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Old 11-18-2009, 07:38 AM   #1
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CPVC Question

I have a question. Has anyone tried
using 1/2" CPVC instead of PEX to
replace the original copper water lines.
CPVC is the "hot water variety" and has
some good properties. It could be used
on both hot and cold lines.

Question: Has it been tried?
Question: What do you think?
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Old 11-18-2009, 09:52 AM   #2
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I have regular white Schedule 40 pvc on all my clean water plumbing with no issues. It in fact is very easy to work with. I didn't install it, but have made a change or two and it is easy peasy. the CPVC shouldn't be any different. I've plumbed with that as well, just not in a camper.
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Old 11-18-2009, 10:50 AM   #3
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Never used it in the TT, but we have used in in some of our industrial darkroom trailers and it worked well for us. It's certainly cheaper and easier to work with than copper.

I suppose that if I was patching something together I might use it. But if I was re-plumbing a whole trailer I'd probable go with pex.

Just my thoughts,

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Old 11-18-2009, 11:25 AM   #4
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Follow up question:

What are the cost/benefit/performance
advantages to using PEX over CPVC.
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Old 11-18-2009, 12:40 PM   #5
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I replumbed my Safari completely with CPVC after gutting it. It went in quick and easy. One of the things I like about it is that it is more rigid than pex and was easy to slope all lines to the drains without low spots. I have only to open two valves and the trailer is 98% free of water. I have to drain the flexible shower hose separately and put a little antifreeze in the traps to winterize. I experienced no leaks after installation and have tested the entire system to 75 PSI. The pipe and fittings are readily available and reasonably priced. I would recommend it.
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Old 11-18-2009, 12:48 PM   #6
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CPVC should work ok,but if you need to use bug spray,make sure it is water based.CPVC will deteriorate when exposed to any kind of petro. products.
PVC should never be used for hot water use,if you use it long enough,you will find out why. Dave
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Old 11-18-2009, 01:01 PM   #7
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I am very glad about this thread. After I got my 71 Overlander, I made some quick repairs to the water lines with CPVC so we could have water in the trailer. This winter, I was going to totally remove all of the water lines (both copper and the CPVC) and go with PEX. I was not looking forward to it since I did not know much about PEX and where I live it is hard to find, both the hose and the connectors, let alone trying to find the tools needed. I think I might just go the CPVC route for everything, if the majority agrees it is ok.
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Old 11-18-2009, 01:41 PM   #8
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I would avoid CPVC. I think it's less resist to brittle fracture at cold temperatures than pex.

. . . but my trailer sits outside all winter in Minnesota.

Also, I think the little critters like to gnaw on CPVC more than pex.
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Old 11-18-2009, 04:09 PM   #9
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Cpvc

Airstream produced trailers for two years, as I understand it, with CPVC. I own a 1997 34FK Excella 1000 and it came from the factory with both cold and hot lines made of CPVC
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Old 11-18-2009, 04:31 PM   #10
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I replace all plumbing in a small home with CPVC on both hot & cold side several years ago and have had no problems I would not hesitate to use it in the AS.
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Old 11-18-2009, 06:50 PM   #11
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My house is plumbed with CPVC, it replaced the grey Polly-B stuff that had all the problems. My trailer is PEX. With CPVC and PVC you have very little flex and all connections have to very close with the angle going to the connections. PEX is very flexible and you only need to be close.
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Old 11-18-2009, 06:57 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by decanada View Post
Airstream produced trailers for two years, as I understand it, with CPVC.
Then they stopped? What do they use now?
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Old 11-18-2009, 07:13 PM   #13
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My house is done entirely with 3/4" CPVC but it is not going down the road (at least I hope not lol). I was just wondering how it would stand up to the vibration in the TT.
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Old 11-18-2009, 07:37 PM   #14
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PVC and presumably CPVC are said to release small quantities of chemicals into the water that are endocrine disrupters, especially affecting men and boys. Research on this has been going on for some time, but it rarely heard about in the US. I have done a whole house in CPVC without any plumbing problems (and am still a man), but didn't know any of this years ago. It seems that years after a plastic is on the market, many of them are shown to have problems.

If I were going to do it again, I would look at other products. I have no idea about PEX and whether there have been problems affecting people with it.

All the pipes in our water company are PVC. This doesn't make me feel good, but the worst effects are said to be on the youngest and I'm not one of them.

I imagine Airstream uses PEX because it is labor saving and bends around things in the cramped spaces available.

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Old 11-18-2009, 08:00 PM   #15
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Interesting comparison to copper:

CPVC vs. Copper Plumbing | Builders WebsourceŽ

For this link - go to the home page and then publications - read to your hearts desire.

CPVC Products

And there's this:


Let us consider some of the pro's & Con's of all the code approved materials for potable water distribution.

