Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 10-26-2013, 09:58 AM   #15
Rivet Master
 
Currently Looking...
K.C. , Missouri
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 585
Maybe it's just me, but on that trailer, there is no way I would have run anything other than 80psi.
These trailers with two and three axles do some serious twisting of tires when making turns, especially tight turns. In that situation, everything I have come to understand about it, having max inflation is always a good thing.

Of all the trailers I run, and have run over the years, I have never personally experienced tire wear that would indicate over inflation to any severe degree, and I always run at max sidewall stated psi. That's my two cents.....worth just about what you paid for it !
__________________

__________________
gmw photos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 07:59 AM   #16
Rivet Master
 
Wingeezer's Avatar
 
2005 30' Classic
Burlington , Ontario
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 2,708
Quote:
Originally Posted by HowieE View Post
Yes in looking back at you ware patterns I have to agree that is most likely not an alignment issue. Alinement issue generally tend to show on 2 tires, The misaligned one and to a lesser degree one on the opposite side of the trailer.

To ware tires to that extent in 14,000 miles there is a problem somewhere. I would think you would see, as you walk past them, tires that where that much under inflation and would assume they would have exploded from heat build up long ago. Do you check the tires with a mechanical gauge or intentionally drop the pressure in a tire to test the TPMS ever?

I would find it hard to believe that 3 brakes could be dragging but given the ware and low mileage could they be dragging?

Hello Howie,

I do use a TPMS, the kind that screws onto the valve stems. We have to store our trailer quite far from our home, and whenever we put the trailer back in the storage facility, I remove the sensors and bring them home & remove the batteries.

When we go to pick up the trailer for our next trip, I take an air compressor and digital tire gauge and ensure that the tires are aired up to whatever pressure I want before putting the sensors back on, so yes, they do get checked quite regularly.

So far my TPMS seems to work very well.

The only thing I can think so far is the the pressures I was using were too low for my setup. I used 55psi for the first year or so on the tires then bumped it up to 60.

Now that I have the new 16" Michelins on, I will use 75 or 80psi and see how it goes.

If I see the same pattern starting to develop then I will certainly have the axles checked.

Thing is though that if it turns out there is a problem with alignment that cannot be corrected without replacing the axles (I think they can be tweaked to a degree) then it is probably more economical to buy new tires after 14k mies rather than but two new axles!

We shall see!

Brian.
__________________

__________________
Brian & Connie Mitchell

2005 Classic 30'
Hensley Arrow / Centramatics
2008 GMC Sierra SLT 2500HD,4x4,Crew Cab, Diesel, Leer cap.
Wingeezer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 08:05 AM   #17
Rivet Master
 
Wingeezer's Avatar
 
2005 30' Classic
Burlington , Ontario
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 2,708
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmw photos View Post
Maybe it's just me, but on that trailer, there is no way I would have run anything other than 80psi.
These trailers with two and three axles do some serious twisting of tires when making turns, especially tight turns. In that situation, everything I have come to understand about it, having max inflation is always a good thing.

Of all the trailers I run, and have run over the years, I have never personally experienced tire wear that would indicate over inflation to any severe degree, and I always run at max sidewall stated psi. That's my two cents.....worth just about what you paid for it !

I've always had a sort of feeling in life that it is never good to continually push something to its max, but perhaps in the case of trailer tires it is the right thing to do!

I'll be giving it a try with my latest set of tires!


Thanks …….. Brian.
__________________
Brian & Connie Mitchell

2005 Classic 30'
Hensley Arrow / Centramatics
2008 GMC Sierra SLT 2500HD,4x4,Crew Cab, Diesel, Leer cap.
Wingeezer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 09:11 AM   #18
Moderator
 
jcanavera's Avatar

 
2004 30' Classic Slideout
Fenton , Missouri
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 9,002
Images: 143
Send a message via AIM to jcanavera Send a message via Skype™ to jcanavera
Quote:
Originally Posted by HowieE View Post
Do not take an alignment problem to JC. They do not have the equipment to align axles. If your axles need work, and your description tells me they do, find a Truck Axle Shop for the work.
Just curious. My last trip to Jackson Center was in 2001. At that time they were aligning axles since the fellow next to me had a Hi-Lo. He was there for an axle alignment. Hi-Lo's used the same axles as Airstreams and JC accepted appointments for alignments at that time on SOB's, as long as the axle was Henschen built.

