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Old 09-06-2010, 02:44 PM   #15
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this is one of those wildly repeated and often believed totally RED HERRINGS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingeezer View Post
...Conversely, to run it at 65psi would result in a stiffer and potentially mode damaging ride to the trailer?...
according to the PREZ of a/stream...

axles determine ride quality, not minor variations in tires.

IF u took your stream to j/c for tires,

they would use D rated and inflate to 65 psi.

one CAN order Es at j/c but they offer those as an OPTION to appease...

so DO what the experts do or try something different, your choice.
________

old tired axles cause problems which are often BLAMED on tires, are the axles shot?
________

if u read the links already provided the 50 vs 65 psi issue is covered.
________

ONE sensible reason to go with the M tires is...

they can be purchased with road hazard coverage.

that's also covered in da'links.
________

allowing for speeds of 65-75 includes...

PROPERLY inflated tires (or 10 psi more than the load only inflation)

STORED tires crack or age asymmetrically from NOT moving.

keeping them UP inflated reduces that issue.
_______

anyone got mice in da'stream and need advice on catching, killing or eliminating them?



cheers
2air'
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Old 09-06-2010, 02:44 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by r carl View Post
If you compare D and E Maxxis tires at the tire store they have the same thin flimsy sidewalls, and prolly the same number of ply's but stronger cord in the ply's. They will ride similar. I talked to a guy that eats, sleeps, and breathes tires 24-7-365days a yr. He told me in 225-75-15 size, only buy E rated ones as the others are junk no matter what the brand, given the present choice nowdays. If you buy the E rated ones just air them up as you did your D tires, just because they are rated E doesnt mean you have to inflate them to their max pressure, its the load your inflating for.

Many thanks for the added info ......... Brian.
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Old 09-06-2010, 02:47 PM   #17
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Brian, figuring out what tire pressure it appropriate for a given use is not easy. Some say to use whatever is stamped on the side of the tire. But the tires that come on your car or truck probably have higher numbers than that recommended by the truck or car manufacturer. Airstream, when they mount Load Range E tires, will inflate them to the maximum; they should know better.

But, like r carl says, inflate to the pressure needed for the weight on the axles. Check tables. After you use them for a while, check the tread depth with a gauge to see how they are wearing. Too much pressure will wear the center too much, too little will wear the outside too much.

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Old 09-06-2010, 03:03 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by CrawfordGene View Post
1st sentence—I don't agree...
that u "don't agree" is irrelevant.

the M8008s are are all listed at 9/32 nds.

and the claim of seeing different tread depths...

on LT tires of the same SIZE/model/brand, but different load rating...

is just a claim, prove it or fold yer hand.
________

suggesting one LOOK for tread wear ratings where NONE exist (no UTQG=no rating)

is like suggesting one LOOK to catch a fish in the stream shower pan...

since water MIGHT mean fish are near by.

cheers
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Old 09-06-2010, 04:03 PM   #19
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Check the Michelin website for the various versions of LTX tires—quite a few of the same size come in E and D or E and C range and have different tread depths. They call the C or D's "P" tires and the E's "LT". There are LT 275/70R18 Load Range E that come in either 17 or 14.5/32 and LT 275/70R18 LR E that comes in either 17 or 15.6/32.

I'm not seeing the fed tire ratings for LT tires on that website now as they lower load ranges are now P tires, not LT. Those were previously called LT and then had the ratings. Anyway, I was suggesting to look for whatever you can find. Rules change frequently and what wasn't true yesterday may become true today.

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Old 09-06-2010, 04:21 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingeezer View Post
That was something I wasn't sure about - I thought perhaps they had to be inflated to a minimum 65psi for proper performance and they might overheat at lower pressures.


From your comment about sidewall structure I suppose that -if inflated to equal pressures one shouldn't expect any real significant ride difference from E vs D with the Maxxis tires.

