stud bolt that helps hold parts together. How that happened no one knows but the macerator tried to eat the bolt and that tore off all the impeller blades. That’s why Jabsco sells Service Kits.

You need to have the machine accessible.

Finally, you remind me of the time I spent months “inventing”, then tracking down the components for my diesel-powered hydroninc heating system.

After it was all done I was bragging about my invention over the phone to my son in Vancouver. “ Oh, he said, “ you mean like they have in boats and yachts?”.

It turned out that my “ invention” had been available off the shelf in the boating world all the while that I was dreaming it up.

The RV Sani Con sold by Thetford has done all the thinking and testing for you. All you had to do is buy a model and attach it to your sewer outlet.

Their stretch hose, 21’ long collapsing to 7’, is better than any reeled hose system.

Sani-Con System


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