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Rog0525 · 03-22-2004, 12:47 PM

If a guy does a good job of removing the clearcoat, is the sanding really necessary? I'm aware that a really fine grade of sandpaper isn't much coarser than a polishing cloth but I just can't get past the notion that sandpaper or pads will scratch up the skin on my Caravel.
I'm still waiting for a warm weekend here in Mich for the polishing if it ever comes.
Has anyone tried polishing with SS w/o sanding or am I just worrying needlessly?

Rog

smily · 03-22-2004, 01:07 PM

All polishing is performed by some sort of abrasion.

Even Fiber Optic glass is polished to a degree of perfection, (without blemish) with a "sanding paper".
It is very fine but an abrasive never the less.

Body shops polish out scratches by wet sanding with a very fine grit sand paper.

So, it is okay to sand, just be aware of the grit you utilize.

Start with a very fine abrasive and if that does not "cut" it, get a coarser grit and prepare for the long haul.

Smily

Rog0525 · 03-22-2004, 01:45 PM

TY smily, fine like in how fine? 1,000 grit?

ROG

Safari Tim · 03-22-2004, 01:55 PM

The perfectpolish.com website actually recommended against sanding. Their testing showed it actually embeded materials into the aluminum that could not be removed w/o an acid wash.

If the SS is not course enough to get you started, perhaps you could find something more suitable for the first stage and use the SS for the second step.

Good luck. It sure makes a huge difference when you get that mirror shine!

Ken J · 03-22-2004, 02:03 PM

I've never sanded........

Compound should be all you need - the only time I would consider sanding is it I've got a scratch that I'm trying to remove - even then I would sure think about it - that alcad is pretty thin

Ken

Rog0525 · 03-22-2004, 02:24 PM

I'll try a small area w/o sanding and see how it looks.
Since a Cyclo polisher is not within my budget right now, I bought a 5" Black and Decker random orbital polisher for $30.
I've discovered that cotton crew socks fit nicely over the pad and are far cheaper than Cyclowraps. I'm hoping that the end will justify the means. I'll post pics when finished.

Rog

Ken J · 03-22-2004, 03:40 PM

The socks will leave swirl marks, which eventually seem to fade - should give you an idea of whats involved though..

Ken J.

startrekker2001 · 03-22-2004, 05:24 PM

Rog,
I have polished my 31' Excella. After I stripped it with Aircraft Stripper by Klean Strip, there was really no reason to sand. I used a cyclo polisher and various levels of Nuvite polish from www.perfectpolish.com . Got my cyclo from them too.

Do the compounding with Nuvite 'C' or equivalent and use a low speed circular buffer and wool bonnets. Have many bonnets that you can wash and reuse until they wear out, then get more.

Using socks will probably not work since they are thinner material and you will need hundreds of them. The polishing is a very, very messy job.

Once compounding is done, the polishing must be done with an orbital polisher. The cyclo is the best. The first polishing will take about 200 hours of work and a new set of arms and shoulders would help.

Read everything on perfectpolish.com. There is no better source for info.

I am having good luck on the second and successive polishings using Master Formula Metal Gloss from www.metalgloss.com put on and removed by hand using the cyclowrap material, then sealing with Nuvite 'S' using the cyclo to get the scratches out from using the metal gloss.

There are as many different ways of approaching the job as there are people who have done it.

That's my .02 cents. Good luck and God Bless.

Click on the photos icon to see my unit.

Vic

Ken J · 03-22-2004, 05:36 PM

Vic

Did you try Nuvite S by itself - its has a small amount of grit in it, so I seems like that would work for your once per year update.

Thats what I do, but the climate is very dry here.

Ken J.

startrekker2001 · 03-23-2004, 09:07 AM

Ken,
Yes, I have tried using just the 'S' and it doesn't have enough grit to take off the water drop and trickle stains. We are about 5 miles, as the pelican flies, from the Atlantic so we have a salt rich environment. That does a job on the finish and requires a little more effort. The Metal Gloss has some sort of chemical reaction that does a great job with very little effort.

The follow-on polishing with 'S' gives a really great shine. Not a 10 but a good 8.5.

Vic

smily · 03-23-2004, 10:42 AM

I guess it is just semantics but one thing is for certain ALL polishing compounds have a grit. Some are finer than others, hence the grades of Nuvite.

3M sells several grrades of Polishing compounds and they too have a grit.

A good Auto body repair person will tell you that they would not hesitate to hit any surface with a fine wet sanding paper maybe with a grit a high as 1500-2000.

