Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 10-16-2014, 11:51 AM   #1
3 Rivet Member
 
grayling's Avatar
 
1961 16' Bambi
Avinger , Texas
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 104
Tank design - will this work??

Regarding a 1961 Bambi, street side bathroom:

I am in the process of rebuilding the bathroom. I have removed the black water tank and plan to replace it. I want to add a grey water tank as well.

For those not familiar with this year/model:
The black water tank sits on top of the floor. The toilet sits on top of the tank. The bathroom floor doubles as the shower tub. Originally the shower discharged onto the ground. The kitchen sink drained into the black tank via the vent tube that ran up through the roof.

In my particular model, the kitchen and the bathroom are separated by a thin wall. The black water tank does run a little under this wall almost into the kitchen. Directly next to this wall in the kitchen is the stove and refrigerator, stacked. Below the fridge is a drawer, right above the floor. My plan as drawn below is to have a grey water tank in the place of this drawer, which empties via a discharge valve into the black tank. The location of the valve would be accessible through lifting the exterior hatch directly behind it. The vent for the grey tank would be created by rejoining with the black tank vent tube.

But this complicates where to place the drain for the shower to hook up to grey tank. The drain for the shower pan is lower than both black tank and proposed grey tank. When I received this trailer, the shower drain was piped with an elbow into the old Sani-Ware discharge assembly. The only way that designed worked was if the dump hose was attached, then it drained directly into the hose unchecked. I didn't like the way it looked because it hung precariously below the belly pan.

Your thoughts? On grey tank idea, ways to hook up shower pan to grey/black, etc. Click image for larger version

Name:	tanks.jpg
Views:	180
Size:	564.6 KB
ID:	224484

Click image for larger version

Name:	photo 1.JPG
Views:	118
Size:	110.2 KB
ID:	224485

Click image for larger version

Name:	as1.jpg
Views:	115
Size:	328.4 KB
ID:	224486

Click image for larger version

Name:	photo 3 (1).jpg
Views:	123
Size:	369.1 KB
ID:	224487
__________________

__________________
grayling is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2014, 11:57 AM   #2
3 Rivet Member
 
grayling's Avatar
 
1961 16' Bambi
Avinger , Texas
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 104
Additional pics

Additional pics. Yes the floor condition will be addressed as I go along.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	AS Bathroom.jpg
Views:	79
Size:	287.1 KB
ID:	224488   Click image for larger version

Name:	AS Bathroom 2.jpg
Views:	63
Size:	216.0 KB
ID:	224489  

__________________

__________________
grayling is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2014, 01:10 PM   #3
Rivet Master
 
HowieE's Avatar
 
1991 34' Excella
Princeton , New Jersey
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 6,814
Images: 12
Looks good.
The secret is finding a way to vent the new tank and you have.
I would just let the shower continue to go into the black.
Dump the black first and then flush it with the gray and you have a good system.
Some might say you are not within code on the vent but if I told you the reasoning behind vent codes you would laugh.
You have satisfied the laws of physics.
__________________
WBCCI 12156 AIR 3144 WACHUNG TAC NJ6
2004 Excursion 4x4
1991 34 ft. Excella +220,000 miles, new laminated flooring, new upholstery, new 3200 lbs axles

HowieE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2014, 01:47 PM   #4
Rivet Master
 
BambiTex's Avatar
 
1967 26' Overlander
1955 22' Flying Cloud
1964 17' Bambi II
Clear Lake Shores , Texas
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 1,150
Routing shower into black tank kind of defeats the purpose, no? One or two showers and your tank wil be full...
__________________
BambiTex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2014, 02:25 PM   #5
Moderator
 
Stefrobrts's Avatar

 
1968 17' Caravel
Battle Ground , Washington
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 11,911
Images: 50
Blog Entries: 1
The Caravel has a similar layout, and I have thought of adding a grey tank for the sinks to empty into, but I would leave the shower just draining to ground. In 11 years I think we have used it a handful of times, there is almost always a better showering alternative available at the campground but that's just us.

