Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 11-13-2011, 11:04 AM   #29
Slide Out Society #001
 
GCinSC2's Avatar
 
2007 30' Classic S/O
Somewhere , South Carolina
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 2,054
Quote:
Originally Posted by nickmeloy View Post
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
We installed banjo fittings on our 2006 Classic to solve the kinked brake hose problem. These fittings are equivalent to a 90 degree fitting.

Nick
Nick,

Any chance to post a picture, I'd like to see this, sounds interesting.

Gary
__________________

__________________
S/OS #001
2005 Dodge Ram 2500 5.9L 6 Speed
16" Michelins, Hi Spec Wheels, Max Brake, Carslile Actuator, Equal-i-zer, Dill TPMS. Campfire cook.
GCinSC2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-2011, 11:44 AM   #30
Maniacal Engineer
 
barts's Avatar
 
1971 25' Tradewind
Menlo Park , California
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,223
Images: 1
Blog Entries: 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by GCinSC2 View Post
Using the same "plumbing" on our TV's we should expect the same:

"the effect of brake hose compliance on our trailers is to create more brake delay on application, and slightly reduce the speed with which the brakes are released."

I do not see this as my TV's braking habits or expectations. My 2005 Dodge has about 120,000 miles on the original brakes, performing as I expect them to.

The areas that I would advise an owner with disc brakes to review:
Controller to actuator compatibility, must be checked. My dealer sold me an incompatible (non listed) controller, why, I think they were just not used to working with disc systems. Now I have Maxbrake.
Wiring, wiring and wiring. These connections must be 1st class.
Hoses, several discussions here about short hoses and their problems.
And for the possibly most challanging, are your brakes COMPLETELY bled? While my profession is not braking, my profession DOES involve another DOT 3 based single stroke hydraulic systems (automotive clutches) and I cannot over emphasize how important and detremental air bubbles are in these systems. In our TV brakes, we use a single (master cylinder) stroke to create braking pressure in the lines but in our trailer the controller tells the actuator to run and the trailer could be 1/2 air in the lines and the pump just keeps pumping and pumping compressing the air in the lines and eventually (read delay) creating braking pressure. Also a possible source of brake delay in a correctly functioning hydraulic system would be rotor runout. If excessive runout existed the caliper pistons would be slightly in a retracted position as the wobbling rotor pushes the pads away from the runout. This extra air gap requires more time to press the pads against the rotor compared to a true running rotor that had a minimum gap.

I wish I had an ultrasound gizmo that I could put on the system and from the outside detect or prove that air exists in these systems, ain't got it. Air = delay, period.

I will comfortably state that IMHO the mere flow of DOT 3 out of a bleed screw is not a guarntee that all air has been expelled.

Going back to the OP's original complaint of intermittant brake locking up or drag IMHO a single wheel incident must point to components confined to the indivudual wheels brake components and supply hose.
You're right: air == delay. Air introduces compliance into the system and this is what causes delay as the pump has to work to pump up the pressure. Hoses also cause delay because they're springy. [Stainless steel hoses are less springy, but not so you'd notice in this application; one can definitely feel the difference on a motorcycle, for example] There's of course some delay inherent in the movement of the pucks against the rotors.

I bleed the brakes using a remote switch hooked to the break-away line on the controller. What would really make the job easier is a large bottle of brake fluid arranged to keep the master cylinder full as I purge the individual lines; that way I'm not crawling out from underneath the trailer to refill the master cylinder all the time. I installed the discs when we replaced the axles on the Tin Pickle; it took several round the trailer trips to get the air out of the lines, and I'm sure there's still some in there somewhere.

I'm also considering going to the MAX Brake controller; my Prodigy has been fooled into surging in stop and traffic on downhills, which is annoying but not dangerous.

