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12-08-2007, 08:52 AM
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#21
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3 Rivet Member
2010 28' Flying Cloud
Escondido
, California
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 196
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Outside wear could be indictive of low air pressure.
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12-08-2007, 09:05 AM
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#22
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Rivet Master
Corpus Christi
, Texas
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 936
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My Marathons looked very similar. Changed tire brands and with nearly 50,000 miles on the new tires, they show NO uneven wear patterns. It's just Marathons!
__________________
So Long!
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12-08-2007, 09:16 AM
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#23
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4 Rivet Member
1978 31' Excella 500
Palm Bay
, Florida
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 269
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Tire Wear
I had a very similar problem with my 78 31' Excella. The tires on the road side were wearing and cupping. The only solution I know that works is to take it to the factory and have them align the wheels. It is an interesting process where they hook a come-a-long to the axle and bend it, bringing it into alignment.
Once I had this done, I have had no further problems with tire wear. You may be able to find a dealer that can do the alignment, but for sure the factory will do it and do it right.
Vic
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12-09-2007, 09:56 AM
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#24
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3 Rivet Member
2007 25' Safari FB SE
rio rico
, Arizona
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 119
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It looks like I have excessive toe-in on the front curbside wheel, the one that shows the most wear. I've always checked pressures before going on the road, so I ruled that out. Still need to talk to AS dealer in Tucson before jumping the gun here. A trip to Ohio is not in the cards for a thousand reasons($$$$$ and weather). When new tires are necessary, I will definately look at other brands. I, along with many others I'm sure, am getting tired of all the Chinese crap foisted on us by greedy manufacturers. At least there's no lead in my tires( I'll leave it at that!! )
Cheers, Jeff
__________________
2007 Safari 25 FB SE LS
2006 Chev Express 3500 Duramax
Predator tuner
Equal-i-zer hitch
"Home is where the ART is"
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12-09-2007, 10:37 AM
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#25
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Rivet Master
1991 34' Excella
Princeton
, New Jersey
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 7,070
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Before you go to the dealer for work see if you can find a TRUCK AXEL shop. These axles require rebending to aline them. That takes equipement that Jackson doesn't even have as I can attest to from first hand experinece. Picture show my trailer in a shop in Pa. for an alinement after the installation of new axles.
__________________
WBCCI 12156 AIR 3144 WACHUNG TAC NJ6
2004 Excursion 4x4
1991 34 ft. Excella +220,000 miles, new laminated flooring, new upholstery, new 3200 lbs axles
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12-11-2007, 09:23 PM
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#26
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Moderator dude
1966 26' Overlander
Phoenix
, Arizona
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 7,497
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Quote:
Originally Posted by startrekker2001
I had a very similar problem with my 78 31' Excella. The tires on the road side were wearing and cupping.
Vic
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Cupping can be from out of balance running gear or weak shocks. The tire/wheel assy is bouncing as it travels causing uneven wear. The shock dampens the bouncing. The balance fixes the cause. This is not a tire design issue unless the tire (or wheel/hub assy) are grossly out of balance.
>>>>>>>>>>>Action
__________________
1966 Mercury Park Lane 4 DR Breezeway 410 4V, C-6, 2.80 - Streamless.
1966 Lincoln 4 door Convertible 462 4V 1971 Ford LTD Convertible 429 4V Phoenix ~ Yeah it's hot however it's a dry heat!
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12-11-2007, 09:26 PM
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#27
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Moderator dude
1966 26' Overlander
Phoenix
, Arizona
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 7,497
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__________________
1966 Mercury Park Lane 4 DR Breezeway 410 4V, C-6, 2.80 - Streamless.
1966 Lincoln 4 door Convertible 462 4V 1971 Ford LTD Convertible 429 4V Phoenix ~ Yeah it's hot however it's a dry heat!
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12-11-2007, 09:46 PM
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#28
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Rivet Master
Corpus Christi
, Texas
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 936
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Ok.........It's pretty easy to figure out what is wrong. Take a straight edge and place it across both tires on the same side, just below or above the center cap. This will tell you if you have a toe-in/out problem. Look at where the straight edge intersects each tire. There is a possibility the tires are coming apart and will read unevenly. This can be checked by jacking up the trailer and hand spinning the tire checking the sidewall for unevenness by using a stationary fixed point. I used a plastic pail with a stick laying across it. I set the stick about 1/16" away from the tire, held it in position, then spun the tire. If the tire was out of square, it would have shown up. The tire sidewall should always be the same distance from a fixed point when the tire is spinned by hand. With the info from above continue........ find the exact center point of the back of the ball opening at the trailer tongue, then measure very carefully from the exact center point of the back of the ball opening to the closest point of each wheel (usually the inside of the wheel rim. Measure very carefully. If the measurements are within 1/4", the alignment of the axles is probably in the acceptable tolerance range. Mine were the exact same dimension! And..... putting a straight edge across both tires on the same sideconfirmed there was no tow in/out problems. Proceed.
__________________
So Long!
