Radius'ing' & WeatherProofing an Awning

[MTnestRobin]

An inquiring mind would like to know if anyone else has had experience with a "radiused" awning. "Radiused" being my term for an awning installed past the flat expanse of the trailer onto the curved areas of the end caps (and btw, I'm talking about the traditional rope and pole type).

Our 18' Int'l Globetrotter has a twelve foot wide awning rail. For some reason a PO cut the rail at the beginning of the curve and moved it diagonally downward. We aren't sure why but guess, #1 maybe to shed rain better, or #2 a replacement awning with a straight cut wouldn't make the curve. Could radiusing it have created a sagging or stress issues in the previous design (I have nothing to go by).

I am making a 9x12 canvas awning for it (already half done) and patterning it after Arlen and Shirley Manning's. I am curving the canvas back to fit the original placement of the rail. Right now I am at a point where I can still make it straight or shorten it and would appreciate some feedback before I put more work into it (putting all that heavy fabric through my old Kenmore is no easy task).

In addition I would like to the paint stripes onto it. I know that some (like Manning's) where painted years ago but a thread search didn't produce any current info on it. Any of you do this before? And what of making it leak proof? Do I just wet it and swell the fibers and that will do it? Should I coat it with a silicone rain protectant, or do both? Paint it before, after, or not at all !

Sorry about all the questions, and probably should have run this through the forum before I started cuttting too!

[InsideOut]

First off...I'm not so sure a PO cut the awning rail, it might have come that way. Is this what you are describing? (from photo archives)





I don't know what kind of awning went on that, but I have see others with the same detail.

About the Manning's awning...I recently purchased one on ebay (actually from the Mannings) for our '56 Safari just like their GlobeTrotter's. It has a rigid three-sided frame that actually attaches into the rail slot that's on the trailer and doesn't need rope supports. Here are a couple of pictures of the frame (from the Manning's website) without the fabric awning part. The second one shows the part that goes into the rail.



I would be concerned about the lengths of the side frame(s) working with the angled back part. I seems to me you would need longer frame pole(s) to accommodate the angled back part &/or there would have to be a twist (or angle?) to the poles to get them in the rail slot because the front frame is straight and the back that attaches to the trailer is angled. Do you have the frame part? Or are you making an awning that is more just the pole & rope type without the frame - like that on our GlobeTrotter below?



With regards to painting the awning, ours is a really heavy oil canvas that is painted with a kind of plasticized or oil-based paint. The underside is a solid color and also visibly coated with something. Whereas our modern pole & rope awning is a woven pattern Sunbrella fabric.

Bottom line...I would keep it simple. In order of simplicity from my pPOV:

1) I would only use the straight part of the rail with a pole & rope awning giving up the 1-2 feet in width - especially if you don't have the frame.
2) Go with a pole & rope awning and keep the angled awning rail and the extra 1-2 feet of awning and get extra credit for originality.
3) Assuming you have the frame, use it only on the straight part of the rail
4) If you are sure the frame will work with the angles, go for it!

Shari

[MTnestRobin]

Thank you Shari for your input!

I think my railing was originally just as your picture shows. Since then the outermost edges have definitely been moved down by at least four inches for whatever reason, because I can see the original rivet/screw holes. I will be moving the rail back to its original location because I like straightness.

I thought about only using the flat eight foot section. But the rail ends just to right of the door and I don't want water dripping so close to it. Since we live in the Northeast, rain is very much a part of our camping experience so I'd like to have that extra thirty some square feet too.

I had poor luck looking for a frame like Manning's. So, for the frame we are using parts from a screen house that we have reworked. The poles will be in pockets with an end seam (reinforced and padded) that butts against the trailer. It won't have the same strenght and rigidity as the original type but may be firmer than just the ropes and pole, especially since it will be 12 feet wide. By tomorrow I should have enough done to put it into the rail. I'll be able to tell then if its worth finishing it up at that width, otherwise I'll cut it down leaving at least a foot extra on the right side... hopefully.

After reading your post I'm not sure what to do about the painting. For now I think I'll give it a good soaking and roll it up for a night (read this in a thread somewhere in this forum) to allow the fibers to swell. Then I'll give it a day or two to dry out and retest it with the hose. If it leaks I'll have to consider a waterproofing treatment. Before of after painting it I don't know yet. BTW, does your canvas one have unpainted areas or is it entirely coated with paint?

All this seems like a lot of work but I don't mind the actual sewing it up as much as I do the "thinking it through" part. There is where the brain cramp comes in...trying to think of everything...straps to tie it up with, yes or no with grommets, etc. If I hadn't had 10 yards of canvas sitting around and the sewing skills I'd still have to use an ugly tarp until I could get a commercial awning made (and that none too soon with all the other pressing needs it has).

Shari, some time when you have your framed awning up, can you get a better picture of the end that goes into the rail? I can't seem to visualize this. Does the end slide in the same as the rope does, in a different rail??

Thanks again for the good advice!

[InsideOut]

I actually haven't even put our frame awning up yet! We are in the midst of a total restoration (see post #101 for our awning) and the trailer can't be moved to a place where I can put it up until it's back together somewhat. Right now, all the interior skins are out and it's got the awning side of the trailer up against our fence with no room to spread out. The poles are just waiting in a box in the garage...I could get to them, but not put them in place.

Shari

[MTnestRobin]

I thought I'd post "the end" of the story so this thread is not left hanging.

I did finish sewing up my awning with the outer edges radiused back to the extended awning rail (on the curved areas). I made it with straps and 'D' rings so it can be rolled up and secured while in the rail.



Also the awning was sewn with pockets to support poles to keep it rigid and be free standing. We were not able to find spring tension poles, so we improvised using old screen tent poles that my husband fitted with springs. These three poles fit into the pockets and run from the front of the awning back to the awning rail. Using 'L' and 'T' fittings also from the screen tent we ran another pole across the entire front side to side in a pocket as well. It has worked reasonably well. I would make a few changes were I to do it again. My pockets are too tight! Without duct taping the joints of the tension poles we can't get them out easily when the awning is wet.

I went on to paint stripes onto my canvas using house paint. I then applied a silicone waterproofing spray which has worked fine.

Here is a picture of it in use at the Birthday Bash, guyed down because it was windy up on that hill!

In the two years I have used this, I have learned a couple lessons the hard way! The waterproofing worked so well, collected rain water collapsed and bent my poles one rainy night. I didn't know then to lower a corner in the event of rain, but I do now!

Wind is still my biggest problem! I have had some crazy rides in my airstream without ever being hitched to the TV! In windy situations, ideally, I would like to pull out the three tension poles and roll the awning up to the rail and fasten it there. However, because my pockets are so tight (and usually wet), I cannot get the tension poles out! Therefore I'm left with no choice but to pull the whole awning, and typically in a rush! At some point I have to solve this problem, either by doing the pockets over or changing out the poles.

Overall, I am very pleased with my awning! It is a huge 12 x 9! Certainly the price was right! Because I had rope and 10yds of canvas sitting around I only had to spring for the 2 pints of paint and waterproof spray, oh... and plenty of heavy duty thread! As mentioned above the pole system was from an old screen tent (the kind that you throw up OVER a pole set-up) so there was no expense there, except for the springs Mick slid inside the poles.

I'd like to eventually replace the pole system with something designed for the job. So, if anyone wants to sell their oringinal free standing pole system like this one, Awning, or know of one, I'd be interested!

Shari- A special thank you for your sage advice. You always have good insight and bring up good points to consider in any project.