Jack
__________________
Jack Canavera
STL Mo.
AIR #56
'04 Classic 30' S.O.,'03 GMC Savana 2500,'14 Honda CTX 700
jcanavera is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 09:19 AM   #19
Rivet Master
 
Currently Looking...
K.C. , Missouri
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 585
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingeezer View Post
I've always had a sort of feeling in life that it is never good to continually push something to its max, but perhaps in the case of trailer tires it is the right thing to do!

I'll be giving it a try with my latest set of tires!


Thanks .. Brian.
Brian,
I agree that it's not good to push things to their "max". In this case when we are talking about max values, the way I understand it, the real "max" number is the load the tire can carry ( as stated in pounds of load for that tire ) and the psi number is simply the inflation at which that tire is rated for that load.

In an overall sense in this case of an engineered product, using 80 psi is doing the tires a favor as it allows the tire to run cooler, which is always a good thing. It also allows the the tire carcass to be most resistant to the internal shear forces at play when cornering a tandem ( or triple ) axle trailer.

At least all that is my take on it. For what little it may be worth, I have four trailers I pull regularly, three of which have load range E tires. I always maintain them at 80psi, and it works for me.

Now then, having said all that, I can't comment on this whole "soft ride" idea as it relates to Airstream trailers. I guess that is a whole 'nuther subject....
__________________
gmw photos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 09:40 AM   #20
Rivet Master
 
HowieE's Avatar
 
1991 34' Excella
Princeton , New Jersey
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 6,811
Images: 12
I replaced the axles, 3, on my trailer 6 or 7 years ago for $2400.00 checked them and went straight to the shop and paid @600.00 for an alignment. There is now over 50,000 on those tires. You do the math.

As I mentioned above, upon re-looking, it does not look like you have an axle problem. I don't know what your trailer weighs so I can not check the recommended tire pressure. You should.

A test that may answer the question of brake drag would be to drive on an interstate for at least 25 miles and coast into a rest area without using the brakes, other than at the very end and check the hub temperatures. If you can't touch and hold the wheels the brakes are dragging. Constant drag would produce the type of ware you are seeing on 3 tires.

Unless you send the TP system back for recalibration to the recommended tire pressure they will not be of any value if you raise the tire pressure.
__________________
WBCCI 12156 AIR 3144 WACHUNG TAC NJ6
2004 Excursion 4x4
1991 34 ft. Excella +220,000 miles, new laminated flooring, new upholstery, new 3200 lbs axles

HowieE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 11:13 AM   #21
Rivet Master
Commercial Member
 
Ravenna , Ohio
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 690
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingeezer View Post
Hello Howie,

I do use a TPMS, the kind that screws onto the valve stems. We have to store our trailer quite far from our home, and whenever we put the trailer back in the storage facility, I remove the sensors and bring them home & remove the batteries.

When we go to pick up the trailer for our next trip, I take an air compressor and digital tire gauge and ensure that the tires are aired up to whatever pressure I want before putting the sensors back on, so yes, they do get checked quite regularly.

So far my TPMS seems to work very well.

The only thing I can think so far is the the pressures I was using were too low for my setup. I used 55psi for the first year or so on the tires then bumped it up to 60.

Now that I have the new 16" Michelins on, I will use 75 or 80psi and see how it goes.

If I see the same pattern starting to develop then I will certainly have the axles checked.

Thing is though that if it turns out there is a problem with alignment that cannot be corrected without replacing the axles (I think they can be tweaked to a degree) then it is probably more economical to buy new tires after 14k mies rather than but two new axles!

We shall see!

Brian.

Glad to hear you have been using TPMS and confirming pressure before each trip. The dealer you bought the trailer from should have pointed out the tire placard on left front side of the trailer that shows the minimum cold inflation for the original size tires.

You might find THIS post educational and posts on my blog on why multi-axle trailers should run tires at the inflation molded on the tire sidewall.
__________________
Retired tire engineer (40 years). Write a blog on RV tires.
Tireman9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2013, 07:40 AM   #22
Rivet Master
 
Wingeezer's Avatar
 
2005 30' Classic
Burlington , Ontario
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 2,708
Quote:
Originally Posted by HowieE View Post
I replaced the axles, 3, on my trailer 6 or 7 years ago for $2400.00 checked them and went straight to the shop and paid @600.00 for an alignment. There is now over 50,000 on those tires. You do the math.

