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Old 05-07-2012, 05:51 PM   #29
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If it isn't proportional then I don't see how it's any better than MaxBrake, except that it is easier to install. But it looks like MaxBrake would stop better.
Why do you say it would stop better?
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Old 05-07-2012, 06:20 PM   #30
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One can make arguments about anticipatory braking (decelorometer) being somewhat better than direct brake pressure reading. BenK on Woodalls makes this argument quite well and it is worth reading him (also an ex-racer). The P3 has it's place.

Second, for those who make a living at hauling trailers behind 1T and chassis cab trucks, the SMARTBRAKE and the MAXBRAKE have had no peer the past nearly ten years (since the demise of the JORDAN 2020) as high miles and developed skill make the direct read controller highly regarded.

The problem still remains trailer braking over trailer brake control. Discs may be a bit slow to come to speed (so to speak) but have no peer. Drums are just unacceptable. The best combos of late have been with direct read controllers and disc's (as I read things) with experienced drivers (non-experienced just need to come up to speed . . a few thousand miles of paying attention on varying surfaces).

The DIRECLINK -- looking at their trailer ABS module -- is what has been needed for some time. A TV and a TT whose anti-lock works in tandem is a big step forward.

I get the impression that there is more to it than a P3 with some extra proprietary figgerin' goin on. The potential combo of TT and TV equipped with disc brakes on all axles -- with anti-lock -- is the biggest thing in fifty years.

.
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Old 05-07-2012, 07:50 PM   #31
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Funny how this thread pops up AFTER I ordered a new P3 today. I have a 2002 Sequoia. Anyone know if this high speed, low drag DirecLink will work with my TV? I'm sure the P3 will be a big improvement over my U-Haul special.
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Old 05-07-2012, 07:53 PM   #32
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Funny how this thread pops up AFTER I ordered a new P3 today. I have a 2002 Sequoia. Anyone know if this high speed, low drag DirecLink will work with my TV? I'm sure the P3 will be a big improvement over my U-Haul special.
I don't know. The site says 2008 and newer Toyota, but someone said it worked on their older Toyota???????
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Old 05-07-2012, 08:38 PM   #33
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It worked on my 2005 Tacoma. Ask your dealer service tech if the Sequoia uses a 'CAN network'.
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Old 05-07-2012, 08:41 PM   #34
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Thanks for the info. I'll see what they say.
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Old 05-08-2012, 09:49 AM   #35
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Why do you say it would stop better?
Because the two most important things about braking are responsiveness (DirecLink and MaxBrake both have that) and proportionality (MaxBrake has that).

If I touch the brakes, I don't want the trailer braking harder than the TV. If I have an emergency, I don't want the TV braking harder than the trailer (very, very bad!).

DirecBrake is very vague on this point. If it is proportional, why won't they say so. If not, then I would think that MaxBrake would be better, especially in an emergency.

I'm hoping that DirecBrake IS proportional, but so far I can't determine that it is.
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Old 05-08-2012, 11:10 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by Secguru View Post
Because the two most important things about braking are responsiveness (DirecLink and MaxBrake both have that) and proportionality (MaxBrake has that).

If I touch the brakes, I don't want the trailer braking harder than the TV. If I have an emergency, I don't want the TV braking harder than the trailer (very, very bad!).

DirecBrake is very vague on this point. If it is proportional, why won't they say so. If not, then I would think that MaxBrake would be better, especially in an emergency.

I'm hoping that DirecBrake IS proportional, but so far I can't determine that it is.
I see. Is your definition of proportional an increase of apply pressure at the pads (shoes) independent of a change in inertia (velocity)?
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Old 05-08-2012, 12:44 PM   #37
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DL braking

I would love to tell you guys how it works, but that is proprietary information and that is why "they won't say". The definition of "proportional" being referenced above is diffierent then when the term is used by brake controllers, but I understand what you are asking. Let me say this; If you push the brake harder you will apply more brake pressure to the trailer and stop faster, unless of course any of the systems is running on glare ice. If you have the ABS system press as hard as you would like and you won't flat spot your tires and you will stop very quickly and remain straight, even if one side is in gravel and the other on the road., or if you are driving in snow, or heavy rain, or .... The ABS is very impressive. Yes the DirecLink is VERY responsive, and I would like to say more on that subject, but can't. ABS "closes the control loop" and provides maximum braking even when the driver is exceeding what you provide the fastest braking. So if you "really want to stop fast" buy ABS system.
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Old 05-08-2012, 03:10 PM   #38
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Discs may be a bit slow to come to speed (so to speak) but have no peer. Drums are just unacceptable.
Drum brakes are on 100's of thousands of trailers, even more are in rear ends of GM vehicles, and every big rig on the road. They're are reliable, and have good stopping power. Given the multiple problems (and at least one recall) documented here on Airforums alone, from a relatively small group of people with them, I'm not ready to give up the drums just yet.
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Old 05-09-2012, 08:57 AM   #39
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Nothing wrong with drum brakes when maintained properly if you are not looking for the ultimate in braking. I think you will see improvements in those systems as well but it will take a while before, if ever, you can achieve braking power of hydraulic ABS systems. I think everyone has stories about misadjusted brakes, disconnected wires and so forth, where I would like to see some statistic on how many electric brake systems are 1) adjusted improperly, 2) improperly wired, 3) inoperable due to rust and so on. Those whom maintain the brakes and know they are all operable may be in the minority from what I am told. Even the ulitimate brake controller is of little use if the brakes aren't working properly. Any opinions? Do you check your brakes every year or ? How do you know you have a problem? I am guessing it is like with your vehicle; Hmmm, that didn't feel right. Your opinions would be greatly appreciated.
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Old 05-09-2012, 09:12 AM   #40
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C5Don, If I understand you correctly, you seem to be saying that an increase in brake pedal pressure in the TV WILL result in an increase in brake action in the trailer and that a decrease in brake pedal pressure in the TV WILL result in a decrease in braking in the trailer on the DirecLink system. Is that correct?