Brian
Tire pressure is adjusted so you get even tire wear across the tread. Too little pressure you get wear on the outside ribs and too much pressure you get wear on the middle 3 ribs.
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Old 09-06-2010, 04:32 PM   #21
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Maxxis E's. I am on my third season with these tires and have had no problems with tires or the alleged stiff ride.
Hot weather, sustained freeway driving did away with most of my D rated GYM's and their replacements, until I replaced the survivors with Maxxis E's. They have soaked up all the hot weather freeway driving I have done including one round trip from Tucson to Fort Lauderdale.
They have logged quite a few miles in Mexico where the roads are much rougher and have not damaged my 25 ft. 2004 Safari in any way. I run them with 75 pounds of pressure and try to stay under 65 mph and slow up when the roads get really rough.
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Old 09-06-2010, 04:55 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by handn View Post
Maxxis E's. I am on my third season with these tires and have had no problems with tires or the alleged stiff ride.
Hot weather, sustained freeway driving did away with most of my D rated GYM's and their replacements, until I replaced the survivors with Maxxis E's. They have soaked up all the hot weather freeway driving I have done including one round trip from Tucson to Fort Lauderdale.
They have logged quite a few miles in Mexico where the roads are much rougher and have not damaged my 25 ft. 2004 Safari in any way. I run them with 75 pounds of pressure and try to stay under 65 mph and slow up when the roads get really rough.
Sounds encouraging, but can I ask why you run them at such a high pressure? wouldn't the weight of your trailer suggest that you would run them around 50psi or maybe even less?

Just curious & wanting to learn what I can here!

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Old 09-06-2010, 05:55 PM   #23
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There have been many posts elsewhere about tire pressures. After looking at the tables, I decided my Michelin LT Load Range E tires deserved 68 lbs. So far they are wearing evenly across all the tires after about 16,000 miles. These are 16" tires since you can't get 15" Michelins in the right size, but that shouldn't make any difference.

I run 48 lbs rear and 45 front on our Tundra with Michelin LR E tires when towing. I discussed the truck tire pressure with several people at Michelin and took the advice of the one who obviously was most experienced. These are also wearing evenly and presently have 34,000 miles. If I had checked the tables and picked a tire pressure for the truck from them, I think it would have been higher, though not as high as the trailer. The Tundra doesn't weight quite what the trailer weighs. I don't know why Michelin recommends less pressure. I have to do some thinking about that.

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Old 09-08-2010, 10:09 AM   #24
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I would look at the GVWR and then find tires that are 110% of that figure. The Airstream website has a poor copy of a page out of the owner's manual for the specs. I believe the GVWR is 8700 # for a 30' Classic w/o slide out. (The max the trailer was designed to carrry. your actual weight will be determined at a scale) Assuming you have 4 tires, 2200 for each tire is where you are at. Multiply that by 110% roughly and you are at 2420. At max pressure (65PSI) a "D" range will be something like 2540 on a 15" stock rim. At 60 PSI the tires will handle 2380 #'s. Having more in my opinion is a waste of cash. Again my personal opinion is tires failures are mostly due to ignorance ..... being too old, incorrect pressure or not sized correctly for the load.

This all assumes you are loaded to the max. You may find that you are not there. And then you can back down on pressure. Not knowning is an issue. If your trailer is fully loaded at 7000#'s having a larger load capacity tire is a waste of cash. Then there is an issue of the wheel load capacity as mentioned above with the higher cap tires. I am not sure about all of the alarm, however it has some merit.

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Old 09-08-2010, 11:06 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Action View Post
I would look at the GVWR and then find tires that are 110% of that figure. The Airstream website has a poor copy of a page out of the owner's manual for the specs. I believe the GVWR is 8700 # for a 30' Classic w/o slide out. (The max the trailer was designed to carrry. your actual weight will be determined at a scale) Assuming you have 4 tires, 2200 for each tire is where you are at. Multiply that by 110% roughly and you are at 2420. At max pressure (65PSI) a "D" range will be something like 2540 on a 15" stock rim. At 60 PSI the tires will handle 2380 #'s. Having more in my opinion is a waste of cash. Again my personal opinion is tires failures are mostly due to ignorance ..... being too old, incorrect pressure or not sized correctly for the load.

This all assumes you are loaded to the max. You may find that you are not there. And then you can back down on pressure. Not knowning is an issue. If your trailer is fully loaded at 7000#'s having a larger load capacity tire is a waste of cash. Then there is an issue of the wheel load capacity as mentioned above with the higher cap tires. I am not sure about all of the alarm, however it has some merit.

>>>>>>>>>Action
Thanks for the info.


Our trailer is a 2005 Classic 30. It does not have a slide, but the info plate shows a GVW of 8700# nonetheless.

The UVW - unloaded vehicle weight - shows as 7309#


The more I dig into the whole tire issue, the more confusing it gets!