As I mentioned above, upon re-looking, it does not look like you have an axle problem. I don't know what your trailer weighs so I can not check the recommended tire pressure. You should.

A test that may answer the question of brake drag would be to drive on an interstate for at least 25 miles and coast into a rest area without using the brakes, other than at the very end and check the hub temperatures. If you can't touch and hold the wheels the brakes are dragging. Constant drag would produce the type of ware you are seeing on 3 tires.

Unless you send the TP system back for recalibration to the recommended tire pressure they will not be of any value if you raise the tire pressure.

Howie,

I'm pretty sure my brakes are not causing any problem, I do my own bearing repacks yearly and check the brakes at that time. I have also carried an IR thermometer on trips at times - although I don't always do it - and checked wheel temps near the hubs at gas stops - never seen any indication of a problem.

In fact the only problem I have ever had with my brakes is . no brakes due to brake wires breaking! I now sometimes walk around the trailer with a compass and have my wife apply the brakes and watch the compass needle swing to confirm that the magnets are energizing on all wheels.

My TPMS also has the capability of monitoring temperatures - I have no idea how it works, i.e. if it just translates pressure increase to temperature or actually measures temperature transmitted through the metal valve stem. I suspect it may not be very accurate, but if I saw one wheel reading much higher than the others I would certainly stop and take a look!

You must use a different TPMS that I have - mine is a relatively inexpensive '"Hawkshead" system using screw on sensors on each stem. I like it because I can change batteries in the sensors very easily.

With a few button presses on the TPMS monitor I can tell the unit the normal tire pressure that I want it to monitor.

I have just reset the TPMS from 60psi on all wheels up to 75 psi since installing the 16" wheels, and based on what I am reading on these posts will likely move it up to 80 psi before our next trip!

Brian.
__________________
Brian & Connie Mitchell

2005 Classic 30'
Hensley Arrow / Centramatics
2008 GMC Sierra SLT 2500HD,4x4,Crew Cab, Diesel, Leer cap.
Wingeezer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2013, 08:03 AM   #23
Rivet Master
 
Wingeezer's Avatar
 
2005 30' Classic
Burlington , Ontario
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 2,708
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tireman9 View Post
Glad to hear you have been using TPMS and confirming pressure before each trip. The dealer you bought the trailer from should have pointed out the tire placard on left front side of the trailer that shows the minimum cold inflation for the original size tires.

You might find THIS post educational and posts on my blog on why multi-axle trailers should run tires at the inflation molded on the tire sidewall.
Tireman,

Many thanks for the link to your blog, lots of good info there and I will spend more time on it!

I notice that the "Tire Traker" TPMS on your blog appears to be identical to the one I have that is marketed under the "Hawkshead" brand - bought here in Canada.

I have been very pleased with it. I do like the convenience of being able to change batteries. I did find the batteries a little expensive locally - one specialist battery shop unbelievably wanted to charge me $8 apiece!

I didn't buy! I then found that I can buy the batteries 20 at a time or for about that amount on Ebay (Hong Kong) with free shipping! They are not stale-dated and appear to work just fine - I suspect they probably come from the same place as the $8 apiece ones offered locally! I now carry a good supply of spares!

Incidentally, do you know how the temperature monitor works on this TPMS system? Is there actually a temperature sensor that is influenced by heat transmitted through the metal valve stem, or does it just monitor ambient temp and somehow add a correction factor calculated from the increase in tire pressure due to heating of the tire?

Just curious, I often wondered!

Brian.


PS - recently bought a second "Hawkshead" TPMS from a friend who no longer tows a trailer and i use it on my motorcycle. I'm a bit more conceded about the possibility of tire problems on the bike rather than the trailer!
__________________
Brian & Connie Mitchell

2005 Classic 30'
Hensley Arrow / Centramatics
2008 GMC Sierra SLT 2500HD,4x4,Crew Cab, Diesel, Leer cap.
Wingeezer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2013, 09:39 AM   #24
Rivet Master
Commercial Member
 
Ravenna , Ohio
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 690
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingeezer View Post
Tireman,

Many thanks for the link to your blog, lots of good info there and I will spend more time on it!

