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Old 02-17-2016, 05:47 PM   #43
Tom T
 
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Originally Posted by Silverflames View Post
Thank you Tom!

So my AS is about 5k lbs, I considered the load E range for the extra strength, but with just a lower PSI in the tires, but I'm not sure if it's worth it. How did the load E ride?

Load D are rated at 2500, so it clearly covers the load I need to carry.
Silver - ... & OP Barretta -

I may be late catching this after your call to Maxxis, but I run their ST225/75R15-D at 65# with a 1/3 lighter trailer with no appreciable bounce, & the 1960 Avion manual had the old school bias ply tires at 65# too.

Frankly the dang rented 3/4 ton Ford/Dodge pick-ups bounce more than the Avion - & no, the Hensley Cub doesn't transmit the truck's bounce thru the hitch to the trailer either!

However, my Maxxis tires are sidewall rated to 2450# at max 65# - I think I misspoke when I said mine were E, since the Avion manual only called for 6PR or C rated by load today, but they were only available in D or E rated in my size IIRC. Apologies for my brain fart on that D vs E confusion!

There was an issue on another thread about a certain 14" size (215/75R14-D I think) that were over-ordered by Maxxis in 2014 & they were selling off the old stock - so their 5 year warranty started at the DOT date (which I think is not legal anyway - should be purchase date). If that is your size, then you might want to buy a E & just run it at 65# if that's a newer date stamp tire.

So I was suggesting that you confirm the sidewall date code for any tires to make sure it's not more than 12-14 months old sitting in the factory & shipping, sitting at warehouses & tire shops, etc. before installed on your trailer or vehicle. Once mounted, Maxxis won't take returns.

PS - This is the topic thread about the Maxxis 2 year old by date stamp tires FYI -

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f438...es-146828.html

Good Luck!
Tom
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Old 02-17-2016, 10:13 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by dannydimitt View Post
Ancient Chinese saying = " examine tire closely , if it stamped S T , immediately replace with Michelins "
I heard Goodyear calls them Marathons because they only last 26.2 miles.
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Old 02-17-2016, 10:46 PM   #45
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If these Goodyears were as bad as everyone says they are, there would have been a class action lawsuit by now and Goodyear would have halted production. I've got to believe that Airstream would also strongly reconsider putting them on new units. We ask a lot of that rubber and I can see why they would "calendar due" before they wear or show signs of needing replacement.

The OP seems to be "calendaring due" though so my vote is that it's probably time.
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Old 02-18-2016, 03:44 AM   #46
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The Gooyear Marathons are that bad.
I've experienced it.
I, too, was skeptical until I lived it.
I don't understand why Airstream puts them on any trailer.
What perceived to be the highest quality travel trailer brand putting known junk tires on $100,000 trailers makes no sense to me, but it happens 50 times per week apparently.
I don't know why there hasn't been a class action lawsuit against Airstream or Goodyear as well as other makers of ST tires. My experience with Carlisle ST tires is even worse.


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Old 02-18-2016, 02:25 PM   #47
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And for those Michelins are superb folks out there - they fail too!

Our 1988 VW Vanagon CamperGL Westfalia came from the factory with Michelin LT195/75R14-C 6PR tires made specifically for those tall & narrow wheelbase & high CG & heavy (4500-4800 wet & loaded with 4-5 passengers & luggage/gear) which were ubiquitous worldwide back in the 1980-92 timeframe (& later in Brazil, Mexico & South Africa).

We had a blow-out tread separation on < 2 year old tires by date code & < 12 months on the Westy at the 70 mph speed limit on I-15 south near Elsinor CA about halfway on the way from Orange to San Diego CA at +/- 7 am in October on a cool morning, properly inflated, less than 15000 miles on them, & no heat build-up, with only me & 2 kids & no cargo - just a local trip to the airshow at NAS Miramar.

Talk about an eye-opening experience trying to keep it under control & off to the side of the road!

Later inspection with tires off showed belt separations starting on another 2 tires, & a sidewall bubble on the 3rd - 4 out of 4 new tires - & these were still European made tires back in the late 1990's! While Michelin did exchange out all 4 tires at the prorated for mileage prorata, but with no apologies nor reasons for such crappy tires!