GALVANIZED IRON PIPE:
Pro's-
1.proven service life of 60-100 years.
2.Highly resistant to external mechanical shock.(Something hitting the pipe).
3.Not effected by exposure to UV light.
CON's-
1.Expensive,
2.Very labor intensive to install.
3.Requires expensive tools to install it, I.E. Pipe wrenches ($25 to $150 each for a quality wrench), pipe cutter($30+) NPT(National Pipe Taper) threading dies (hand die sets $150 to $450+) portable pipe vise($150) or equivalent. Generally these tools can be rented.)
4.Although rare, it can be ruptured by freezing.
5.Has a high suceptabilty to internal pipe wall mineral scaling.
BRASS PIPE:
Pro's-
1.Perhaps the longest service life of all the options.
2.Highly resistant to external mechanical shock.(Something hitting the pipe).
3.Not effected by exposure to UV light.
Con's-
1. Very limited availability,
2.Extemely expensive,
3.Very labor intensive to install. (Requires the same tools as galv. iron pipe).
4.Although rare, it can be ruptured by freezing.
Brass and galvanized pipe are very unforgiving mediums to work with and would not be recommended as a DIY project.
COPPER PIPE:
Pro's:
1.Under most conditions and when properly installed copper has a proven service life of 50 to 75+ years.(AS copper ages it forms a greenish film on the inner wall of the pipe which is coppersulfate, one of the best antibacterial substances known to man thus copper has the highest resistance to the formation of bacterial or microbial growths in the water supply.)
2.Does not form mineral scale on the inner pipe walls.
3.High resistance to mechanical shock.
4.Quick and easy to install with a minimum of tools (tubing cutter, propane torch, emery cloth, flux and lead free solder(total cost for all $50 average). Requires wrought copper fittings and brazed joints when run under a slab within the confines of a structure. Can be brazed with the same torch using MAPP gas. Is considered an easy DIY project for a homeowner or DIY'er with intermediate skills.
Is not effected by UV light.
CONS:
1.Moderately expensive
2.Under some extemely rare water qualtiy conditions copper pipe may develope pin holes. (In my personal opinion if there is a condition in the water that will eat up your pipes I have to wonder what those conditions do to your body? Would it not be more prudent to invest in a water treatment system instead of shopping for a pipe that might be more tolerant of the problem?)
3.Pipe walls will rupture when frozen.
4.HIgh incidence of theft both of the raw material during construction and from breakins when a home is unattended.
PEX:
Pro's:
1. Can be economical. Currently the linear foot cost is about 1/3 that of copper however, when run in the modern manifold configuration we use so many more linear feet that often the final cost is more than copper.
2.Expected service life in excess of 75 years.
3.Easy to install, can be fished through walls like electrical cable.
4.Easily bends around corners.
5.PEX tubing will withstand freezing.
CON's
1.Not yet code accepted in all places.
2.Requires expensive fittings.
3.Requires the fittings be set with expensive crimping tools.
4.While the tubing will withstand freezing the fittings are made of copper and are subject to the same freezing problems as copper.
5.While it is argued that PEX is the material of choice in areas with acidic water it must be remembered that all PEX fittings are made of the same grade of copper as copper pipe and they are also subject to pinholes.
6.Exposure to UV light(sunlight) deteriates PEX tubing and it must be shielded from direct exposure.
7.For reasons known only to the varmints involved, rabbits, mice, rats and opposums have a high propensity to chew on PEX tubing.
8.Biofilm has the highest rate of growth in PEX tubing when installed in a manifold configuration. (Biofilm is known to cause a number of diseases among which is legionaires disease.)
CPVC
Pro's:
1.Cheapest of all approved potable water piping materials.
2.Easy to install, requires only a PVC pipe cutter or a hacksaw to cut.
3.Very easy to join. Requires only a means to cut the pipe (hacksaw or hand PVC snap cutter the prime and glue. (The primer and glue must be listed as approved for CPVC under ASTM standard F493).
4.Has no copper components in the distribution system and will tolerate high acidic water conditions. PVC glue is manufactured to ASTM standard D2855 and may not be used on PVC however there are glues available that are listed as approved for both PVC & CPVC-check the labels carefully. Con's
1.Will not tolerate mechanical shock.
2.Becomes brittle with age or exposure to UV light.
3.Maximum working temperature 140degF.
4.Has the lowest resistance to freezing of all pipe materials.
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Old 11-19-2009, 08:53 AM   #16
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Cpvc-pex

Never cut Cpvc with a hacksaw,those little pieces can plug up shower valve and faucets.
Our pex fittings are brass ,they quit using copper fittings here several years ago. Dave
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Old 11-19-2009, 09:10 AM   #17
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cpvc

I have a 1997 Excella 1000 30' that is plumbed with cpvc. So far no problems.
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Old 11-19-2009, 09:12 AM   #18
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After cutting with a hacksaw I would highly recommend one of these:
Plastic Pipe Deburring Tool | U.S. Plastic Corp.
In addition to removing the burrs and shavings it also helps seat the pip into fittings completely.

If I don't have mine handy I just go around with my knife.
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Old 11-19-2009, 09:48 AM   #19
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Thanks for all the answers and feedback.

What do they use on new Airstream trailers
currently in production?
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Old 11-20-2009, 05:45 AM   #20
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Sandpaper will also clean out the burrs in plastic pipe. I've used a knife but it can cause more burrs if it catches on the plastic.

I think Pex has been used on Airstreams for a while.

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