Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
 


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 01-20-2012, 10:57 PM   #1
Rivet Master
 
Zeppelinium's Avatar

 
1973 23' Safari
1977 23' Safari
2018 25' Flying Cloud
Palmer Lake , Colorado
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,092
Send a message via Skype™ to Zeppelinium
Salvaging Vintage Disk Brakes

Can vintage Ausco disk brakes be salvaged for use on a new Dexter axle?

Note: I am writing this for myself so that I check out all the variables. You might want to wait for a later post when I actually have answers...

The Dexter #10 axle can be fabricated to carry 2300 to 3500 lbs. This is the axle for almost all Airstreams (does yours weigh more than 7,000 lbs., or for single axle, more than 3,500 lbs?). The Dexter catalog provides drums/disks for a 15" wheel with 6x5.5" stud pattern for this axle. So far so good.

The Ausco disk mounting bracket has a 5-hole pattern. The Dexter catalog shows the Kodiak brake as their 3,500# disk brake. The mounting bracket for this brake caliper is 4-hole and the standard Kodiak disk for this weight class is drilled for a 5-lug drum. So the Ausco brake will not mount on this axle, nor will the standard 6-lug Airsteam wheel. So there is at least one issue--will Dexter provide their #10 axle with a 5-hole brake mounting plate? A second potential issue is--will Kodiak provide a 5-hole mounting plate for their 3,500#/10 inch disk caliper?

Why? Because if the Ausco calipers can't be refurbished or if they fail some few years down the road and Ausco parts are no longer available, or if the unobtainium Ausco disk itself is damaged, can the Ausco system be swapped out for Kodiak, or do you need a whole new axle?

Another question is--are the spindle diameters correct. The 3,500# Kodiak is designed for spindle #84 (1.72" diameter at the seal). I'm assuming from the catalog drawings that this spindle comes with a 4-hole mounting plate for the brake bracket. If you go to the next higher weight class Kodiak brake (6,000#), it fits spindle #42, which is 2.25" at the seal and appears to have a 5-hole mounting plate.

The photos show the Ausco disk brake installed and the Kodiak 4-hole mounting plate (Ausco 5-hole in background).

Click image for larger version

Name:	P1000743 Ausco disk-s.jpg
Views:	400
Size:	111.5 KB
ID:	149288 Click image for larger version

Name:	P1000751 kodiak 4-hole-s.jpg
Views:	313
Size:	114.6 KB
ID:	149289

Questions:
1. Is the spindle size for the Ausco disk the same as the 10" (3,500# class) Kodiak disk?
2. Can I get this spindle on a #10 Dexter axle?
3. Is the 5-hole mounting plate available on the #10 Dexter axle?
4. Are the parts for the Ausco brake still available (pads, seal, and dust boot)?

Zep
__________________
Zep@Charmedquark.net
Zeppelinium is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2012, 02:58 AM   #2
Rivet Master
Airstream Dealer
 
Inland RV Center, In's Avatar
 
Corona , California
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,497
Images: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeppelinium View Post
Can vintage Ausco disk brakes be salvaged for use on a new Dexter axle?

Note: I am writing this for myself so that I check out all the variables. You might want to wait for a later post when I actually have answers...

The Dexter #10 axle can be fabricated to carry 2300 to 3500 lbs. This is the axle for almost all Airstreams (does yours weigh more than 7,000 lbs., or for single axle, more than 3,500 lbs?). The Dexter catalog provides drums/disks for a 15" wheel with 6x5.5" stud pattern for this axle. So far so good.

The Ausco disk mounting bracket has a 5-hole pattern. The Dexter catalog shows the Kodiak brake as their 3,500# disk brake. The mounting bracket for this brake caliper is 4-hole and the standard Kodiak disk for this weight class is drilled for a 5-lug drum. So the Ausco brake will not mount on this axle, nor will the standard 6-lug Airsteam wheel. So there is at least one issue--will Dexter provide their #10 axle with a 5-hole brake mounting plate? A second potential issue is--will Kodiak provide a 5-hole mounting plate for their 3,500#/10 inch disk caliper?