- Bart
__________________

__________________
Bart Smaalders
Menlo Park, CA
http://tinpickle.blogspot.com
http://smaalders.net/barts
barts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2011, 05:35 AM   #31
3 Rivet Member
 
1983 31' Excella
2005 30' Classic
1993 33' Land Yacht
Wellfleet , Massachusetts
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 109
It is important to be sure you have good clean fluid in the brakes. Contaminated fluid will reduce the effectiveness of the braking system. Fluid also absorbs moisture . I would recomend flushing and bleeding the brakes every other year for best results . If the master cylinder has no check valve in it you can use a vacuum pump at the caliper bleeder . If it does you will need a pressure bleeder at the master cylinder .
Don
__________________
Don.44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2011, 11:03 AM   #32
4 Rivet Member
 
2006 30' Classic
Milton , Florida
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 256
Banjo Fitting

Quote:
Originally Posted by GCinSC2 View Post
Nick,

Any chance to post a picture, I'd like to see this, sounds interesting.

Gary
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I do not have picture capability. However, the following link to an automotive video may prove instructive.

Video: How to Remove the Banjo Bolt | eHow.com

Nick
__________________
F. A. Meloy
2006 30' Classic
Dexter hydraulic disc brake system
Centramatics wheel balancing & Dill TPMS
Hensley hitch & Maxim skylights
Voyager Camera System WVOS713
2010 FORD F-250, ITBC, 6.8 liter V-10 gas, with VIAIR on-board air system
nickmeloy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2011, 10:06 PM   #33
Rivet Master
 
ROBERTSUNRUS's Avatar

 
2005 25' Safari
Salem , Oregon
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 7,272
Images: 18
Blog Entries: 51
Hi, I think Airstream still sells a drum brake conversion kit.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	drum brakes-200.jpg
Views:	60
Size:	55.6 KB
ID:	145238  
__________________
Bob

2005 Safari 25-B
"Le Petit Chateau Argent"
[ Small Silver Castle ]
2000 Navigator / 2014 F-150 Eco-Boost / Equal-i-zer / P-3
YAMAHA 2400 / AIR #12144
ROBERTSUNRUS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-15-2011, 06:35 PM   #34
Slide Out Society #001
 
GCinSC2's Avatar
 
2007 30' Classic S/O
Somewhere , South Carolina
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 2,054
Nick,

I know what the banjo bolt fitting is and looks like, I just was curious how your line routing looked using the banjo bolt approach.

Thanks,

Gary
__________________
S/OS #001
2005 Dodge Ram 2500 5.9L 6 Speed
16" Michelins, Hi Spec Wheels, Max Brake, Carslile Actuator, Equal-i-zer, Dill TPMS. Campfire cook.
GCinSC2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-15-2011, 08:04 PM   #35
CLOUDSPLITTER "Tahawas"
 
ROBERT CROSS's Avatar

 
2003 25' Classic
Zanadude Nebula , WNY
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 11,153
Images: 1
UMMM....wonder why?

Bob

Model: 2012 - 31'W CLASSIC LIMITED DINETTE TRAILER

CHASSIS
10,000# GVWR • 10,000# Axle System • 7174# UBW • 2826# NCC • 805# Hitch Weight • Aluminum Wheels • 15" Radial Black Wall Tires, LRD • 12" Electric Drum Brakes w/ Nev-R-Adjust Brakes & Nev-R-Lube Hubs • Electric Hitch Jack • Manual Stabilizer Jack w/Pads • Aluminum Step w/Extension • Stainless Steel A-Frame Protectors • Spare Tire & Bracket.
__________________
PFC.....

“After all these years the reason I continue to love Thanksgiving.....I still sit at the kids table.”
RLC

Sandra wanted to go to Cleveland on vacation,
but I’m the Husband, so we went to Cleveland.
RLC
ROBERT CROSS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2011, 03:13 AM   #36
3 Rivet Member
 
1983 31' Excella
2005 30' Classic
1993 33' Land Yacht
Wellfleet , Massachusetts
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 109
I didn't think the surface on the caliper was machined for a banjo bolt fitting but if it works you can't argue with that . I have 90 degree fittings screwed into my calipers and they work fine .
Don
__________________
Don.44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2011, 11:27 AM   #37
4 Rivet Member
 
2006 30' Classic
Milton , Florida
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 256
Quote:
Originally Posted by GCinSC2 View Post
Nick,

I know what the banjo bolt fitting is and looks like, I just was curious how your line routing looked using the banjo bolt approach.

