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Old 10-25-2011, 06:05 PM   #29
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So they can't find the part. Was told they were going to try and find the part locally first and if not then next day air it in. But now they can't find it period. So I have been told to cancel my trip this weekend. I guess I am out of commission for an unknown amount of time.
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Old 10-25-2011, 06:43 PM   #30
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I left a message with the airstream number. At least I want to confirm that they are unable to provide the part.

Also found the manufacturer for the valve online but they're closed. Calling them tomorrow. Their website shows you able to order it for $26.70. Pretty frustrating if it really does come down to the fact that I can't use my $50k+ airstream b/c they can't get a $26 part.

Not sure if the manufacturer can tell me which one of their valves is on my AS. Going to try.
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Old 10-26-2011, 03:06 PM   #31
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Ronnie:

Any luck? Hope they can get this resolved by the 11th

Dana
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Old 10-26-2011, 03:28 PM   #32
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If it is the HepVO valve...

... and I am skeptical, it may be a simple matter of rotating it along its longitudinal axis 90 degrees
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Old 10-26-2011, 05:16 PM   #33
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So here's the latest and greatest. I popped by the dealer to try and talk face to face and understand what's going on and I think we're on the right track.

They couldn't quite explain it to where I could understand it. They're just doing what Airstream is telling them. So I asked for the contact at Airstream so they could explain it to me. I called that contact and he was very nice and took a little bit of time to explain it to me and he also emailed me a schematic of the grey tank plumbing in my trailer so I could see what they're doing.

Currently my trailer does NOT have a HepVo valve in it. Installing the HepVo valve is the solution. They are putting the HepVo valve in the Interstate models but not the trailers. So let's see if I can explain what's going on.

With my sink going full blast that large volume of water is overwhelming the system such that the system cannot vent through the vent pipe. Since the pressure is built up in the tank and it is not venting, the water is diverting to the shower.

By adding this HepVo valve into the plumbing below my sink this will "control" the flow of water so not to overwhelm the system so it can vent properly. Supposedly this is a flaw in the system in my trailer and has happened on a handful of trailers and this has cleared it up.

I am concerned about how much it will "control" the flow of water. Hopefully it does not significantly slow the flow of water so that my sinks drains real slow but we'll see.

Currently they are expecting approval from Airstream for the work today, gotta love paperwork. Then they'll ship the part and the dealer can install it.

They did have to work on my sensor as well. It failed calibration 3 times and they had to get with Airstream on it but it is suppose to be working now.
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Old 10-26-2011, 05:34 PM   #34
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I sincerely appreciate you taking the time to keep us posted.
It confirms our theory that inadequate "venting" was the problem. I have seen this before but only when the vent pipe is clogged with debris or sitting too deep inside the holding tank. So, we all learn from your plumbing adventure.
Can you post a link to the schematic?
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Old 10-26-2011, 05:34 PM   #35
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My grey water tank isn't full until it backs up into the shower, regardless of what the gauge says. I think you're on the right track investigating the vent.
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Old 10-26-2011, 08:03 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bike_addict View Post
With my sink going full blast that large volume of water is overwhelming the system such that the system cannot vent through the vent pipe. Since the pressure is built up in the tank and it is not venting, the water is diverting to the shower.
To clarify this. It never happened when I just had my sink turned on all the way. It happened when we had the stopper in the sink and it was full of water. once was soaking dishes and another was soaking baby bottles. When I pulled the plug and all the water ran down that's when the back up started. Then of course you run water to rinse the sink and now I have water in the shower.