Having the grey tank, or a bigger black tank (or BOTH), would be a really nice addition!
__________________
Stephanie




Stefrobrts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2014, 03:12 PM   #6
3 Rivet Member
 
grayling's Avatar
 
1961 16' Bambi
Avinger , Texas
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by BambiTex View Post
Routing shower into black tank kind of defeats the purpose, no? One or two showers and your tank wil be full...
True. It is a concern. So I think the best way would be to elbow it back into the discharge assembly. Unfortunately that means either the dump hose has to be installed and run into sewer, or carry a blue tank with us if we are going to be somewhere where camp showers and hookups are not available. But that's okay, it's do-able.

Below is a drainage diagram and a possible assembly that may do the trick.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	photo (4).jpg
Views:	98
Size:	340.1 KB
ID:	224495  
Attached Images
 
__________________
grayling is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2014, 12:38 PM   #7
2 Rivet Member
 
Vintage Kin Owner
Orange , California
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 37
VTS Gray Tanks

Vintage Trailer Supply sells a gray tank that fits between the floor frame rails without a belly bulge - it's ready to go & probably less work than your plan, however ingeniuos it is.

IIRC it about 16 gals, 1-2-3 can be used depending on trailer length & # frame spaces, & doesn't protrude below the vintage AS floor frame.

I'm considering it for our 1960 Avion T20 (#2 off the line - 1961 model).

Good Luck!
Tom (Jana's other 1/2)
///////
__________________
janabanana48 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2014, 12:42 PM   #8
3 Rivet Member
 
1961 24' Tradewind
1967 26' Overlander
1973 27' Overlander
Savannah , Georgia
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 152
Are you sure there might not have been a modification or two before you got the trailer? My 61 Tradewind is plumbed (original) like you last example. Valve on the bottom of the black tank and all the gray water plumbing connects to the valve assembly. Yes, you have to keep the discharge hose hooked up and the gray goes into the RV park hook up or a tote. None should drain into the black tank. I contemplated putting in a gray tank, and still may, but the set up works just fine in 90% of cases.
__________________
beatrix1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2014, 06:39 AM   #9
3 Rivet Member
 
grayling's Avatar
 
1961 16' Bambi
Avinger , Texas
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 104
I don't think any mods were done to the kitchen drain system. The kitchen sink drained directly into the vent pipe that entered the black water tank. The shower drain however did have an install that did not look original - a white pea trap pipe that drained into the lower half of the black tank discharge assembly similar to my last drawing.

I don't know if tanks will fit underneath between the floor rails without having to advance the tanks forward toward center, which complicates the issue. Just not a lot of space in the belly of a Bambi. Maybe someone who has modified an old Bambi this way can chime in?
__________________
grayling is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2014, 12:59 PM   #10
3 Rivet Member
 
grayling's Avatar
 
1961 16' Bambi
Avinger , Texas
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 104
Tank design - will this work??

Correction and new design:

The kitchen sink drained into a pipe that ran underneath the belly pan, and coursed over to the discharge assembly where it joined up with shower drain before entering discharge below the black water valve. I just didn't see the drain pipe in belly pan before, so apparently there were some (bad) mods done by previous owners/family members.

Click image for larger version

Name:	ImageUploadedByAirstream Forums1413740832.030540.jpg
Views:	117
Size:	743.8 KB
ID:	224675

Click image for larger version

Name:	ImageUploadedByAirstream Forums1413740896.828241.jpg
Views:	121
Size:	721.8 KB
ID:	224677

With this new plan, the grey water valve will only be for discharging the grey tank, though. Otherwise the water from kitchen would back up into the shower pan if the valve operates downstream from both shower and kitchen. Plus, the tank building guys had heebie jeebies about black and grey tanks being so intimate in the previous drawing.

