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Old 12-04-2014, 11:16 AM   #141
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Originally Posted by KJRitchie View Post
Would it be possible to get a machine shop to tap a hole for a bleed screw in the inner calipers?

Why isn't Dexter addressing this issue or do their current line of calipers have bleed screws in the inner caliper now?

Kelvin
I have thought about that. But the thread and seat machining is very specific in order to set and seal properly. I wonder if machine shops would have the tooling to do this, as it would be a rare circumstance (volume) to tool for. I haven't checked into it. One would have to be able to determine the exact position for this port for it to be effective.
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Old 12-04-2014, 11:35 AM   #142
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I don't have time to research but I think this is worth looking into.

A Banjo Bolt with Bleed Screw fitting. Google it.

Pretty sure that our caliper can be connected to am M10 banjo bolt connection.

This offers a built in bleed screw and would need more research than I can look at right now.
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Old 12-04-2014, 11:47 AM   #143
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Those would certainly work, and require little machining prowess, but one would have to make certain that the length of the threaded portion did not protrude at all below the inner caliper bore surface, as this would just let the air accumulate around the outside of the banjo threads and not be pushed out the bleeder. I have no idea what the dimension the wall thickness is. If it is not very thick, one could easily blow the whole fitting out due to not enough threaded material. That is why line fittings and bleeder fittings are usually located in a cast-in lug, or elevated portion of the caliper....more "meat" for the fitting to thread into.
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Old 12-04-2014, 01:47 PM   #144
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Rich,

I have a set of Dexter calipers at home. I'll take a closer look, measure and take a pic or two. Pretty sure the banjo bolt connection is common to many caliper connections. That is what I used to make my pressure gauge adaptor with.

Gary
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Old 12-04-2014, 02:35 PM   #145
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Gary, are you talking about using the banjo on the line inlet port. If so, I think we'd have the same issue of "stratifying" or redistributing the air away from the bleeder as soon as the inrush of fluid from the line begins. I don't think that would gain anything except avoiding a 1/2 - 3/4 turn twist on the rubber line and bleeding through the input line threads. That's what I have done in the past....don't like it, but it works and so far, no sign of damaging the line.
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Old 12-05-2014, 11:58 PM   #146
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Vacuum bleeding from the banjo bleed screw would be best. Avoids the air trapping turbulence.


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Old 12-06-2014, 08:11 AM   #147
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Yeah, Rmkrum, your right, this is our best solution. Gary, Wasn't it you who fitted your calipers with longer braided steel lines?

My AS is away in storage and can't examine, but I'd Like to develop a list here of:
Braided line
Banjo fitting
Banjo bolt
banjo washers
bleeder valve

with links for procurement. I'd like to have these in hand for spring maintenance at next tire rotation. I'm due for a brake fluid flush anyway.

We need threaded sizes and pitches for the line and banjo bolt as well as the bleeder. And a good length for the line. Anything else?
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Old 12-06-2014, 08:26 AM   #148
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I now have in hand the new Dexter actuator, the 2PSI residual pressure valve, and the necessary brake line, and although I've been recovering from diverticulitis and a perforated colon, I'll soon have some information if this is an improvement or not.

I was also thinking because I have a three axle trailer (six calipers), at a minimum, the time it takes for the actuator to get to effective braking pressure will be 50% more than with a tandem axle trailer, if my thinking is correct.
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Old 12-06-2014, 08:33 AM   #149
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Ick, Steve, I'm sorry. My mother has dealt with that for years...not fun.
The 6 vs. 4 issue should not be, if all air is out. Since fluid does not compress, it matters not how many calipers there are....unless you also have excessive runout in the hub/rotor assemblies, pushing the pads back too much in their bores going down the road. Yes, theoretically, two more calipers pushing out the normal clearance would take a bit more fluid displacement, but it really should be non-discernible to the driver. Ramp up of pressure "should" be rapid enough to make it almost un-measurable from a time/lag standpoint.
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Old 12-06-2014, 09:12 AM   #150
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Thanks Rich. In my feeble mind, there must be some amount of fluid flow, albeit small, and each caliper must have the same amount of flow, so that's where I got the idea of additional time for additional calipers. I understand the fluid does not compress, but still, the caliper pistons have to move to clamp the pads onto the rotors. Anyway, just doing some thinking out loud.

Thinking now about how to avoid some of the worst of the bleeding, and think I'll raise the front of the trailer before disconnecting the bad actuator, then install the new one and fill with fluid. Then without energizing it, compress one of the calipers in an effort to push fluid back thru the residual valve and into the new actuator. At least it makes sense to me.
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Old 12-06-2014, 09:17 AM   #151
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Thanks Rich. In my feeble mind, there must be some amount of fluid flow, albeit small, and each caliper must have the same amount of flow, so that's where I got the idea of additional time for additional calipers. I understand the fluid does not compress, but still, the caliper pistons have to move to clamp the pads onto the rotors. Anyway, just doing some thinking out loud.

Thinking now about how to avoid some of the worst of the bleeding, and think I'll raise the front of the trailer before disconnecting the bad actuator, then install the new one and fill with fluid. Then without energizing it, compress one of the calipers in an effort to push fluid back thru the residual valve and into the new actuator. At least it makes sense to me.
Yeah, you're right...I just don't think with a system purged of air and normal healthy bearings (adjusted correctly), true rotors and spindles, that it would be significantly more apply time than a healthy 4 wheel setup.

The only reason I say that, is in my discussion with the Tuson engineer, he was firm that their pressure ramp up was "instantaneous". I assume (perhaps incorrectly) the others do as well...although Gary's video, arguably, shows otherwise???? I forget what brand he was testing.
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Old 12-06-2014, 09:27 AM   #152
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Originally Posted by dznf0g View Post
Yeah, you're right...I just don't think with a system purged of air and normal healthy bearings (adjusted correctly), true rotors and spindles, that it would be significantly more apply time than a healthy 4 wheel setup.

The only reason I say that, is in my discussion with the Tuson engineer, he was firm that their pressure ramp up was "instantaneous". I assume (perhaps incorrectly) the others do as well...although Gary's video, arguably, shows otherwise???? I forget what brand he was testing.
Yes, you can watch Gary's video, listen to the sound of when the motor starts, then loads up under pressure vs when the pressure comes up on the scale, and actually see the delay. By the way, that's exactly how my actuator sounds. Now, if that delay is a result of air in the system, or time the actuator requires to get to pressure is the real question.

My residual valve experiment might shed some light on the subject, hopefully.
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Old 12-06-2014, 09:29 AM   #153
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I await with baited breath!
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Old 12-06-2014, 12:46 PM   #154
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[QUOTE=SteveH;1550200]Yes, you can watch Gary's video, listen to the sound of when the motor starts, then loads up under pressure vs when the pressure comes up on the scale, and actually see the delay. By the way, that's exactly how my actuator sounds. Now, if that delay is a result of air in the system, or time the actuator requires to get to pressure is the real question.

My residual valve experiment might shed some light on the subject, hopefully.[/QUOTE]

Hi, I hope what you are doing makes this system work better; It's sad that individual owners have to figure out what the makers, sellers, and installers couldn't, wouldn't, and didn't do.
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