Why? Because if the Ausco calipers can't be refurbished or if they fail some few years down the road and Ausco parts are no longer available, or if the unobtainium Ausco disk itself is damaged, can the Ausco system be swapped out for Kodiak, or do you need a whole new axle?

Another question is--are the spindle diameters correct. The 3,500# Kodiak is designed for spindle #84 (1.72" diameter at the seal). I'm assuming from the catalog drawings that this spindle comes with a 4-hole mounting plate for the brake bracket. If you go to the next higher weight class Kodiak brake (6,000#), it fits spindle #42, which is 2.25" at the seal and appears to have a 5-hole mounting plate.

The photos show the Ausco disk brake installed and the Kodiak 4-hole mounting plate (Ausco 5-hole in background).

Attachment 149288 Attachment 149289

Questions:
1. Is the spindle size for the Ausco disk the same as the 10" (3,500# class) Kodiak disk?
2. Can I get this spindle on a #10 Dexter axle?
3. Is the 5-hole mounting plate available on the #10 Dexter axle?
4. Are the parts for the Ausco brake still available (pads, seal, and dust boot)?

Zep
Some oiginal Ausco parts are still available, for the calipers.

Andy
__________________
Andy Rogozinski
Inland RV Center
Corona, CA
Inland RV Center, In is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2012, 05:40 AM   #3
Vintage Kin
 
Fort Worth , Texas
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,014
Images: 1
Good idea for a thread. I'd can 'em, though.
slowmover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2012, 07:03 AM   #4
Retired.
 
Currently Looking...
. , At Large
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 21,276
Roger, I've swapped the old discs out for new Kodiak ones on a '77 Sovereign. I was even able to re-use the old metal lines. I put the Dexter actuator under the cover the old vacuum actuator was in.
__________________
Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy, and taste good with ketchup.
Terry
overlander63 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2012, 08:05 AM   #5
Rivet Master
Airstream Dealer
 
Inland RV Center, In's Avatar
 
Corona , California
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,497
Images: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeppelinium View Post
The Ausco disk mounting bracket has a 5-hole pattern. The Dexter catalog shows the Kodiak brake as their 3,500# disk brake. The mounting bracket for this brake caliper is 4-hole and the standard Kodiak disk for this weight class is drilled for a 5-lug drum. So the Ausco brake will not mount on this axle, nor will the standard 6-lug Airsteam wheel. So there is at least one issue--will Dexter provide their #10 axle with a 5-hole brake mounting plate? A second potential issue is--will Kodiak provide a 5-hole mounting plate for their 3,500#/10 inch disk caliper?

Why? Because if the Ausco calipers can't be refurbished or if they fail some few years down the road and Ausco parts are no longer available, or if the unobtainium Ausco disk itself is damaged, can the Ausco system be swapped out for Kodiak, or do you need a whole new axle?

Another question is--are the spindle diameters correct. The 3,500# Kodiak is designed for spindle #84 (1.72" diameter at the seal). I'm assuming from the catalog drawings that this spindle comes with a 4-hole mounting plate for the brake bracket. If you go to the next higher weight class Kodiak brake (6,000#), it fits spindle #42, which is 2.25" at the seal and appears to have a 5-hole mounting plate.

The photos show the Ausco disk brake installed and the Kodiak 4-hole mounting plate (Ausco 5-hole in background).


Questions:
1. Is the spindle size for the Ausco disk the same as the 10" (3,500# class) Kodiak disk?
2. Can I get this spindle on a #10 Dexter axle?
3. Is the 5-hole mounting plate available on the #10 Dexter axle?
4. Are the parts for the Ausco brake still available (pads, seal, and dust boot)?

Zep
Smaller axles have smaller spindles.

Dexter will not make a special small axle using a 12 inch brake mounting plate.

# 3. No

A few pistons are still available.

The boots (rubber dust caps) are available.

The pads are made with the lining covering as much of the plate that is possible, which provides a larger pad area, are locally made, as they have been for years.