Shortly thereafter Michelin stopped making those tires, & I went to other makers' LT tires with the proper load rating, the current being Maxxis UE168 205/70R14-D (switched to the wider & lighter VW factory alloy wheels for which that size is spec'ed.).

So ANY tires can & do blow out - including the vaunted Michelins - & I know many a Porsche, BMW, Audi, MBZ owner who have had problems with their Michelins both from the factory & replacements.

So keep that in mind when the ST vs. LT folks start waxing eloquent on how wonderful & perfect their Michelin LT tires are, & they're no longer Euro made in many cases, since they too have plants in China now!

Just sayin'!

Cheers!
Tom
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Old 02-18-2016, 06:39 PM   #48
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Ultimately, I think the real problem is the duty that these tires (all brands) have to endure. Mine sit for months at a time then, without warning are screaming down the highway at 65+mph in 90 degree weather on 120 degree pavement. If properly inflated, they're at 65 pounds per square inch.

That's a lot to ask of rubber.

I'll keep an eye on mine (two years old now) and if they start bulging, they will be replaced under warranty which I understand to be 5 years. Otherwise, I'll replace them the spring of the 5th year.
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Old 02-19-2016, 05:55 AM   #49
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I ain't the smartest man in the world, but my personal experience tells me this:
I have never had a tread separation on a P-rated tire.
I have never had a tread separation on an LT tire.
I have had many tread separation ms on ST tires.
What does this tell me?
Even taking RV shear into consideration:
Never, ever buy an ST tire ever again!


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Old 02-19-2016, 09:04 AM   #50
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People need a better understanding of failure analysis.

HERE is a post on Causation vs Correlation that points out both the truth and fallacy of claiming that the real problem is that RVs built in Ohio will have a high % of tire failures.

I might observe that according to the posts on this thread that maybe the reason so many people have problems with one brand of tires is that the light shining from unpainted aluminum reacts with the tire rubber used in some tires and results in early tire failure.
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Old 02-20-2016, 08:00 AM   #51
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I will always buy tires that I have run on my trucks, I didn't shop for price, I just didn't want any problems on the road , loaded with contaminated soils...no Chinese tires, the Bridgestone, michelin and bf Goodrich , one truck run toyo, we made a 500 mile run every day, and never in 3.25 million miles did we had a tire fail on the road, steer tires were pulled 45-60,000 miles as they were carrying 14500 lbs, and all that was on skinny Montana roads, every 2 hours we did a walk around..
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Old 02-20-2016, 11:01 AM   #52
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Our 2015 23D was built in late September 2014. The tires were made in the spring of 2014. I was at the dealer to pick the trailer up in mid July 2015. The stock 14" Goodyears were over a year old with had less than a mile on them (the trailer was trucked to the dealership) and would have flat spots and sun damage.

I arrived with 15" SenDel T03-56545T wheels with mounted 15" Michelin LTX (P) 235/75R15 XL tires, a set of Centramatic 200-221 standard wheel balancers, a complete set of McGard 24138 Chrome Cone Seat Wheel Locks and McGard 64010 Chrome Bulge Cone Seat Style Lug Nuts and the Dill 1506-453 TPMS senders installed in the tires. Pressure was set to 44 psi.

The curb side front wheel opening was not the same distance from the plastic wheel well wall, so some tin snips trimmed about 2" away to make it identical to the street side setback from the plastic wheel well. We ended up fabricating a new spare tire carrier to fit the 15" spare.

The 15" Michelin LTX (P) 235/75R15 XL tires have a derated for trailer use 1,985 pound load rating. My tire loading is below:

Front….1,280……1,246 - total front axle 2,526
Rear…..1,376……1,233 - total rear axle 2,609
Total Axles………………………………….. 5,135

The left rear has the most load due to the rear shower and toilet and black water tank all being behind and to the extreme outside of the street side of the trailer. There is about a 30% safety load margin on the street side rear tire and higher safety margin on the other three tires.

