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Old 09-05-2012, 07:53 AM   #15
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Almost maks me wish my actuator would finally fail, so I could justify the ABS and actuator!
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Old 09-05-2012, 09:44 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by REDNAX View Post
"Tuson has ABS Trailer Brakes for fast smooth safer stops - - DirecLink trailer brake controller networks with trucks computer for faster braking and diagnosis

I especially like this quote:

" . . When using the trailer brakes only, the trailer brakes have to stop the truck and trailer (20,000 lbs) at a predetermined deceleration rate. This is how trailer brakes are tested in Europe."

Ahh, yes, . . civilization. The First World. Good to hear how it's done where reason is balanced against profit.

So have at it, boys. We're finally in the 21st Century!!.
Any typical braking system installed on a trailer is capable of stopping the combined rig "at a predetermined rate" on its own. Once the engineers move testing from the "bench" to the track, isolating the tow vehicle's braking system from the trailer's braking system would naturally be one of their tests.

I would not draw any socio-economic conclusions from it, that the trailer system alone is designed to operate continuously, or even safely, in such a configuration. It is simply describing a testing methodology for their design parameters.

I have been hauling heavy trailers my whole life and still would not buy this. But free market technology always drives down costs and results in better products. It is awesome that companies like Tuson can create a profitable business making ABS and disc brake technology available. Maybe, as they refine the technology, one day Airstream will offer a $5K option for it. Then the technology/cost curve will drop further making it standard equipment.

On the other hand I damn sure hope some Tuson or supplier lobbyist does not bribe the NHTSA politco's to mandate this technology and force Airstream to add another 5 grand to the price of a travel trailer for something I do not want or need.

My run of the mill American 3/4 ton pickup has sophisticated braking, sway control, engine and transmission control software integrated with the trailer connection and brake controller. It is a very sophisticated powerful tow package capable of hauling, stabilizing and stopping the whole rig with or without trailer brakes. Eat your heart out Europe!
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Old 09-05-2012, 10:12 AM   #17
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Interesting, but I noticed that "The ActuLink ABS Module has 4 unique multi-valve channels controlled by the high speed digital network."


"Triple Axle - No Problem

The ActuLink ABS Module links the hydraulic channel of the center axle brake to either the brake in front of, or behind it depending on the type of suspension. This allows the system to be used on triple axle towables."

I would say that they are not quite there for triple axles.
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Old 09-06-2012, 10:21 AM   #18
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Like Wayward said its a market volutme issue. Using a bigger pump, more valves is not a tecnical issue but a return on investment issue. Adding two more channels, for two more sensors, and control for two more modulating valves requires new board layout, new packaging, some fimrware changes in both ABS module and hydraulic module as well as testing, manufacturing build changes and so on. Then likely a "bigger pump" due to volume, not pressure, as I recall. Thus more engineering and manufacturing costs. None of this is a technical problem, but how many units do yo need to sell before; 1) you pay back the development expenses and 2) actually get a return on your investment. If the return is there it will be done. This requries demand, and thus customer demand. You are 100% correct about volume, as that means evrything to manufactured cost, and thus price. For example, I am completing a tank gauge as we speak, also talks one network to all this other stuff. I "finished it" a while ago, but when I summed up the "final design" and "vinal manufactured cost" I was a bit high relative to what I thought the maket would be "willing to pay" for a quality gauging system OR I would have to cut the profit per unit and take MUCH longer to pay back the development expense. In this case I "bit the bullet twice" to reduce cost and should have it done shortly. SInce this is an RTOS product I am "paying myself" where if I was doing the product for others, due to my "development expense" they would likely be "shipping it right now" and would reduce cost later. So bottom line is "volume is king" to reducing costs and to be accurate "nothing else affects price more than volume". Such is the life of the "product supplier" side of the equation. Relative to the four valve system for triple axles, as stated, the proper axle selection for the two controlled axles has, I am told, worked out just fine. I am certain any personal experience, positive ro negative, would be appreciated by those at Tuson. Oh, by the way, I believe in Europe you are not allowed to have "manual control" and although I may be wrong, I also beliieve you are not allowed to adjust anything, like "scaling / boost". I don't personally know why they have these rules, they just do. Such is the life in "big brother" land.
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Old 09-07-2012, 09:07 AM   #19
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I believe in Europe you are not allowed to have "manual control" and although I may be wrong, I also beliieve you are not allowed to adjust anything, like "scaling / boost". I don't personally know why they have these rules, they just do. Such is the life in "big brother" land.
Bureaucrats beget regulations, which beget more bureaucrats. Here is where "good intentions" always lead when entrusted to government bureacrats.........."Roadworthiness Testing". Sounds good - right?