Thanks,

Gary
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The brake hose comes straight from the banjo fitting fitting to the existing steel brake line. The tricky part is getting the length of the brake hose correct. Too short and something will break when the tire goes through its' maxium verticle travel. Too long and one is back into the danger of the brake hose rubbing on something. From memory, my brake hose length is 12 inches, but measuring is critical, and each trailer is probably slightly different.

I also purchased some of that split wire protection stuff from Radio Shack and put a piece around each brake hose, held in place with nylon tie straps.

Nick
__________________
F. A. Meloy
2006 30' Classic
Dexter hydraulic disc brake system
Centramatics wheel balancing & Dill TPMS
Hensley hitch & Maxim skylights
Voyager Camera System WVOS713
2010 FORD F-250, ITBC, 6.8 liter V-10 gas, with VIAIR on-board air system
nickmeloy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2011, 07:08 PM   #38
Slide Out Society #001
 
GCinSC2's Avatar
 
2007 30' Classic S/O
Somewhere , South Carolina
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 2,054
Nick,

When I reconfirured my hose, I just didn't think of a banjo fitting config. I can see the idea in my head, a pic would be nice. I used a hose and a short piece of pre-flared steel line going from M10 to 3/8", picture already posted.

One feature that your banjo connection and my steel line attaching to the caliper allows is inboard caliper bleeding in addition to the bleed screw.

But if I started over on this, I would look at approaching this from the front of the axle, somehow routing it down the trailing arm and then attaching. For a comparison look at a motorcycles rear brake. The hose does not come in from behind to the caliper, it comes down the swingarm.

I have a set of new Dexter calipers in the garage, I'll take a picture of the connection, M10 bubble then others can see the face of the caliper casting at the connection.
__________________
S/OS #001
2005 Dodge Ram 2500 5.9L 6 Speed
16" Michelins, Hi Spec Wheels, Max Brake, Carslile Actuator, Equal-i-zer, Dill TPMS. Campfire cook.
GCinSC2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-17-2011, 10:39 AM   #39
4 Rivet Member
 
2006 30' Classic
Milton , Florida
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 256
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don.44 View Post
I didn't think the surface on the caliper was machined for a banjo bolt fitting but if it works you can't argue with that . I have 90 degree fittings screwed into my calipers and they work fine .
Don
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
You are correct in that the casting is not machined to a very smooth surface. Another member of the forum had sent me a PM on his success with using banjo fittings in this application. I decided to try it, and have had no problems with fluid leaks.

I went to banjo fittings because I was unable to locate any 90 degree fittings with the correct threads. If memory serves me correctly, the threads are metric on one end and SAE on the other end. Where did you find the 90 degree fittings?

Nick
__________________

__________________
F. A. Meloy
2006 30' Classic
Dexter hydraulic disc brake system
Centramatics wheel balancing & Dill TPMS
Hensley hitch & Maxim skylights
Voyager Camera System WVOS713
2010 FORD F-250, ITBC, 6.8 liter V-10 gas, with VIAIR on-board air system
nickmeloy is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Electric over Hydraulic/disc brakes Phil Gobie Brakes & Brake Controllers 12 10-13-2017 03:03 PM
1977 Hydraulic Disc Brakes? Atlantica Brakes & Brake Controllers 22 11-20-2007 10:49 PM
Hydraulic disc brakes failed Gator1 Brakes & Brake Controllers 1 03-13-2007 10:19 PM
Kodiak Hydraulic disc brakes thenewkid64 Brakes & Brake Controllers 1 07-06-2004 11:48 PM
Hydraulic Brake Replacement DanLyle Brakes & Brake Controllers 2 03-26-2002 06:02 PM


Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:50 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.