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12-11-2007, 10:48 PM
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#29
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Rivet Master
Airstream Dealer
Corona
, California
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,497
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Thompson
find the exact center point of the back of the ball opening at the trailer tongue, then measure very carefully from the exact center point of the back of the ball opening to the closest point of each wheel (usually the inside of the wheel rim.
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It's easier to use the center of the jack post.
Quote:
Measure very carefully. If the measurements are within 1/4", the alignment of the axles is probably in the acceptable tolerance range. Mine were the exact same dimension! And..... putting a straight edge across both tires on the same sideconfirmed there was no tow in/out problems.
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On a 31 foot trailer, each 1/8 inch difference, will make the trailer, from front to back, tow about 3 inches "dog leg."
A 1/4 inch difference should make the trailer tow about 6 inches "dog leg," and so forth.
A better place to measure is from the center of the jack post, to the lowest leading edge of the axle mounting plates. That dimension should be "exactly" the same.
If that dimension is off, even 1/8 of an inch, then a different alignment procedure must be used to align the axles, since you would not have "exactly" a tandem axle setup, but more so a staggered 4 wheel suspension.
This was some what common in the early 70 and 71 trailers.
This can also apply to a single axle trailer as well.
Andy
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10-16-2008, 03:19 PM
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#30
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Classic 30
Sum Wear
, Ohio
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 594
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Hey Jeff, did you ever resolve this problem? It sounds like I have the same issue. My tires had less than 10K on them when I noticed the problem. The front curb side Marathon was bald on the outside half. The other three tires looked fine. I was in the great state of Utah at the time, so I put the spare Marathon on and continued with the trip. I put about 2500 miles on the spare by the time I got home, but notice no unusual wear on it.
I made an appointment to have an alignment done at Jackson Center. I just got back from that appointment today, and they tell me I don't need an alignment, everything checks out OK. I keep my tires at 65psi and monitor them with Pressure Pro and a standard pressure gauge, so inflation pressure should not be a factor. We decided to watch the new tire carefully, and bring it back in to JC if I see the same thing happening.
Soooo, when I got home I started searching the forums and found this thread. I was wondering how your case turned out.
In this economy, I can't afford a new tire every 10K miles.
Thanks
Dale
__________________
"Only dull people are brilliant at breakfast" - Oscar Wilde
2500HD DMax............30' Classic
__________________
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10-16-2008, 04:10 PM
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#31
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Rivet Master
Airstream Dealer
Corona
, California
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,497
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sky
Hey Jeff, did you ever resolve this problem? It sounds like I have the same issue. My tires had less than 10K on them when I noticed the problem. The front curb side Marathon was bald on the outside half. The other three tires looked fine. I was in the great state of Utah at the time, so I put the spare Marathon on and continued with the trip. I put about 2500 miles on the spare by the time I got home, but notice no unusual wear on it.
I made an appointment to have an alignment done at Jackson Center. I just got back from that appointment today, and they tell me I don't need an alignment, everything checks out OK. I keep my tires at 65psi and monitor them with Pressure Pro and a standard pressure gauge, so inflation pressure should not be a factor. We decided to watch the new tire carefully, and bring it back in to JC if I see the same thing happening.
Soooo, when I got home I started searching the forums and found this thread. I was wondering how your case turned out.
In this economy, I can't afford a new tire every 10K miles.
Thanks
Dale
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Dale.
Abnormal tire wear for most part, is caused by lack of ptoper running gear balance, that is tire, wheel, hub and drum, as an assembly.
You can check the alignment yourself, with a ruler and straight edge.
Each tire should have a tow in of 1/16 inch, plus or minus 1/16 inch.
The bottom of the tires should be more inboard than the top of the tires, again, by a small amount of 3/4 degree plus or minus 3/4 degree.
Andy
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01-13-2009, 11:35 AM
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#32
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4 Rivet Member
1976 29' Ambassador
Madison
, Officially SD but are traveling full time.
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 335
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Going through the threads because I am having problems with irregular tread wear. I found a comment in the AS owners manual. Their explanation for more wear on the curb side is that the "cant" or high center of the road throws more weight onto the curb side tires.
The tires on my '76 Ambassador are bias ply. Took the AS to the local tire shop and they said bias ply tires just wear irregularly and I cannot expect much more that 15K mi out of them. They are cheap but I don't like the poor level of quality in the product.
Anyone know how to check if the shocks are good?
Michael
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01-13-2009, 11:47 AM
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#33
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Rivet Master
Airstream Dealer
Corona
, California
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,497
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eagle & Bear
Going through the threads because I am having problems with irregular tread wear. I found a comment in the AS owners manual. Their explanation for more wear on the curb side is that the "cant" or high center of the road throws more weight onto the curb side tires.
The tires on my '76 Ambassador are bias ply. Took the AS to the local tire shop and they said bias ply tires just wear irregularly and I cannot expect much more that 15K mi out of them. They are cheap but I don't like the poor level of quality in the product.
Anyone know how to check if the shocks are good?
Michael
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30 year old shocks should be replaced.
The running gear should be balanced as an assembly.
