Noisy water pump I've decided even though it isn't broken I'm gonna fix it

[okstreamer]

Originally Posted by mrprez

I'd like to relocate mine. The literature says the fittings are 1/2"-14 NPSM. I've read these are different from NPT. Will I be able to find longer hoses?

My pump was 1/2 in MIP threads on both inlet and outlet. If you buy 12 in long x 3/8 in braided hoses with 1/2 in FIP connectors on both ends and use a small brass Nipple to make the Conection from the pex and the hose connection. These hoses can be purchased at any Lowes or Home Depot plumbing department.

[okstreamer]

Originally Posted by Arcticfox

Thanks for this.
When you say "stainless steel braided hoses" are you talking about the stuff one would normally see under a sink. That connects the tap set to the water line? Also what is a hammer arrestor?
Sorry for the questions as it will let you know how much I know about plumbing.....lol
Thanks

Doug

Edit - just did a Google search on Hammer Arrestor and it looks like something I've never seen before, but should not be hard to install as long as I can find one. Thanks

Yes, these stainless steel connectors are used to hook up lavatories and water closets. They come in an assortment of lengths. Most range between 12 - 18 in and are 3/8 in ID. You will most likely need 1/2 in FIP connectors on each end to make the pump to pex connection. This may vary depending on how your plumbing was installed.

[Dingram/Colo]

Has anyone installed the Flojet VFLO, variable frequency drive pump? VFD's are supposed to pump only according to the flow, rather than start at full speed, then shut off. Its expensive but uses less volt/amps for smaller volumes, and supposed to be very quiet. I'm a believer that you get what you pay for, but cautious of claims, and relying on user experience.

[Jim Foster]

Have Shur-flo Whisper King in both trailers with hose loop on the output side. Both over ten years old and both quiet. Just make sure the output hose is not laying against anything or there may still be noise. The loop is important.


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[Arcticfox]

Originally Posted by okstreamer

Yes, these stainless steel connectors are used to hook up lavatories and water closets. They come in an assortment of lengths. Most range between 12 - 18 in and are 3/8 in ID. You will most likely need 1/2 in FIP connectors on each end to make the pump to pex connection. This may vary depending on how your plumbing was installed.

Thanks for the info. I will head shopping today.....

[RAH]

Re: #23 - We’ve been using the Flojet VSD pump for about 2 years. We love the VSD pump. The VSD water pump is really quiet – just a whisper at start up and on low demand. Now we can turn the pump on in the middle of the night, flush the toilet, and the pump noise doesn’t wake up anyone in the trailer. I dare say the old pump may have woken up our neighbors it was so loud. Hardest thing with the new pump is that it is so quiet I don’t think about it, and it is hard for me to remember to turn it off for travel, etc.

When I bought the Flojet VSD pump it was $194 from CW. It came with a strainer and a bunch of adapters to use for the install. The strainer is 40 mesh screen same as my old one, but the new one is much larger. My old strainer was in the waterline about 10 inches away from the pump. The new strainer plugs right into the input port on the pump, and that is how I set it up and I just took the old strainer out of the system.

Good luck with your decision!

[RVDreamer]

Originally Posted by bigreddog

If i had only one complaint about these trailers, it would be the noise the water pump makes..., especially at night. I mounted my pump on a 1/4 inch piece of plywood, and glued a 1" thick piece of neoprene below that, and then glued it to the floor, and the pump did get quieter, but the shock distributed to the plumbing is still causing noise. I like the suggestion of braided segments on both sides, and pipe insulation around the individual lines.. That might work. There has GOT to be a solution.

There is!

Buy a new pump. The Shur-flo Revolution is much much quieter. I can still hear it but is more comparable to a light hum rather than the jack hammer sound of the original pump.

[okstreamer]

Originally Posted by Arcticfox

Thanks for the info. I will head shopping today.....