Andy
__________________
Andy Rogozinski
Inland RV Center
Corona, CA
Inland RV Center, In is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2012, 09:36 AM   #6
Rivet Master
 
Zeppelinium's Avatar

 
1973 23' Safari
1977 23' Safari
2018 25' Flying Cloud
Palmer Lake , Colorado
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,092
Send a message via Skype™ to Zeppelinium
Quote:
Originally Posted by overlander63 View Post
Roger, I've swapped the old discs out for new Kodiak ones on a '77 Sovereign. I was even able to re-use the old metal lines. I put the Dexter actuator under the cover the old vacuum actuator was in.
The problem is you can't do the swap and get a new axle. Zep
__________________
Zep@Charmedquark.net
Zeppelinium is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2012, 09:38 AM   #7
Rivet Master
 
Zeppelinium's Avatar

 
1973 23' Safari
1977 23' Safari
2018 25' Flying Cloud
Palmer Lake , Colorado
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,092
Send a message via Skype™ to Zeppelinium
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inland RV Center, In View Post
Smaller axles have smaller spindles.

Dexter will not make a special small axle using a 12 inch brake mounting plate.

...
Andy, aren't you doing an alternative axle? Will they duplicate the old Henschens--spindle size and mounting plate?

Zep
__________________
Zep@Charmedquark.net
Zeppelinium is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2012, 09:39 AM   #8
Rivet Master
Airstream Dealer
 
Inland RV Center, In's Avatar
 
Corona , California
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,497
Images: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeppelinium View Post
The problem is you can't do the swap and get a new axle. Zep
Zep.

You can do the "swap" and get new axles, but not Dexter axles.

We do it all the time.

Andy
__________________
Andy Rogozinski
Inland RV Center
Corona, CA
Inland RV Center, In is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2012, 09:41 AM   #9
Rivet Master
Airstream Dealer
 
Inland RV Center, In's Avatar
 
Corona , California
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,497
Images: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeppelinium View Post
Andy, aren't you doing an alternative axle? Will they duplicate the old Henschens--spindle size and mounting plate?

Zep
Zep.

The axles we provide are made to the original Henschen specifications.

Therefore disc brake swap out, are a piece of cake.

Andy
__________________
Andy Rogozinski
Inland RV Center
Corona, CA
Inland RV Center, In is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2012, 10:45 AM   #10
Rivet Master
 
Zeppelinium's Avatar

 
1973 23' Safari
1977 23' Safari
2018 25' Flying Cloud
Palmer Lake , Colorado
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,092
Send a message via Skype™ to Zeppelinium
For completeness, here's a bit more data on the Ausco disk system. You see the grease seal where the old crud has been scraped off and even the heads of the lug bolts.

Click image for larger version

Name:	P1000772 old spindle-s.jpg
Views:	178
Size:	111.9 KB
ID:	149294 Click image for larger version

Name:	P1000776 rear disk-s.jpg
Views:	172
Size:	100.5 KB
ID:	149295

Zep
__________________
Zep@Charmedquark.net
Zeppelinium is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2012, 11:13 AM   #11
Rivet Master
 
4RXLA's Avatar
 
1977 31' Excella 500
West Sacramento , California
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 731
Images: 33
Blog Entries: 12
My Auscos were salvaged and placed on new Henschen axles.
4RXLA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2012, 02:17 PM   #12
Retired.
 
Currently Looking...
. , At Large
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 21,276
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeppelinium View Post
The problem is you can't do the swap and get a new axle. Zep
I'm confused. The Axis 12" spindle fits the disc brake mount like any other 12", even the ones the trailer came with. Colin Hyde is selling them that way. The only potential difference is Axis/Al-Ko 12" axles seem to only come in 22.5 degree starting angle. If you want to increase ride height with a higher starting angle, that would be where the differences start.
__________________
Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy, and taste good with ketchup.
Terry
overlander63 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2012, 02:23 PM   #13
Rivet Master
 
Zeppelinium's Avatar

 
1973 23' Safari
1977 23' Safari
2018 25' Flying Cloud
Palmer Lake , Colorado
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,092
Send a message via Skype™ to Zeppelinium
True for Axis, and true for Dexter, as far as it goes. The problem is, if the axle is smaller than 3,500#, Dexter will not put a 12" (eg, 2.25") spindle on it. You get a 1.72" spindle, instead. Period. So if you're putting axles on a 4,300# Safari, the axles are 2,300# each. Too small, in Dexter's opinion, for the bigger spindle. The customer is NOT always right.