The axle could be out of alignment.
A bad axle could cause funny tire wear.
Check out your axles yourself, in 30 seconds.
Dura Torque Axle
Andy
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01-13-2009, 12:21 PM
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#34
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4 Rivet Member
1976 29' Ambassador
Madison
, Officially SD but are traveling full time.
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 335
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Hi Andy,
Thanks for the info. I did have new 8 ply bias ply tires put on 16 months (14,000 mi) ago. They seemed to wear OK but had problems with adjusting breaks. 8 months ago I had new backing plate assemblys installed and drums turned. Brakes work good but tires are all wearing in very weird patterns. Trailer towes good.
It looks like the axles have been changed sometime in the past (original owner died several weeks after I bought the trailer so no real history available). Clear evidence of alignment on rear axle. Tortion arms are slightly negative under load and over 20 deg neg without a load. There is almost 5" between the wheel well edge and the top of the wheel rim. The shocks dont have any rust on them (paint is in tact but not shiny). No signs of leaking from the shocks but the tire wear is irregular.
The tires do not show any signs of toe in or toe out but the tread shows a lot of cupping and heavy wear on the #2 and #4 band on a 5 band tread pattern (outer part of tread is cupped but not heavily worn and center band is not cupped or heavily worn - not consistent with over or under inflation). I thought I should check the shocks anyway but am not sure how.
Michael
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01-13-2009, 12:28 PM
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#35
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Moderator dude
1966 26' Overlander
Phoenix
, Arizona
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 7,497
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eagle & Bear
The tires do not show any signs of toe in or toe out but the tread shows a lot of cupping and heavy wear on the #2 and #4 band on a 5 band tread pattern (outer part of tread is cupped but not heavily worn and center band is not cupped or heavily worn - not consistent with over or under inflation). I thought I should check the shocks anyway but am not sure how.
Michael
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Look at post 26 & 27 above.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Action
__________________
1966 Mercury Park Lane 4 DR Breezeway 410 4V, C-6, 2.80 - Streamless.
1966 Lincoln 4 door Convertible 462 4V 1971 Ford LTD Convertible 429 4V Phoenix ~ Yeah it's hot however it's a dry heat!
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01-08-2015, 07:09 AM
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#36
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4 Rivet Member
2005 25' International CCD
Lilburn
, Georgia
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 285
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Any thing new? Our 2005 25' International has high tire wear on the curb site on both tires. We do have GYM's. It is even across the treads. The street side tires still have plenty of tread left. The tires have been installed for 27 months. We figure we have about 20,000 miles on all of the tires (same age). Discount Tire had no answer. They suggested replacing the two worn tires and put the new ones on the back axle and then put the less worn street side tires on the front axle.
We have a TPMS since we got the new tires so I know the pressure and temps are consistent. We had been running at 65#, but recently have let them go down to 60# (opinion seems to vary as to whether to keep them at the max or adjust based based on load).
I would appreciate any thoughts?
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01-08-2015, 07:17 AM
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#37
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Rivet Master
2007 30' Classic
Oswego
, Illinois
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 13,655
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BeachHouse
Any thing new? Our 2005 25' International has high tire wear on the curb site on both tires. We do have GYM's. It is even across the treads. The street side tires still have plenty of tread left. The tires have been installed for 27 months. We figure we have about 20,000 miles on all of the tires (same age). Discount Tire had no answer. They suggested replacing the two worn tires and put the new ones on the back axle and then put the less worn street side tires on the front axle.
We have a TPMS since we got the new tires so I know the pressure and temps are consistent. We had been running at 65#, but recently have let them go down to 60# (opinion seems to vary as to whether to keep them at the max or adjust based based on load).
I would appreciate any thoughts?
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Have you weighed the trailer side to side? Barring any pressure concerns and tire construction anomalies, weight is the only thing that comes to mind. You state even tire wear across the tread, so alignment is probably not the answer. Do you have pics?
__________________
-Rich-
"If the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy." - Red Green
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01-08-2015, 07:28 AM
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#38
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4 Rivet Member
2005 25' International CCD
Lilburn
, Georgia
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 285
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Haven't ever weighed it. And it isn't loaded differently than it has been in the past. A trip to the scales is in order. We are always in a hurry to get where we are going and don't stop.
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01-08-2015, 07:56 AM
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#39
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Rivet Master
2008 30' Classic S/O
Dearborn
, Michigan
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,403
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regular weighing is good a idea
I CAT every outing, and use my Sherline during loadout
but, I've never come across scales that had independent curb/street side plates
are they available publicly?
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01-08-2015, 08:53 AM
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#40
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Rivet Master
2007 30' Classic
Oswego
, Illinois
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 13,655
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boondockdad
regular weighing is good a idea
I CAT every outing, and use my Sherline during loadout
but, I've never come across scales that had independent curb/street side plates
are they available publicly?
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Just run across with one side off the platform, on the "shoulder" of the scale pad. Align the axles as you would normally do for a single side axle weights. Repeat for the other side.
__________________
-Rich-
"If the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy." - Red Green
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