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Old 03-01-2015, 09:38 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by Tom Nugler View Post
Things must be a lot different down south. Every tire that's changed out on a clients car up here stays inside the shop and is taken off site by a licensed tire recycler. If I found out someone here was taking tires and reselling them, let alone repairing and selling them, they'd be written up if not terminated.
At the new car dealership level tires are generally warranted by the manufacturer and not the car company. Any repairs are covered by our 12/12 warranty. With $900+ wheel and tire assemblies we're not going to take that hit for a failed cheap repair.
Tireman. You should have posted a pic of a tire that looks perfect on the outside with a handful of ground up rubber rolling around on the inside after being run nearly flat for a while. The monkeys at Wall-Mart, Pep-Boys, Jiffy-Lube, et-al would never have caught this jamming a string inside the nail hole, over-inflating the tire and sending the guy down the road waiting for an accident to happen.
I'm interested if the OP knows how the tire was repaired, or if this discussion has scared him off.
I've been in the biz for 42 years and I've seen a lot of things that were done by “professionals” that don't come close to be what could be considered contemporary professional standards.


Tom
I always like this "professional" work
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Old 03-01-2015, 09:44 AM   #30
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I don't disagree with any of that except where I am to throw a $600 tire away because it has a nail in it 1/2" too close to the edge of the tire.

Especially when I am convinced in my mind that if were to leave it at the shop it would be patched and sold as used.


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Just hope you are never involved in an accident where a hungry lawyer is involved. I worked as consultant in a case involving a fatality. Everyone that had touched, sold or serviced the car for a two year period was involved. They all ended up paying a share of the settlement and legal fees even though the facts indicated it was 100% driver error.

A grieving widow will win over evil business owners almost every time.
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Old 03-01-2015, 12:21 PM   #31
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Lol, a person can do everything right and get their donkey handed them by a "hungry lawyer".

Like I said, there is a higher likelihood of food poisoning, many, many, many times over than a properly applied patch beyond the center three ribs of the tread causing a problem, and much higher still that it will cause an accident.

Taking a shower is a risk, and I will stick by my words that a regular old flat repair on a regular old puncture beyond the center third of the tread and not in the sidewall is an extremely small risk that sells a lot of tires.

As far as your mention of tires being run low or flat changing the game, I mentioned this in my first post to this thread.


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Old 03-01-2015, 12:25 PM   #32
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http://youtu.be/mBs8wqqRQ3M


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Old 03-01-2015, 12:39 PM   #33
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Am I the only one that finds it interesting that, by my count at least, we have two Tire Engineers on this forum, and I've never read either one make a definite statement about a tire, good or bad, but only vague innuendo's of what might result if whatever the topic is about actually does happen?

In every situation there is a worst case possibility.
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Old 03-01-2015, 04:29 PM   #34
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You would thing at this stage in tire evolution that they could make a tire that is repairable across the entire tread width..

#JustSayin.


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Old 03-01-2015, 07:04 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by J. Morgan View Post
You would thing at this stage in tire evolution that they could make a tire that is repairable across the entire tread width..

#JustSayin.


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Yea, and one that wouldn't come apart for no apparent reason.
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Old 03-01-2015, 08:50 PM   #36
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I think this was done just to get the solvents in the glue to "dry" or flash-off faster so they could hurry up and finish the "repair". This is NOT part of any proper repair practice instruction I have ever seen.
I decided to call him in Colorado where he now lives and he said he sometimes lit the solvent. He said the clamp to hold the patch on the tire was electric and got hot. He said shops now look at the date code before they patch a tire. Anything to sell you a new tire....
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Old 03-02-2015, 05:58 AM   #37
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First I want to comment on the Ford/Firestone thing a few years back. I examined this is detail and published my results here:

Barry's Tire Tech

The data suggests that Firestone did indeed have a problem worse than other tire manufacturers. They had a design that was more prone to separation, and they had a process that produced rubber that wasn't as good as well. Their own data shows that other designs and other plants performed better.