Dexter, you make great replacement axles, but in this one regard, you s..k. Hope we can talk you into changing your rules, but I know many have tried and failed.

Zep
__________________
Zep@Charmedquark.net
Zeppelinium is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2012, 02:29 PM   #14
Retired.
 
Currently Looking...
. , At Large
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 21,276
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeppelinium View Post
True for Axis, and true for Dexter, as far as it goes. The problem is, if the axle is smaller than 3,500#, Dexter will not put a 12" (eg, 2.25") spindle on it. You get a 1.72" spindle, instead. Period. So if you're putting axles on a 4,300# Safari, the axles are 2,300# each. Too small, in Dexter's opinion, for the bigger spindle. The customer is NOT always right.

Dexter, you make great replacement axles, but in this one regard, you s..k. Hope we can talk you into changing your rules, but I know many have tried and failed.

Zep
Plan "B" (C?) would be to order the smallest rated large tube axles, and cut the rear of the notch in the frame so the larger tube will fit. It's not perfect, but doable.
__________________
Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy, and taste good with ketchup.
Terry
overlander63 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2012, 02:42 PM   #15
Rivet Master
Airstream Dealer
 
Inland RV Center, In's Avatar
 
Corona , California
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,497
Images: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeppelinium View Post
True for Axis, and true for Dexter, as far as it goes. The problem is, if the axle is smaller than 3,500#, Dexter will not put a 12" (eg, 2.25") spindle on it. You get a 1.72" spindle, instead. Period. So if you're putting axles on a 4,300# Safari, the axles are 2,300# each. Too small, in Dexter's opinion, for the bigger spindle. The customer is NOT always right.

Dexter, you make great replacement axles, but in this one regard, you s..k. Hope we can talk you into changing your rules, but I know many have tried and failed.

Zep
Zep.

We have had meetings with Dexter engineers.

They are totally stuborn and "bull headed" about putting 12 inch brakes on torsion axles with a rating less than 3500 pounds.

We offered to purchase a large quantity from them, and their answer was still "NO".

So, we gave up trying to convince them.

Almost the same story about shock brackets.

They simply don't care about having safer brakes on a smaller rated axle.

Andy
__________________
Andy Rogozinski
Inland RV Center
Corona, CA
Inland RV Center, In is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-07-2012, 03:25 PM   #16
1 Rivet Member
 
Goodgodman's Avatar
 
1964 28' Ambassador
Abbeville , Louisiana
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 7
Question? I have a 1964 Ambassador International Twin beds rear bath...I need new hubs and brakes... do I change the original axles too?
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_1282.JPG
Views:	120
Size:	474.4 KB
ID:	165097  
__________________
Even if you fall on your face, you're still moving forward. by Victor Kiam
Goodgodman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2012, 02:55 PM   #17
1 Rivet Member
 
Goodgodman's Avatar
 
1964 28' Ambassador
Abbeville , Louisiana
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 7
Never mind.. stupid question! I'll just do it all.
__________________
Even if you fall on your face, you're still moving forward. by Victor Kiam
Goodgodman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2012, 07:51 PM   #18
Rivet Master
 
Zeppelinium's Avatar

 
1973 23' Safari
1977 23' Safari
2018 25' Flying Cloud
Palmer Lake , Colorado
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,092
Send a message via Skype™ to Zeppelinium
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodgodman View Post
Never mind.. stupid question! I'll just do it all.
Not stupid. But, yes, do it all.

Zep
__________________
Zep@Charmedquark.net
Zeppelinium is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Smoky Mountain Vintage Rally 2011 Silverhobby The Rally Zone 8 05-05-2017 07:36 AM
Converting to Disk Brakes perryg114 Brakes & Brake Controllers 66 12-24-2011 09:08 PM


Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Airstream, Inc. or any of its affiliates. Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:38 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.