Basically, I am at a point where I want to replace my GYM's because they are 5 years old.

I have only had the trailer a couple of years and made two cross country trips with it and a few shorter trips. No problems with the tires, but I was thinking to switch from the GYM's to another brand just because so many people here on the forum seem to have had bad luck with the GYM's

I don't want to waste money, but I want to do all I can to minimize chances of a blowout and costly body damage. That's why I was wondering if moving up tp a LRE tire would be wise. A few folks seem to have gone to Maxxis LRE tires.

Today, I spoke with local Maxxis dealers and they say that cannot presently get me either LRD or LRE in a trailer tire and that they have been back ordered for a long time.

They were able to offer me either GYM's or Carlisle tires, the latter in LRD or LRE. The tire shop's opinion was that the LRE would give me a little better assurance, but perhaps a tad rougher ride.

Not sure which we to go at present - I think f I'm going to be spending $$$ I should do a bit of research into ST tires vs. 16" LT tires & see what that's all about! Better to find out now that after buying 4 new 15" ST tires!

I have had problems with the Alcoa alloy wheels on this trailer. After I bought it and went on the first long trip, I found hairline cracks in a number of spokes on both wheels on the back axle.


They could well have been there when i bought the trailer, you almost needed a magnifying glass to see them. I am pretty sure the previous owner was towing a trailer behind the AS, it had a 2" receiver and trailer wiring at the back when I bought it. I have removed the hitch - don't see any signs that it has cause any separation damage.

Alcoa replaced the cracked wheels for me under warranty and ever since I have been keeping a close eye on them. They seem fine, but I believe they are marginal in capacity for this size trailer and I wouldn't mind having higher- rated wheels.

Decisions decisions!!

Thanks again - your point about having the trailer weighed is taken, I really should do that!

Brian.
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Old 09-08-2010, 11:50 AM   #26
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are the tires 5 years old?

as i recall this is the 2nd set of tires on that trailer?

suggesting the ORIGINALs were replace very early

and THAT may be why tiny cracks were found in 2 alcoa rims.
______

the alcoas are rate to 2200 lbs were in use for many many year.

on a 30 SLIDE they are marginal but for other rigs more than adequate.

these are LIGHT rims and gyms are relatively LIGHT tires.

keeping the UNsprung weight down

works WITH the a/s suspension and adds to the famous RIDE QUALITY.
_______

you gotta motobike? imagine putting 2-3 lbs of water or sand in each tire...

how would that affect the suspension and durability of shocks/springs and hubs?

the same issues exist going to 16s or heavier tires or BOTH...

unsprung weight goes UP and that's not a good thing.

how long will it be 4 issues to show up as a result? who knows...

but for someone WORRIED about shakin' the stream apart this is NOT a wise move.
__________

if u are worried about a flat tearing up the trailer USE A TPMS so that u are aware of tire deflations.

then actually INSTALL and use it.

wheel well damage is NOT instantaneous.

again think logically about each issue and the sequence.
__________

it is amazing that folks who have had GOOD personal performance from a product (gyms AND alcoa)

would let CHATTER on the web influence buying...

larger rims and LT tires only ADD COST to your stream'n life

and may cause wear/vibration issues NOT yet know about.

for example shocks that SHOULD last decades may need replacement in 3-5 years...

but that time passing hasn't happened YET to most switchers.
_________

this stuff gets confusing HERE because many of the threads/posts suggesting owners SWITCH STUFF...

are written by vendors or masked identity accounts for those connected to the industries SELLING stuff.

the amount of this type of activity on this site is much higher than might be imagined.

then once a real owner makes the LEAP,

they quickly claim it "SAVED ME oh lord" without much time to really evaluate the change...

it's a placebo effect and as sure as the sun rotates round da'earth.
________

now practically thinking...

aren't u about to PUT THE STREAM to bed for d'winter?

aren't u gonna do the tire thing next spring?

why let NEW tires sit UNrollin' all winter.

or is this a "i'm travelin soon and need new tires" thing?

cheers
2air'
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Old 09-08-2010, 11:55 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingeezer View Post

The more I dig into the whole tire issue, the more confusing it gets!

Not sure which we to go at present - I think f I'm going to be spending $$$ I should do a bit of research into ST tires vs. 16" LT tires & see what that's all about!