We keep the tires covered in storage even though the trailer is under roof.

The 2.2" larger diameter 15" tires versus the stock 14" tires meant that there is a net increase of ground clearance of 1.1" for the trailer. Since I had installed the same model 15" Michelin tires on the stock 15" rims of our 2013 25FB, the elevation off the Hensley Arrow was the same for both trailers. This fact enabled the use of my 2007 Mercedes ML320 CDI diesel as the tow vehicle with no changes to the hitch settings since it was used to tow the 25FB home.

We converted the 2014 31' Classic to the 16" SenDel T03-676655T wheels and 16" Michelin LT225/75R16/E LTX M/S2 tires as soon as I got the trailer to our storage unit from the dealership.

For both the Classic and the 23D, the Michelin tire loads are greater than the GoodYear Marathons that Airstream installed.

The RV manufactures buy the cheapest tire possible to get the vehicle down the assembly line and out the door. As soon as the taillights are outside the building, they charge the dealer for the vehicle. The liability for the damage from a tire failure is now the dealer's while the unit is in transit to their lot and while parked there. Then the new owner acquires the unit. They usually do not know the tire manufacture date or if it really has the appropriate load rating when the trailer is loaded with all their "stuff".

Airstream puts two 5,000 pound rated axles under the 31' Classic trailers with a GVW of 10,000 pounds and, prior to the 2015 model year, installed the GYM ST225/75R15D rated 2,540 pounds @ 65 psi and speed limited to 65 MPH. Thus two GYM ST225/75R15D tires together have a load capacity of 5,080 pounds. While the total exceeded the axle rating, it was not by much.
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Old 02-20-2016, 11:29 AM   #53
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Remarkably, my '98 came equipped from the factory with a 8300 lb GVWR, (two) 4000 lb GAWR's and Load Range C Goodyear Marathons (2150 lbs each at 50 psi). Amazingly, being ignorant at the time, I ran those tires for over 6 years of full-timing. Maybe I'm just lucky. But then again, that was when they were made in Canada.
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Old 02-20-2016, 11:36 AM   #54
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Actually, about a thousand pounds of weight was on your tongue so the axles and tires were well within spec.

Mike
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Old 02-20-2016, 12:12 PM   #55
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Actually, about a thousand pounds of weight was on your tongue so the axles and tires were well within spec.

Mike
Within spec, but not with the margin of safety I'd like for the current breed of Marathons. My axles were carrying 7600 lbs. back then (saved my old tickets). If trailer loading was balanced (I never did individual wheel weights), that would have been 1900 lbs per wheel. Conceivably, one of those wheels could easily have been at 2100 lbs. That wouldn't leave me with much headroom on those load range C tires. I certainly wouldn't recommend cutting it that close with todays' Marathons. But you are right, I probably was within spec.
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Old 02-20-2016, 03:31 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m.hony View Post
I ain't the smartest man in the world, but my personal experience tells me this:
I have never had a tread separation on a P-rated tire.
I have never had a tread separation on an LT tire.
I have had many tread separation ms on ST tires.
What does this tell me?
Even taking RV shear into consideration:
Never, ever buy an ST tire ever again!


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m.hony,

Please re-read my post #47 above - That was 4 tread separations/bubbles with one a blow-out on 4x Michelin LT tires on a relatively light VW Vanagon. I've also had tread separations on P tires.

Whether a particular person has had one (yet), does not mean that they won't - maybe not or maybe eventually - but to claim that, since it's never happened to someone, it won't ever happen to anyone else with P or LT tires, or a certain brand, etc. - is just giving others a false sense of security.

The point is that it can happen to any tire type on any vehicle type (car, truck or trailer), from any tire manufacturer, made anywhere - including the US & Europe.

Ever wonder where all those "Gators" come from on the highways as you're tooling along at 65 or whatever!?

PS - switz at post #52 above brings up a very important point for those who prefer to use P-XL or LT tires on your trailers, which is that you'll need to down-rate their sidewall load ratings for trailer use, so size/load-rate accordingly when you get them.

Cheers!
Tom
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