As I described proportional braking above, when I brake softly, the trailer should also brake softly and when I brake hard, the trailer should also brake hard. Is that what you are describing the DirecLink capable of doing?

Additionally, I am attracted to DirecLink because trailer braking is instantaneous with the TV braking. There is no dangerous time lag such as from common pendulum systems (Tekonsha P3, etc.).

If all this is true, then the DirecLink seems to be the best controller, also considering how easy it is to install. Can you verify that?
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Old 05-09-2012, 09:54 AM   #41
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Secguru: No, don't think that is what I said. First let me say that if you created a better mousetrap and had an advantage over other vendors, spent a lot of money inventing this mousetrap, would you tell others how you did it? I don't think so. So if your question is; if you are standing still where you need little brake force if you push real hard on the brake pedal will you get more brake blue wire? The answer is no. But the remainder of your comments are entirely correct. Do you get amazing level of responsiveness? Yes. Does the braking levels at all kinds of driving conditions always seem to be "just right"? Yes. Do you get increases in braking wihen you press harder on the TV brake pedal? Yes. Again, I can't tell you how it works but I think your conclusion is correct. This controller "knows" what you TV is doing, unlike anything else on the market. When you have the hydraulic disc brake system, it knows what the hydraulic brake controller is doing. If you have the ABS module, it knows what the ABS system is doing. I know lots of you connect to electric brakes, and that is fine and at least you are taking advantage of the vehicle knowledge. DirecLink is part of a "system" of "plug and play" modules for what we like to say "get what you pay for, buy only what you need". So all the discussions on this thread are right on track, asking all the right stuff, but DirecLink and its complimenatry modules are just the first of what is happening in trailers. Your TV has multiple systems that all intercommunicate to provide improved performance and functionality, and DirecLink integrates the TV with the trailer to provide superior functionality and performance. I know you are right now just seeing the leading edge and discussing brake controllers, but buckle up, this is just the beginning. I can say one thing, I have my "own products" coming soon that reside in the trailer, utilize the same networking, and as such could clearly integrate into the "DirecLink" system. Some won't care, and that is fine, but DL Brake Controller is just one product withih a fully distributed control system. Your opinions are "extremely important" as are you "requirements" and your "desired features" of future systems and what you feel is important, and just "nice to have". You guys keep us honest, as what you think is important, not whay I think. Don't know how many vendors watch these threads, but you guys clearly have "direct input to the future" so please say "exactly what you think" as it can affect the directon of traler systems.
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Old 05-09-2012, 10:50 AM   #42
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Secguru: No, don't think that is what I said. First let me say that if you created a better mousetrap and had an advantage over other vendors, spent a lot of money inventing this mousetrap, would you tell others how you did it? I don't think so. So if your question is; if you are standing still where you need little brake force if you push real hard on the brake pedal will you get more brake blue wire? The answer is no. But the remainder of your comments are entirely correct. Do you get amazing level of responsiveness? Yes. Does the braking levels at all kinds of driving conditions always seem to be "just right"? Yes. Do you get increases in braking wihen you press harder on the TV brake pedal? Yes. Again, I can't tell you how it works but I think your conclusion is correct. This controller "knows" what you TV is doing, unlike anything else on the market. When you have the hydraulic disc brake system, it knows what the hydraulic brake controller is doing. If you have the ABS module, it knows what the ABS system is doing. I know lots of you connect to electric brakes, and that is fine and at least you are taking advantage of the vehicle knowledge. DirecLink is part of a "system" of "plug and play" modules for what we like to say "get what you pay for, buy only what you need". So all the discussions on this thread are right on track, asking all the right stuff, but DirecLink and its complimenatry modules are just the first of what is happening in trailers. Your TV has multiple systems that all intercommunicate to provide improved performance and functionality, and DirecLink integrates the TV with the trailer to provide superior functionality and performance. I know you are right now just seeing the leading edge and discussing brake controllers, but buckle up, this is just the beginning. I can say one thing, I have my "own products" coming soon that reside in the trailer, utilize the same networking, and as such could clearly integrate into the "DirecLink" system. Some won't care, and that is fine, but DL Brake Controller is just one product withih a fully distributed control system. Your opinions are "extremely important" as are you "requirements" and your "desired features" of future systems and what you feel is important, and just "nice to have". You guys keep us honest, as what you think is important, not whay I think. Don't know how many vendors watch these threads, but you guys clearly have "direct input to the future" so please say "exactly what you think" as it can affect the directon of traler systems.
Oh..., I don't think we can do that! We're all very shy

Thanks for paying attention and keep us informed of new stuff.
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