I notice that the "Tire Traker" TPMS on your blog appears to be identical to the one I have that is marketed under the "Hawkshead" brand - bought here in Canada.

I have been very pleased with it. I do like the convenience of being able to change batteries. I did find the batteries a little expensive locally - one specialist battery shop unbelievably wanted to charge me $8 apiece!

I didn't buy! I then found that I can buy the batteries 20 at a time or for about that amount on Ebay (Hong Kong) with free shipping! They are not stale-dated and appear to work just fine - I suspect they probably come from the same place as the $8 apiece ones offered locally! I now carry a good supply of spares!

Incidentally, do you know how the temperature monitor works on this TPMS system? Is there actually a temperature sensor that is influenced by heat transmitted through the metal valve stem, or does it just monitor ambient temp and somehow add a correction factor calculated from the increase in tire pressure due to heating of the tire?

Just curious, I often wondered!

Brian.


PS - recently bought a second "Hawkshead" TPMS from a friend who no longer tows a trailer and i use it on my motorcycle. I'm a bit more conceded about the possibility of tire problems on the bike rather than the trailer!

Though I have never dissected a TPM sensor to confirm I believe the temperature sensing is done with a thermocouple as part of the sensor. The tests i have run show different temperatures at different pressures so it is not calculating pressure from the pressure. One reason you will see variation is that the temperature accuracy is not as good as the pressure accuracy based on my testing, but it is good enough. Remember your temp sensor is outside the tire being cooled by rain or air flow so it is not reading the hot spot of the tire.

I have run a number of tests on TPMS and have published the test data on my blog if you are interested. Traker is a sponsor of the blog I write for. I do not control the blog or have any say on who advertises on it. I just write the posts. I bought the Traker system I use a couple of years ago.
__________________
Retired tire engineer (40 years). Write a blog on RV tires.
Tireman9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2013, 07:28 PM   #25
Rivet Master
 
A W Warn's Avatar
 
2000 25' Safari
1999 34' Excella
Davidson County, NC , Highlands County, FL
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,568
Quote:
Originally Posted by HowieE View Post
Do not take an alignment problem to JC. They do not have the equipment to align axles. If your axles need work, and your description tells me they do, find a Truck Axle Shop for the work.
I ran across a post in another thread that contradicts this information. Someone actually at JC having an alignment done. Post # 27 in this thread.
http://www.airforums.com/forums/f44/...ml#post1376586
__________________
Alan
2014 Silverado 1500 Crew Cab 5.3L maximum trailering package (yes, I'm towing the 34')
A W Warn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2013, 08:28 PM   #26
Rivet Master
 
HowieE's Avatar
 
1991 34' Excella
Princeton , New Jersey
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 6,811
Images: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by A W Warn View Post
I ran across a post in another thread that contradicts this information. Someone actually at JC having an alignment done. Post # 27 in this thread.
http://www.airforums.com/forums/f44/...ml#post1376586
I read the post in point and fail to see how it contradicts my comment that JC does not have the capacity to do an axle alignment. It states that he was there to have one done. The results are not mentioned.

Generally I offer my comment here from personnel experience. I did take my trailer to JC for an axle alignment. If you consider running the trailer up on Pep Boy car ramps, some cinder blocks and 2 2x10s and then running a string down each side of the trailer an adequate approach then feel free to partake. After that experience and when I called back to JC question the fact that they had done nothing they did give me the name of a truck axle shop, much close to home, that could do the work. The attached picture shows a more professional setup.

Alinement of this type of axle requires being able to Bend the axle. Since bending an axle effect both sides it require considerable knowledge and very heavy equipment. Raising the trailer on car ramps is not going to provide the working area required to give results.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	130_3084.JPG
Views:	56
Size:	262.3 KB
ID:	199482  
__________________

__________________
WBCCI 12156 AIR 3144 WACHUNG TAC NJ6
2004 Excursion 4x4
1991 34 ft. Excella +220,000 miles, new laminated flooring, new upholstery, new 3200 lbs axles

HowieE is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:29 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.