The file is in a PDF. hopefully it attaches. This is the view of everything above the tank drain. I'm assuming that what I'm not seeing is the union of the pipe from the sink and the pipe from the shower join prior to the grey tank. Wish I could see how that is done but it's not here.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Plumbing 25FB.pdf (72.9 KB, 149 views)
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Old 10-26-2011, 08:05 PM   #37
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Biggest thing that had confused me was that I had assumed that the vent pipe for the grey tank was a separate pipe off of the tank, not inline with the drain pipe for the sinks or shower. So I could not understand why something going on with the sink/shower pipes would affect the vent pipe. Now I see it's all inline.
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Old 10-26-2011, 08:07 PM   #38
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Ronnie:

Hope they can get this resolved by the 11th

Dana
You and me both. I'm expecting to get it back mid week next week and as soon as I get it back I'm going to run a lot of water through it and make sure I'm good to go. I can't imagine that I'll be down that long.
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Old 10-26-2011, 08:23 PM   #39
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Question Doesn't sound right to me

Quote:
Originally Posted by bike_addict View Post


.................................................. ....

So let's see if I can explain what's going on.

With my sink going full blast that large volume of water is overwhelming the system such that the system cannot vent through the vent pipe. Since the pressure is built up in the tank and it is not venting, the water is diverting to the shower.

By adding this HepVo valve into the plumbing below my sink this will "control" the flow of water so not to overwhelm the system so it can vent properly. Supposedly this is a flaw in the system in my trailer and has happened on a handful of trailers and this has cleared it up.

I am concerned about how much it will "control" the flow of water. Hopefully it does not significantly slow the flow of water so that my sinks drains real slow but we'll see.

Currently they are expecting approval from Airstream for the work today, gotta love paperwork. Then they'll ship the part and the dealer can install it.

They did have to work on my sensor as well. It failed calibration 3 times and they had to get with Airstream on it but it is suppose to be working now.
I'm no plumber, but I do have a degree in atmospheric sciences and this make no sense to me. It sounds like they are trying to fix a problem by treating a symptom.

Consider these facts:

Water is more dense (by a lot) than air.
Air is compressible, water is not.
The diameter of the vent pipe is about the same as or larger than the drain pipe's.

There is no way, not even if you stuck a garden hose full blast into the drain, that you could put enough water down that drain to overcome the vents ability to expel the displaced air, unless the vent is being severely restricted or the vent's opening into the tank is below the water level.

I believe that the "flaw" in your Trailer is a bad vent system and I would insist in having it fixed. Read about the HEPV valve and what it is used for. It's purpose is not to slow down the flow of water.

Ken
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Old 10-26-2011, 08:49 PM   #40
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I agree with wt7s, something fishy is going on here. Even if you take the rep's statement that there is a flaw in the construction of your trailer, I would think the correct solution is fix the flaw, not add a valve (that's not needed on other trailers) to restrict the flow.
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Old 10-26-2011, 08:54 PM   #41
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I also find it hard to believe that Airstream would have different methods of building a International vs a FlyingCloud. I would recommend that the service dept. use a camara like plummers use to find problems with sewer pipes in homes. This would remove the guess work of the vent tube too far down.
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Old 10-26-2011, 09:13 PM   #42
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Air Admittance Valve Problem

Here's what I think is happening:

You clarified the problem by saying that you are dumping a sink-full of water all at once. If the drawing is correct -- and I understand you properly, there is a lot of water where the word "Galley" is on your drawing. The fuller the sink, the more water pressure you have when you pull that drain plug.

When you pull the plug, you have a solid slug of water running down the drain. If that water pressure is greater than 0 psig at the Air Admittance Valve (the closest #6 to the galley on your drawing) it will not admit air to vent. The Air Admittance Valve only works when there is a vacuum -- kind of like a check valve that lets air in only.

Since you have a big slug of solid water coming down all at once, it rushes down in to the grey tank and doesn't let air out (See 11D on your drawing). If that entry point to the grey tank is flooded with rushing water, the only other escape route for the air being displaced from your grey tank is out your shower drain.

In my humble opinion, Airstream's fix is a patch. If it does work, it does so by restricting the water flow so that you don't flood the combination drain/vent line as it enters the grey tank. The best solution is to use a true vent, not an Air Admittance Valve. (11A should join 11H). On a finished trailer, you may not be able to do that. If my theory is correct, things would improve by lengthening 11A so that the Air Admittance Valve is above the height of the water in the sink, allowing it to work properly.

Good luck,

John
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