Decisions decisions!!
'geezer,

Tires are a contentious and difficult study. Our decision was expedited by the OEM wheels looking bad after 18 months—the clear coat was coming off. I worked out a deal with Airstream and got 16" wheels, I would picked up Michelin LR E tires in Dayton and Airstream mounted them.

Michelins are a very smooth riding tire and even an E tire rides smoother than the C Load Range OEM tires that came on our truck (we used LR E tires on our truck too). So the brand matters too.

You have to make sure a 16" tire will fit. I measured and measured again and then again. This is not something you want to be wrong about. You can find wheel diameters on the manufacturer's website and some tire store chains will also have that info on their websites. Some people have had to modify the front and rear wheel cutouts by cutting a small part out and bending back the aluminum trim. This appears to be fairly easy, though we didn't have to do it.

Changing from 15" to 16" means the trailer will be 1/2" higher and may require changing hitch adjustments. In recent years Airstream wheels have a 0˚ offset—this is important and you will have to make sure what the offset is for your trailer. Some tire shops will disregard this.

There are lengthy threads on this question so you can spend weeks reading and being more confused.

We are happy with the switch. The Michelins ride smoother, have mud and snow tread so if we run into snow, we feel better, and the Michelins hold air better than the Marathons ever did. Maybe Marathons are only good for 26 miles.

Gene
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Old 09-08-2010, 12:31 PM   #28
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2Air,

You, sir, have an amazing memory, or do you just have an excellent way of capturing info/history on all of us with your 'puter!

In any event, you are exactly correct in that my tires are not yet five years old, but they will be when we take our next long trip.

Our trailer shows a date of manufacture of December, 2004. We bought it used from an
AS dealer in Sept 2008, and I was surprised to see that it appeared to already be on its second set of tires - no idea why or what the history was.

Living up here in the frozen North as we do, the winter time is our primary long distance travel time - this coming winter we will likely head for Arizona and/or California.

I had recently been debating whether to run my present tires for one more long trip before changing them and thought I probably would.

When I visited our trailer last weekend (It is in a storage yard 10 miles away) to check it however, I found a nail in one tire!

The tire doesn't look to have lost air and I didn't attempt to pull the nail yet, but my thinking was that since I was sitting on the fence about changing tores before our next long trip I should just go ahead and change at this time.

We normally head south in Feb. and if I go ahead with a change, I'd like to do it in the next month or so before the trailer gets buried in snow - I'd rather dig it out only once, not twice, besides its cold up here messing with that Hensley if it doesn't hook up on the first try!

As usual, you make a lot of good points.

I do tend to read things on the forum and sometimes jump too quickly and maybe shouldn't.

For example - although I read an awful lot of bad press on the forum about GYM's, I suppose there must be a hell of a lot more GYM's on AS trailers than any other make so from that sense I suppose you'd expect to hear more failure stories.

I take your point about unsprung weight - I do ride a bike as one of several "second childhood" hobbies!

Incidentally, a bit off topic, but Centramatic now make a set of their dynamic balancers for a Goldwing!

I don't have them on my bike at present, and not sure I have the need, but have heard very good reports from riders who have bought them. Of course one never knows if the reports are based on real results or wishfull thinking to justify the $$ having been spent!

I did put centramatics on our AS. Not really sure if they do anything, it takes a bit of a leap of faith, but the demo on their website impressed me, and I figured they couldn't
(hopefully) do any harm and may well be of benefit.

Back to tires - because of my paranoia about ripping up the side of our trailer with a delaminating tire, I did in fact buy a TPMS that measures pressure and temp.

I'm not sure how reliable the temperature reading is since the sensor is on the end of the valve stem. I reasoned though that even if the readings meant nothing, The fact that one wheel was reading hotter than the others would indicate a condition that would warrant investigation.

I only bought the TPMS last Fall but I use it religiously - it certainly adds some peace of mind. Even though the alarms are automatic, it gives me something to fiddle with, verifying pressures and temperatures as we roll down the highway!

I don't know that the TPMS offers me a lot of protection against blow outs per se, but it certainly should keep me well aware of a tire losing pressure, fast or slow, and I suppose running on an under-inflated tire would be a significant factor potentially leading to a blowout and so I should now have a degree of added protection.

I need to think this out a bit more for while I guess. Not sure of reading more forum posts at this point will help! Who knows - I may just wind up with a new set of GYM's before I'm done!

Thanks as alway for your helpful input ............ Brian
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