I forgot to mention an additional plumbing trick I added while I had the pump disconnected. On the inlet side of the pump I installed 1/2 in FIP full port diverter ball valve. One side connects to the pipe going to the fresh water. The other side I installed a FIP to hose connector so it allowed me an opening by switching the valve once a year to fill my pipes with antifreeze. This makes it very easy to do that chore by just hooking a small hose to the valve opening put it in a gallon of antifreeze and turn on the pump, open each faucet until you see the color of antifreeze. Usually only takes a gallon of th antifreeze to do my job. Then I close the valve back to its original fresh water position and screw a hose cap on the open end of the diverter valve and I am done. When spring comes just add water to the fresh water tank and pump all the antifreeze out.

[Arcticfox]

Originally Posted by okstreamer

I forgot to mention an additional plumbing trick I added while I had the pump disconnected. On the inlet side of the pump I installed 1/2 in FIP full port diverter ball valve. One side connects to the pipe going to the fresh water. The other side I installed a FIP to hose connector so it allowed me an opening by switching the valve once a year to fill my pipes with antifreeze. This makes it very easy to do that chore by just hooking a small hose to the valve opening put it in a gallon of antifreeze and turn on the pump, open each faucet until you see the color of antifreeze. Usually only takes a gallon of th antifreeze to do my job. Then I close the valve back to its original fresh water position and screw a hose cap on the open end of the diverter valve and I am done. When spring comes just add water to the fresh water tank and pump all the antifreeze out.

Thanks for this....

I have a antifreeze bypass placed inline now that I got from Camping world. I'm assuming its what your talking about.

While we're on this topic, would it be possible for you to take a picture of your plumbing setup so I can see how everything fits together. Here is the bypass that I have already, just to make sure we're talking about the same thing....

Thanks

Doug

[okstreamer]

Here is what I did to make the noise stop.

[OTRA15]

Originally Posted by okstreamer

Here is what I did to make the noise stop.

Thanks for the photo. On the 20-footer thread there are a number of folks who have installed (or are about to install) a similar fix.

What is the foam material on the floor please? Just standard packing material, or did you buy some special acoustic dampening material? Are the stainless braided hoses the ShurFlo kit?

Other than the foam and flex hoses, are there other components in your fix? And did you put any foam material on any of the walls not seen in your photo?

Thanks,

Peter

PS -- This blue jeans insulation material is under consideration. Do you have any experience with it? Thanks.

http://www.bondedlogic.com/ultraliner-sound-blanket/

[okstreamer]

The noise is actually coming from 3 sources. 1 the pump itself. Any stiff foam insulation between the pump and the floor will isolate this noise. 2 the water hammer of the pump turning on and off causes this noise through the plumbing pipes. The water hammer arrester provides an air shock absorber to stop this noise. 3 the noise transmitted from the pump down the stiff pex plastic lines. This is taken care of by the braided stainless steel connectors found at any plumbing parts store or Home Depot. Installing some foam pipe insulation around the pipes helps prevent any other pipe noise. All three of these noise are transmitted down to the wood floor and just resonate like a speaker. The key is just isolate the whole thing from the floor and other objects as much as possible.

[CruizinDux]

Originally Posted by okstreamer

The noise is actually coming from 3 sources. 1 the pump itself. Any stiff foam insulation between the pump and the floor will isolate this noise. 2 the water hammer of the pump turning on and off causes this noise through the plumbing pipes. The water hammer arrester provides an air shock absorber to stop this noise. 3 the noise transmitted from the pump down the stiff pex plastic lines. This is taken care of by the braided stainless steel connectors found at any plumbing parts store or Home Depot. Installing some foam pipe insulation around the pipes helps prevent any other pipe noise. All three of these noise are transmitted down to the wood floor and just resonate like a speaker. The key is just isolate the whole thing from the floor and other objects as much as possible.

Okstreamer, can arrestors me mounted horizontally? On the 20’ there is limited space above the pump (pot & pan drawer).

I subscribe to the 20/r thread that Peter mentioned above which has been discussing the pump noise for a while.

