Trailer Brakes - Drum to disk upgrade

[safarinight]

My wife and I are considering upgrading our 04 Safari's brakes from drum to disk next year, so we would like to hear from anyone that has already upgraded, or thinking of upgrading.

Thanks.

Terry

[Dwight]

Terry, it is worth the effort to convert to disc. I only know of 2 places to have it performed correctly, the factory and Roger Williams Airstream. Call and talk to Robert Haberzettle or David Tidmore at Roger Williams Airstream and they can tell you more about cost. Their number is 817-569-0050.

[Mrcrowley]

Originally Posted by Dwight

Terry, it is worth the effort to convert to disc. I only know of 2 places to have it performed correctly, the factory and Roger Williams Airstream. Call and talk to Robert Haberzettle or David Tidmore at Roger Williams Airstream and they can tell you more about cost. Their number is 817-569-0050.

They make Electric Disk brakes....?

[CanoeStream]

Originally Posted by Mrcrowley

They make Electric Disk brakes....?

The signal is sent thru the umbilical electrically. A hydraulic actuator is put into the Airstream as part of the conversion. A number of the available systems are incompatible with brake controllers. The Kodiak system that Airstream uses is about the only one to use. Search the forums for a number of good discussions. Terry would use the factory of course. I fully concur with what I've heard about David Tidmore!

[safarinight]

Airstream Life's Summer 2006 issue has an article on page 66 titled "Disk Versus Drums". This article is the motivation behind our decision to convert. We know people have been towing much larger trailers then our 25' safari without incident for years, but the idea of going through the mountains with the possibility of loosing the trailer breaks due to overheating is un-nerving, and we are planning trips to the coast that will require us to be prepared.

The plan is to drop the Safari off at the factory next year before the camping season starts. Since the Kodiak hydraulic actuator needs to be mounted inside the trailer we decided to give up the compartment next to the water heater. This would give us curb side access to keep an eye on it.

My question to the forums is how much different are the disk from the drums when stopping? Has anyone already had the conversion done?

Thanks everyone for the feedback.

Terry

[hookedonclassic]

Terry: Send a PM to Bilouie as he just had his done at the factory on a 93 excella and likes the results.

[Safari Tim]

Mind if I jump in here?

I'm having new axles put on with disc brakes. However, I will have to install the hydrolic pump and brake lines.

I've not done any reasearch yet on this part. Any pointers?

Can you get pre-made brake lines to keep me from having to cut and flair them?

[uwe]

Originally Posted by safarinight

My question to the forums is how much different are the disk from the drums when stopping? Has anyone already had the conversion done?

Thanks everyone for the feedback.

Terry

Terry,

The difference is quite staggering. Both systems will stop a trailer, but the discs are much smoother, and substantially more powerful. The trailer can stop the entire rig, repeatedly, on steep down grades. I tried...
Having had a 25ft TradewWind, and having nearly lost it's brakes while descending Wolf Creek pass in CO, I vowed to find a better system than the electic trailer brakes. My research showed that the most capable system to fit my 1963 Overlander's new torsion axles was the Dexter disc brake setup with Dexter's own actuator. Some prefer the Kodiak, because Airstream uses it oem. I just liked the Dexter equipment better due to it's fixed 4-piston caliper design, over the Kodiac's single piston floating caliper design. I prefer the Dexter actuator for it's lightning fast response time, and it works with most common brake controllers. The brake performance is nothing short of spectacular.
A positive side effect of the disc brake setup is the fact that inherently, the discs have a much better rotational balance then trailer brake drums, making the trailer ride smoother at highway speeds.
A disadvantage is the fact that hydraulic systems need maintenance, the brake fluid should be flushed every two years at a minimum.

[uwe]

Originally Posted by Safari Tim

Mind if I jump in here?

I'm having new axles put on with disc brakes. However, I will have to install the hydrolic pump and brake lines.

I've not done any reasearch yet on this part. Any pointers?

Can you get pre-made brake lines to keep me from having to cut and flair them?

Tim,

Well stocked auto parts stores will have brake lines in varying lengths. If you need elp, let me know, I have a double flaring tool. It is easy to do once you remember to put the compression nut on before making the flare.

[thecatsandi]

Uwe,
All that stopping power is exactly why I like mine. I have about 16,000lbs of stopping power in the trailer and about 11,000lbs in the truck. a total of 27,000 lbs. Currently My truck and trailer weight about 16,000lbs combined.
Lots of reserve. It will stop fast. I have suprised a few following me.

[the ponz]

for those that have had the discs installed, what was the cost to convert from drums?

[safarinight]

Originally Posted by uwe

Terry,

The difference is quite staggering. Both systems will stop a trailer, but the discs are much smoother, and substantially more powerful. The trailer can stop the entire rig, repeatedly, on steep down grades. I tried...
Having had a 25ft TradewWind, and having nearly lost it's brakes while descending Wolf Creek pass in CO, I vowed to find a better system than the electic trailer brakes. My research showed that the most capable system to fit my 1963 Overlander's new torsion axles was the Dexter disc brake setup with Dexter's own actuator. Some prefer the Kodiak, because Airstream uses it oem. I just liked the Dexter equipment better due to it's fixed 4-piston caliper design, over the Kodiac's single piston floating caliper design. I prefer the Dexter actuator for it's lightning fast response time, and it works with most common brake controllers. The brake performance is nothing short of spectacular.
A positive side effect of the disc brake setup is the fact that inherently, the discs have a much better rotational balance then trailer brake drums, making the trailer ride smoother at highway speeds.
A disadvantage is the fact that hydraulic systems need maintenance, the brake fluid should be flushed every two years at a minimum.