The European Commission is outlawing the use of any modifications and non-original components to motor vehicles and their trailers:

Quote:
The draft of the new Directive has implications for all motorists, not just historic vehicle owners. Amongst other things, the draft includes requirements to test all trailers... and requires tests to make reference to a vehicle’s original ‘technical characteristics’.
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Old 09-10-2012, 10:44 AM   #20
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No, the pendulum can swing both ways. Deaths, injuries and property damage can be put in decline with changes in all aspects of law, mandates, etc, and vehicle specification is just one approach.

Searching a cost:benefit analysis is the first start, thus the reason for this thread: Anyone who has experienced a trailer jack-knife is going to be interested, one would think, in improvements to avoid that scenario.

That improved straight-line braking is also part of the mix is a distinct secondary benefit.

That some don't want this sort of improvement is entirely beside the point, nor is it in accord with proven results.

The "article" I linked above is as much about hydraulic disc brakes over electro-mechanical drums . . anti-lock is icing on the cake. A final, but necessary piece.

Now, as to triple axles (tridem), one might also note that the rear of the trailer "lifts" under heavy braking; that the rearmost axle becomes unloaded -- as noted elsewhere on this site; a quote by Andrew T of Can Am RV -- and this "may" (per C5Dons comment on TUSON experience to date) account for the efficacy of tandem over tridem "programming" [word used as shortcut].

It may be that, at present, (short of user data as noted) a tridem axle trailer will act no better than a tandem in brake performance testing overall in regards ABS systems due to load decreases FF to RR even though more "rubber & brake" is present on the tridem.


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Old 09-10-2012, 11:03 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by REDNAX View Post
Finally, nearly two years after reading about this possibility I've come across an article describing the installation and testing of the TUSON (Direclink) TT Anti-Lock Brake Module.

By Kent Sundling, of MrTrailer:

"Tuson has ABS Trailer Brakes for fast smooth safer stops - - DirecLink trailer brake controller networks with trucks computer for faster braking and diagnosis

I especially like this quote:

" . . When using the trailer brakes only, the trailer brakes have to stop the truck and trailer (20,000 lbs) at a predetermined deceleration rate. This is how trailer brakes are tested in Europe."

Ahh, yes, . . civilization. The First World. Good to hear how it's done where reason is balanced against profit.


So have at it, boys. We're finally in the 21st Century!!

.
I wonder how they'd test that in Europe... where surge brakes are required on caravans! In actuality, the American setup would be better for stopping the entire rig if the tow vehicle suddenly lost braking, though I'd guess that most trailers probably have inadequate braking to make that stop more than once every 20 minutes or so.
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Old 09-11-2012, 09:27 AM   #22
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On government involvement, I have mixed feelings. I recall the present administration wanted to require back up cameras on oall vehicles! Give me a break, how many really want to pay for that? Government, here is wisconsin, requires me the get emissions tests on vehciles for years. I know very few "newer vehciles" fail yet we continue to do it! Now, checking trailer brakes to see if "they work" would be a good first step. The only reason is not for those whom choose to have bad brakes, but for the person they run into due to bad brakes. I personally would think that insurance companies should provide a discount for those with ABS systems, effectively a financial incentive to use them, thus providing an improved return on investment. Although huge volumes would clearly reduce cost I would prefer to let the consumer decide versus some politician. If the market wants something, they will get it.
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