broken flange on blackwater tank? 1971

vintagemike · 09-05-2007, 07:19 PM

After 2 nights of working to get the rusty screws out of the dump valve I was finally able to remove the valve.
The problem with my leak seems to be that the square flange that the valve screws to is cracked and falling apart at each corner.
I think that as the screws rusted they also expanded and split the plastic.
On this trailer the flange and valve are directly below the tank pointing straight down. There is no piping between the tank and the valve.
SO THE QUESTION IS... is that square white plastic part that the valve screws to part of the tank or is it glued to the tank?
I do not believe this square white flange thing to be repairable as it is quite brittle and parts were breaking off easily.

I hope this does not mean I have to replace the black tank....

Vintage Mike

Ganglin · 09-05-2007, 08:39 PM

Do you have a Land Yacht or International?

StingrayL82 · 09-05-2007, 09:48 PM

Mike,

Save yourself the headache and replace the tank. Mine was cracked at the same spot, as well as at the top opening. The black water leaked, the galvanized pan rusted, the tank dropped down and broke at the toilet......long story short, I had a bunch of stuff replaced.

Frederic

vintagemike · 09-06-2007, 05:10 AM

The trailer is a 25 foot Tradewind, 1971. I am worried about the availability of the tank. A local dealer thought that this tank would not be available. On this unit the black tank is above the floor, directly under the toilet. The only part that shows through the floor is the section of the tank with the flange.
If I have to take the tank out, how does it come out? It would seem that the toilet and half the darn bathroom has to come out to even see the tank!

vintage Mike

StingrayL82 · 09-06-2007, 05:33 AM

Don't know how it comes out, but if you google Inca plastics, they made the original tanks for our rigs. They can custom make you a tank, or you can do like Rob and Zoe did and have one made out of stainless steel, which is way cool, by the way! Whatever you do, do NOT buy a fiberglass tank. They will crack, I don't care what anyone else says!!!! The stress of the road will take its toll, and you'll have to start all over again. I've heard too many horror stories about people who bought the fiberglass tanks and then had them crack, or they didn't fit right, or the holes weren't where they were supposed to be.

Frederic

Cos · 09-06-2007, 06:52 AM

Vintagemike,

It sounds like I have the same setup and same problem with my 73 GT except my bath and tank are already out. I also can not tell if the pvc fitting that the valve attaches to is glued into the tank. It looks more like plumbers putty. Turning it to take it out does not seem like an option. I was going to try cutting the fitting in half from the inside and removing it in two pieces. Even if we get these fittings out I not sure where we would find a replacement.

Ganglin · 09-06-2007, 08:52 PM

VintageMike,

I have a diagram of how the tank is removed from INSIDE the bath - you have to remove parts of a clothes hamper? then pull the floor panel up - well you get the idea. It looks like the dump valve attachment is bonded to the tank - the top toilet flange looks like it will come out for reuse. Let me know if you want this and I'll have is scanned and emailed to you. PM me your email.

Smokin Camel · 09-07-2007, 10:34 PM

I just pulled my blackwater tank. I discovered a small crack in it. There was evidence of some slight leakage some time ago. The PO did not use the toilet and he had it for over ten years, he just went to the rv park with it.

I got a hold of Inca and they dug out the mold for either that one or it's twin. They were very good to work with and provided me with measurement instructions. If you are not going to weld new fittings and do the cutting at the site (most experts recomend you do it at the site) measure carefully and give reference measurements from a single point.

Now if I can get Thetford to figure out what valve was in it, that would be nice. The numbers on the valve slide must not be in the records. They sent some drawings that were a bit tough to distinguish and I could only get it down to two of five. That was several days ago, I have not heard back yet, but this could take awhile.

The original valve base was welded on. I understand that AS had stopped welding soem time before but then I have a lot of things in mine that are not as the manual says they should be. The vent was just the ABS tube placed over a 2 1/2 nipple, no glue there. The toilet was set in a threaded base and the thread piece was also welded in place.

Good luck, I will post how my new tank goes in when I install it next spring.

Smokin Camel · 09-07-2007, 10:40 PM

I forgot to add...it was not that bad getting the tank out. Remove the toilet and the hamper. There are some bolts (small) on the forward wall that will need to be removed as well as the trim in front of the toilet stand. The ABS sheet will come up and then the plywood floor will come up. To get the dump valve out you need to go outside and loosen the curved panel from the trim strimp to the base. Once you have the body metal loose the rest is pretty easy, just unbolt the valve and the pull slide extension, remove the valve (or the slide if the base is welded, and the tank should lift out.

vintagemike · 09-09-2007, 04:08 PM

I appreciate your advice. I got the valve out and was just fighting with the flange again a few minutes ago. My local A/S dealer thinks the flange threads on, but if it does there is still not enough room to rotate it from the bottom anyway. So out comes the toilet and tank I guess.

I actually just found a bigger problem. The back 2 inches of floor next to the rear bumper is all rotted. I thought this may have been a leak from the shower that had travelled across the edge. However it is from rain getting in from outside. It has rained here all day and everything had dried out under the trailer. When I just got out there after the rain has stopped and the driveway was dry I found that whole area soaked-really soaked. Now I have the tongue of the trailer down low to give me room underneath at the back and I think the rain is coming in under the aluminum on top of the bumper. I think this is going to be a big project... Any experience with this or could you recommend a posting on the site somewhere?

Zeppelinium · 10-20-2007, 10:29 AM

I got here because I have a broken toilet flange fitting in my Sovereign. I'm looking for some info on welding polypropylene. However, let me comment on your rain leak.

The aluminum cover over the bumper is hinged to a narrow strip of aluminum that runs forward under the C-channel. This is a perfect path to introduce water to the back floor any time the back bumper is wet. An incredible bad design. I have used Vulkem to seal the joint between the shell skin and the bumper cover. Seems to be an adequate solution. But it's something that ought to be checked often.

Zep

Smokin Camel · 10-21-2007, 02:53 AM

Thanks for mentioning that, I will have to check mine nexxt time I get down to the shed.

LI Pets · 10-21-2007, 05:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeppelinium

I got here because I have a broken toilet flange fitting in my Sovereign. I'm looking for some info on welding polypropylene.

Zep

They weld up like new no problem.

Smokin Camel · 12-14-2007, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vintagemike

After 2 nights of working to get the rusty screws out of the dump valve I was finally able to remove the valve.
The problem with my leak seems to be that the square flange that the valve screws to is cracked and falling apart at each corner.
I think that as the screws rusted they also expanded and split the plastic.
On this trailer the flange and valve are directly below the tank pointing straight down. There is no piping between the tank and the valve.
SO THE QUESTION IS... is that square white plastic part that the valve screws to part of the tank or is it glued to the tank?
I do not believe this square white flange thing to be repairable as it is quite brittle and parts were breaking off easily.

I hope this does not mean I have to replace the black tank....

Vintage Mike

I have a 72 TW-LY that had a crack in it. I got ahold of inca & got a replacement. Let them know what valve you are going to use. I may have to have mine glassed in as the screw nipples are a different width than the Thetford valve I ordered. It seems it was around 2 bills.