Uwe - Your Wolf Creek pass experience is exactly what I'm trying to avoid. The ability to stop the TV with trailer brakes is something I had not considered so thanks for the pointer.

I like the Airstream installed system because it uses GM automotive calipers. Using off the shelf GM parts solves the parts availability issue, and ensures a multitude of choices and prices when replacement pads are needed.

Terry

[Inland RV Center, In]

Originally Posted by the ponz

for those that have had the discs installed, what was the cost to convert from drums?

The cost depends on who will do the job.

If you do it, that's one thing. If you have a dealer do it, the door is wide open depending on their experience.

Andy

[Inland RV Center, In]

Originally Posted by Safari Tim

Mind if I jump in here?

I'm having new axles put on with disc brakes. However, I will have to install the hydrolic pump and brake lines.

I've not done any reasearch yet on this part. Any pointers?

Can you get pre-made brake lines to keep me from having to cut and flair them?

We sell "complete kits," that are all inclusive including complete instructions.

http://www.inlandrv.com/parts/86200-...-brake-kit.jpg

Most suppliers sell just the disc brakes. You have to chase the rest of the parts.


Andy

[ljmiii]

Originally Posted by safarinight

My wife and I are considering upgrading our 04 Safari's brakes from drum to disk next year, so we would like to hear from anyone that has already upgraded, or thinking of upgrading.

I had Airstream upgrade my 2006 16' Bambi from drums to discs earlier this year. They installed the Actibrake/Kodiak combination they use on their other trailers. I found them to be very helpful and quite responsive to inquiries via email - they charged $1710.00.

The disc brakes have amazing stopping power compared to the drums. However, I have had a few issues. One, the Actibrake does introduce a 1/2 sec delay. Two, the actibrake does need to be calibrated to your tow vehicle & controller. And three, the actibrake draws directly from the DC current. I'm currently debugging a problem where my Prodigy thinks the actibrake has 'gone away' after a few minutes of driving without braking (ie shows .NC. or . . instead of .C.) if I tow with my airstream's power set to use instead of store. I think this is because when my refer is set to DC it draws too much power and is competing for amps with the actibrake...but as I said I am still debugging.

[Phil Gobie]

The main reason the disc work better is the hydraulic system. When the brakes have the same hydraulic pressure to each caliper you have a much better chance of getting equal pressure or not locking one wheel before the others. This means you will be able to achieve maximum breaking with out lock up. Not to mention the better balance of the disc.
Make sure the brake controller is compatible with the electric/hydraulic pump that you end up with. They are not all compatible. Some have a setting to remedy some of the delay. Also as for the person experiencing a delay be sure the system is bled correctly or this will also cause delay and can contribute to the brakes dragging.

You will find the difference is night and day!

[JimGolden]

Check out Towbrake's electric over hydraulic unit. Some excellent engineering in this unit. It's not a pump, but rather a large servo motor (linear actuator) hooked to a normal automotive master cylinder. I think it has a lot going for it.



Tow Brake Product 2

[fred bartlet]

I just finished a two axle disc brake conversion on my 30' trailer. I used the Kodiak/Actibrake from Inland Trailer. The only problem I encountered was the backing plate for the disc brakes did not match up the the axle, as I used the 10-2 recommended positioning. I e-mailed Kodiak but with no reply, I just matched up the 4 holes to axle and marked the missing hole, then drilled the backing plate. Cast iron is easy to drill if you have a drill press. If you hand drill, use a center punch and drill into a soft backing.

I did not follow the hyd. line layout of the kit, but I made a trip to the dealer to see how AS does it OEM. In stead of the H layout, which I'm not sure it will work on the swing axles, I used the Y layout. I installed the Actibrake in the front tool box and ran the brake line back to the center line of the coach belly. Then I teed off to both sides, in front of the wheel wells and followed it back to each wheel. Hence, the Y pattern.

It was a tight fit to thread the flex lines behind the shocks but I added sprial rap to prevent chaffing the flex line. I had to add several new line lengths to the hyd. lines, but they are cheap at any auto store. Before one tries this project, be sure to get a brake line bending tool and some brake line wrenches. For layout of lines use lengths longer than required and bend a Z into the lines to takes up the extra length.

I've only towed once and the results are great. I also have the Prodgy controller that showes an open circuit when towing but it seams to work when used. ???? Cost, about $1,800 with tools and four days of labor.

PS I will not miss the ol-mechanical electric brake maintenace!!!!

[bobkelly]

The price for a two axle conversion at the AS factory in Jackson Center was in the $2500 range about a year ago.

[Goin camping]

Does anyone know if either system works with Fords intergrated tow command system?