I mentioned earlier that we use polishing paper, (aka sand paper, and the real technical term is Lapping Film), to polish glass for fiber optic connections in the networking and processing world. We use a paper that is measured in minute increments.
The glass is polished to a point that no scratches are visible under a 100 X microscope. You can literally polish scratches out of sunglasses and eyeglasses, as a matter of fact, prescription glasses are adjusted by "polishing" or sanding the lenses. The most sensitive observatories are equipped with mirrors that have been polished to perfection using SAND, (very very fine sand). Lets not lose sight of the abrasion factor that is intrinsic to plain ol' water. Water alone is abrasive.

Just wanted to clear up any questions on "sanding" on an aluminum Airstream. When you polish you sand.

There is a good write up at this thread on using wet sand technique.

http://www.airforums.com/forum...hlight=Sanding

Smily

airstreamcaravel · 03-23-2004, 11:35 AM

Rog,

I would not use SS alone for anything. I know this kind of comment has inflamed those who swear by SS.

Over the past year and multiple request by many poeple, Our community has yet to see any photos (before and after) of any A/S polished with sandpaper and SS alone.

I have used all three products (Rolite, Nuvite, and SS) and the
Perfect Polish and cyclo method (IMHO) is the only way to go.
Faster, easier, and cheaper, rarely means better.

The goal is to create microscopic scratches. Using a system of progressively finer grades of coarseness (Nuvite) is the way to go.

I have used fine grade sandpaper to remove deeper scratches,
but that is where I draw the line. Remember that the alclad is only so thick. Much thinner than my thick skull!!

DMC
"the shine king?"

Rog0525 · 03-23-2004, 11:53 AM

I know that you are in the AS polishing business, DMC, and I'm sure that your info is absolutely correct.
The thing is, I'm just an ordinary guy who has no plans to enter his AS in a beauty contest. I just want to shine it up real nicely without spending buku bucks and time on the process. I would like to spend more time enjoying my AS than I do in working on it.
By the way, my son-in-law is offering a cash reward for information leading to the arrest of the villain who raided his sock drawer.

Rog

Ken J · 03-23-2004, 11:53 AM

Ken

I may be using samantics myself, it depends on what you call this stuff we are all using. I call it polish and the Rollite final "polish" has no grit in it at all. In fact it took me a while to use the Nuvite S because it does contain some grit - but read somewhere that it was used on aircraft like 300 applications and it did not remove all the alcad. I'm not going to live 300 years as I use it once per year.

Also I'm still am not clear on this, but I understand that polish tends to "rearrage" the finish more than it cuts into it. Anyway whatever it does, I'm not going to worry about Nuvite removing all my alcad.

Ahh the finer points of us polishing addicts......

Ken

airstreamcaravel · 03-23-2004, 12:08 PM

The concern was not the Nuvite removing the alclad ... it was sandpaper removing alclad.

And I am just a regular guy ... I have done some polishing on the side ... but no way consider myself an authority or expert ... just someone who has sweated my way through a couple of trailers.

If I could do it full time ... I would .... with Nuvite and a Cyclo.

Dave

smily · 03-23-2004, 12:20 PM

From the sellers of Rolite:

"Rolite polishes produce their rare, mirror-like shines with extremely fine abrasives dispersed in an emulsion base. The soft, creamy texture spreads like butter, and comes off with no strenuous buffing."

It is safe to say that whenever a product makes references to Course, medium and fine, they are referring to the Grit, or "cut"

Check it out:
http://www.topoftheline.com/rolmetpolkit1.html

Smily

airstreamcaravel · 03-23-2004, 12:28 PM

A link to a previous poll ... Maybe we need to update the selections alittle.

Still waiting for those before and after pics from you SS fans!!

Click HERE

Dave

smily · 03-23-2004, 12:40 PM

Mind you, I am by no means an advocate of SS. I sometimes wonder about where ol' TrailerTrash disappeared to and what ever happened to the people that got short changed on the product. But here is the before and after photos:

http://www.airforums.com/forum...s&pagenumber=1

Smily

airstreamcaravel · 03-23-2004, 12:47 PM

Pictures taken at night ... in the shade ... or small areas done by hand ... Do not make me a believer.

Remember ... I have used SS ... and would consider it an ancillary
product ... In addition to more traditional ... proven methods.

I didn't know the people were "Short changed" on SS. Sounds
like there is an undiclosed story there. Wanna share it with us??

Dave

smily · 03-23-2004, 01:02 PM

Hm, I thought I seen a full view of a polished trailer in a daytime shot in that thread, It was very swirly looking

But, as for the story, maybe it was resolved, ( I hope it was anyway).

I actually thought there was more than one instance but this is all I could find,
See it here:

http://www.airforums.com/forum...southern+shine

Smily