The data also suggests that Ford was not the source of Firestone's problem. The information I provided doesn't address the vehicle itself and whether or not the vehicle was more prone to accidents than other similar vehicles.

Second I want to talk about repairs and tire failure.

I know it is difficult to understand that part of the problem of repaired tire is that the tire was leaking and therefore being run underinflated, (and hence more prone to failure). Unfortunately, it is difficult to sort out if a repaired tire failed because it was built inadequately or failed because it was run underinflated (due to the leak that was repaired.)

As I said earlier, there is a risk running repaired tires. And whether or not to run a repaired tire becomes an exercise in how much risk are you willing to take. The other end of this risk is that the consequences are sometimes quite severe. Each person is going to have a different take on the risk vs vs consequence vs benefit. I only want people to understand that there is a risk and to face it head on as they make their decision.
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Old 03-03-2015, 03:53 AM   #38
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A repaired tire is at best a spare tire, IMO.
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Old 03-03-2015, 08:38 AM   #39
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Smile tire repair

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Originally Posted by r carl View Post
I decided to call him in Colorado where he now lives and he said he sometimes lit the solvent. He said the clamp to hold the patch on the tire was electric and got hot. He said shops now look at the date code before they patch a tire. Anything to sell you a new tire....
Before tubeless tires every tire had tubes, that I patched many, the norm was spread glue light w/match making glue very sticky ready to apply patch, nothing was ever done with casing unless needed boot, also some patches in metal pan with thermo then light with match these were clamped onto tube. I have never seen electric heat type, not they were not around just never saw any. These types did not use glue, also scuffed tube w/sandpaper or else patch would fail, now my flats are repaired at large tire shop w/plug & patch, unless tube type on some off road equip. then old fashioned way.
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Old 03-03-2015, 09:32 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by CapriRacer View Post
....................................

Second I want to talk about repairs and tire failure.

I know it is difficult to understand that part of the problem of repaired tire is that the tire was leaking and therefore being run underinflated, (and hence more prone to failure). Unfortunately, it is difficult to sort out if a repaired tire failed because it was built inadequately or failed because it was run underinflated (due to the leak that was repaired.) .................
CapriRacer,

Will you expand a little on the definition of the term "underinflated"? What does that really mean?
For example: For all of my trailers the trailer manufacturer recommends a specific inflation pressure. Typically, I think, most of us have more pressure in our trailer tires than the trailer manufacturer recommended (are we over inflated?), but less than the tire manufacturer's maximum pressure. If a slow leak develops in the tire, at what pressure point does the tire become "underinflated" and possibly damaged?
Does it have to do with exceeding the tire's load capacity at a specific pressure or being below the trailer manufacturer's recommendations?

Thanks for all the information you provide!
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Old 03-03-2015, 09:46 AM   #41
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I run about 25 psi in the rear tires of my Ranger but there is no weight in it. Anything more than than and they wear in the center. Now in an explorer, I would never do that since it has more weight back there. An explorer is basically an SUV on a ranger chassis.

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The real problem in the Explorer/Firestone thing was the fact that Ford had such a miserable riding vehicle that they specified the tires be run at 24psi to attempt to cover up the horrible ride of the Explorer.

Anyone with any knowledge/experience with tires run at low air pressures at highway speeds knows the tires will get overheated and come apart. Simple physics of tires. Why do you think we run 65psi or higher in our trailer tires?

Granted the Firestones were not the greatest tires in the world, but the real problem was running them at 24psi., the Ford specified air pressure.
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Old 03-03-2015, 09:51 AM   #42
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I did have a plug patch fail one time and it was on a high miliage tire. I hit a rail road crossing just right and it must have lifted the patch off. It may not have been installed correctly. I had the tire patched again and no more more problems. I have had more than one of the old plugs fail.

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