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f516...127845-38.html and the following pages.

I opted to not get too fancy so slipped a sheet 3/8” high density foam under the pump and most of the compartment. When reattaching the pump, I didn’t run the screws down as tight as OEM. I also added a mall rubber grommet between the screw head and the washer. I then added some low density foam inside the clamps and slipped some sections of pipe insulation at the points of contact. I also noticed that flex to pex connection (distribution) was touching the diamond plate and presumed this was a source of extreme vibration and shudder. I cut a small section of the HDF for here too and added the pipe insulation. I opted to not re-clamp here not only because it was impossible to get the drill driver in there with any leverage for a self-tapping screw, (since I didn’t want to remove the bike rack) but there were also 2 clamps downstream within inches, so I called it good.

I like the arrestor concept and have seem them at supply stores. I suspect the answer to the above is no so I’ll probably add one in the vertical position and the flex to pex connection. It’s pretty protected so should not be in the way.

At this point I opted to not replace the OEM flex with the std stainless used for sinks etc, but may revisit it later if needed. I also opted to not add any sound deadening (except the HDF ensolite pad on the pump area floor), other than possibly in the bottom of the drawer immediately above and hopefully serve a dual purpose of keeping the pot/pans (immediately above pump) from sliding around, however this also may warrant a re-evaluation.



Bob

[OTRA15]

Your work looks good, Bob, but I think the proper term is accumulator, not arrestor!

http://www.amazon.com/SHURflo-182-20.../dp/B000N9VF6Q

As I posted on the 20-footer thread I am trying to get around to this work with some new dampening material TBD, but it has been raining and snowing with another frost warning for tonight. Just like Ireland here today!

Sparky

[okstreamer]

Water hammer arresters can be mounted in any position, just install a tee in the line on the supply side of the pump and fit it in where you can.

[Arcticfox]

Originally Posted by okstreamer

Here is what I did to make the noise stop.

Thanks very much for the photo, I think I have a lot better idea how and what you have done now

Cheers
Doug


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[Arcticfox]

Almost forgot. Is there a particular hammer arresters I need. I looked around the small town I live in and it looks like I will have to order it from someone. So I want to make sure I get the right one that I can just install inline.
With that in mind, I might as well order the stainless steel hoses also. So is there a size and length I should get?

Thanks
Doug


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[CruizinDux]

Originally Posted by okstreamer

Water hammer arresters can be mounted in any position, just install a tee in the line on the supply side of the pump and fit it in where you can.

Thanks okstreamer for the feedback/

Bob

[CruizinDux]

Originally Posted by OTRA15

Your work looks good, Bob, but I think the proper term is accumulator, not arrestor!

http://www.amazon.com/SHURflo-182-20.../dp/B000N9VF6Q

As I posted on the 20-footer thread I am trying to get around to this work with some new dampening material TBD, but it has been raining and snowing with another frost warning for tonight. Just like Ireland here today!

Sparky

Peter, thanks.


Sun for 3 days, rain today and suns for another 4 projected. Hard to split the time between the springtime garden & yard chores and the AS mods.
Bud break and travel plans are both imminent.

I may be off track, but I think of the accumulator tank the the arrestor, as serving slightly different functions? I think of the tank as smoothing out the supply side demands-short cycling ( and to a lessor degree the hammer) & associated with a open faucet/shower head and the arrestor to deal primarily with hammer and hopefully my shudder. We're not big time boondockers and need to deal with intermittent use (washing hands and the toilet) during an over night boondock.

You mounted your tank in the pump room...correct? and some (20's) have mounted vertically on the wall outside the pump room (in storage).

BTW great find on the bonded logic spec. Sounds very promising. I'll await the results.

Bob

[CruizinDux]

oooops, here is the arrestor. Using a brass T and probably a nipple, I'll slip this between the flex to pex connection just inside the rear storage, downstream of the pump. Phase 2 if needed, SS flex and maybe the tank.

Bob