So that still leaves me having a shower drain that is unchecked in the discharge assembly, but do-able with just two of us. Unless you have a different idea on how the shower can join up with kitchen pipe without back flow?
__________________
grayling is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2014, 01:52 PM   #11
Rivet Master
 
TG Twinkie's Avatar
 
1974 Argosy 26
Morrill , Nebraska
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 5,140
Images: 2
Blog Entries: 5
My '74 Argosy 26' has a (small) 12 gallon grey tank. I didn't want to tear the floor or belly pan out. As an alternative. I installed a 21 gallon tank under the curb side twin bed. When the original tank gets full. I pump it into the new tank. The 21 gallon tank drain is connected to the sewer line for the galley sink.
It saves me the hassle of dealing with a tote.
When both tanks are full. I empty the 12 gallon tank first then open the dump valve on the 21 gallon tank. It drains into the 12 gallon tank. Since the 12 gallon tank dump valve is open the grey water runs thru and out.
A friend of mine with a '60's A$ simply put a pump in the shower drain. Which pumps the grey water into a 21 gallon tank above the floor in his coach. He just turns the pump on when showering.
Since you have solved the grey water tank drain issue. Running a line from the shower drain to the grey water tank. The pump idea may work for you.


Sent from my iPod touch using Airstream Forums
__________________
Knowledge: "A gift to be shared. A treasure to receive."
TG Twinkie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2014, 02:00 PM   #12
3 Rivet Member
 
grayling's Avatar
 
1961 16' Bambi
Avinger , Texas
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 104
Now I am really confused...

The air vent, plumbing stack, vent stack... whatever you want to call it, tied in somewhere around the dump assembly. How? And why?

The original discharge assembly has a hole where (I assumed) the shower used to tie in. But is this actually where the air vent tied in and shower emptied on ground as described in many vintage AS posts? When I received this trailer, a mod was made to allow shower to tie into discharge assembly. It was obviously a mod ( white pipe, p trap, different gauge). The original discharge assembly has another hole opposite of this one where kitchen drain tied in.

I drew a diagram of the plumbing stack as I see it right now:

Click image for larger version

Name:	ImageUploadedByAirstream Forums1413745042.298487.jpg
Views:	88
Size:	715.7 KB
ID:	224684

Do I need to reattach the bottom of the stack to the new discharge assembly, or is this optional?
__________________
grayling is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2014, 03:40 PM   #13
Rivet Master
 
TG Twinkie's Avatar
 
1974 Argosy 26
Morrill , Nebraska
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 5,140
Images: 2
Blog Entries: 5
Where did the shower tie in? I see the black tank and the sink. Is there a galley and a bath sink?
Which one is in your drawing?


Sent from my iPod touch using Airstream Forums
__________________
Knowledge: "A gift to be shared. A treasure to receive."
TG Twinkie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2014, 03:59 PM   #14
3 Rivet Member
 
grayling's Avatar
 
1961 16' Bambi
Avinger , Texas
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 104
Tank design - will this work??

Just a galley, no bath sink. This drawing is only the venting.

Some past posts on this year model says shower discharged directly in ground. Other old posts say tied into the dump assembly downstream of the black tank dump valve.
__________________

__________________
grayling is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Work Platform for Roof Work Bubba John Roof 18 08-02-2015 10:16 AM
Running Lights don't work, Other exterior lights work jrvly1976 Lights - Interior & Exterior 15 01-27-2015 10:27 PM
Black Tank, Grey Tank, New Tank, Old Tank Bunkroom Waste Systems, Tanks & Totes 3 07-22-2014 09:35 PM
Prep Work vs Finish Work Nolavalkyrie Vintage Kin 5 10-03-2013 04:11 PM
Cleaning becomes a little work becomes a lot of work - 1964 GlobeTrottin 1960 - 1964 Globetrotter 6 04-30-2011 11:36 AM


Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:37 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.