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Old 03-07-2012, 07:57 AM   #1
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Centramatics reduce tire failures?

I've had (5) Goodyear Marathon failures in roughly 53 months/30,400 miles +/- 50miles

All things being equal: 65mph speed rating, proper inflation, wheel balancing
Is there a consensus on whether dynamic wheel balancers reduce tread separation failures?
('tread separation' is the consensus on the nature of these GYM failures, right?)


After googlesearching, I found only one mention of it here: http://www.airforums.com/forums/f438...tml#post961292

I know there's a lot of folks here that use DWB's (and just as many who have and haven't experienced tire failure), and I'd really appreciate any input.
Thanks

-Joe
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Old 03-07-2012, 08:09 AM   #2
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Unless, the tire and wheel are pretty severely out of balance, which you would know by tread cupping, I doubt that Centramatics would reduce tire trouble of this magnitude. Just MO.
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Old 03-07-2012, 08:30 AM   #3
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We purchased our Centramatics back in 2005 to simply "FINE TUNE" wheels that were already balanced and they have done just that based on tread wear over the years and two sets of tires. The photo shown in the previous posting obviously needed replacement LONG before it got to the stage shown in the photo!
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Old 03-07-2012, 08:43 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZoominC6 View Post
...The photo shown in the previous posting obviously needed replacement LONG before it got to the stage shown in the photo!
What makes you say that?

That tire had not even 18 months on it. We were back from a 2,400 mile trip when that occurred in the very last leg... somewhere between the gas stop (check tires, rotor temps) in Toledo and my driveway.
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Old 03-07-2012, 08:55 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by finalcutjoe View Post
What makes you say that?

That tire had not even 18 months on it. We were back from a 2,400 mile trip when that occurred in the very last leg... somewhere between the gas stop (check tires, rotor temps) in Toledo and my driveway.
I agree, In my experience, tread throwing happens pretty quickly and is often not anticipated. I have had this happen a couple of times (not GYMs though) and everything looked fine at a fuel stop, and then on the next run....tread chunking off.
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Old 03-07-2012, 12:08 PM   #6
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I'm no tire engineer (actually, I don't think Goodyear has any either), but when you watch the demonstration video, I could imagine a lot of internal forces in the tire acting to tear it apart- exacerbated by an out of balance condition.

http://youtu.be/skY6qvzpNXI

then again, there are those who say all these 'dynamic wheel balancers' are snake oil... a free standing spinning wheel is quite a bit different from a loaded wheel on suspension, rolling along...

?
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Old 03-07-2012, 01:10 PM   #7
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Joe,

Two good vid's on the importance of "roadforce" balancing, something I did when I installed the Centramatics.

My rule...do all you can to lessen the risk.



Bob
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Old 03-07-2012, 01:18 PM   #8
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I think it's fine-tuning, yes, but I do it first (Centramatics) as I've had no end of wheels lose balance weights.

Now, as to "prevention" it's a different question. Heat kills tires, so "heat reduction" (or heat rise limiting) is as close as I can conceive of a benefit from less "bounce" (as I perceive balance problems).

I like to think tires will last longer with CM's. "Smoother ride" means "less heat", to me.

FCJ, you might check through tire engineer CapriRacer's latest addition to his sit on ST tires.

Barry's Tire Tech

And (like a bunch of us are going to) start over on weights by getting individual wheel weights (not just axle averages) to be sure tires are spec'd properly (with a proper reserve).

www.trucktires.com/bridgestone/us_eng/press/zip/WeighForm.pdf

.
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Old 03-07-2012, 01:47 PM   #9
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Here's an article on centramatics that I found interesting. It claims that the "special" centramics that are sold for Airstreams (at least the ones with 15 inch wheels) are in fact smaller diameter centramics that are far less effective. Any comments from those people more technically inclined would be welcome.

http://home.hiwaay.net/~tomorkim/Centramatics.htm
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Old 03-07-2012, 02:53 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reinergirl View Post
Here's an article on centramatics that I found interesting. It claims that the "special" centramics that are sold for Airstreams (at least the ones with 15 inch wheels) are in fact smaller diameter centramics that are far less effective. Any comments from those people more technically inclined would be welcome.

http://home.hiwaay.net/~tomorkim/Centramatics.htm

That's why it's recommend that you r/f balance before installation.
poi.. the closer the weights are to the road (away from center), the more effective they will be.

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Old 03-07-2012, 02:54 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by REDNAX View Post
I think it's fine-tuning, yes, but I do it first (Centramatics) as I've had no end of wheels lose balance weights.

Now, as to "prevention" it's a different question. Heat kills tires, so "heat reduction" (or heat rise limiting) is as close as I can conceive of a benefit from less "bounce" (as I perceive balance problems).

I like to think tires will last longer with CM's. "Smoother ride" means "less heat", to me.

FCJ, you might check through tire engineer CapriRacer's latest addition to his sit on ST tires.

Barry's Tire Tech

And (like a bunch of us are going to) start over on weights by getting individual wheel weights (not just axle averages) to be sure tires are spec'd properly (with a proper reserve).

www.trucktires.com/bridgestone/us_eng/press/zip/WeighForm.pdf

.
Good stuff.

Introduces two new issues:

- there's some debate on whether my TST valve mounted sensors actually give me an accurate tire temp reading.

- both CAT scales near me are built on a raised deck, making offset measurements impossible. Most of the others I've seen have a canopy with stantions midway- making offset on those impossible too... hmm
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Old 03-07-2012, 03:02 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reinergirl View Post
Here's an article on centramatics that I found interesting. It claims that the "special" centramics that are sold for Airstreams (at least the ones with 15 inch wheels) are in fact smaller diameter centramics that are far less effective. Any comments from those people more technically inclined would be welcome.

http://home.hiwaay.net/~tomorkim/Centramatics.htm

I wonder what kind of balance you'd get if you simply had the tire balancer put the centramatic on without any weights on the rim?
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Old 03-07-2012, 03:12 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by finalcutjoe View Post
I wonder what kind of balance you'd get if you simply had the tire balancer put the centramatic on without any weights on the rim?
Joe,

IMHO....balance first, BSTS.

Bob
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Old 03-07-2012, 03:43 PM   #14
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Sorry to see this but when I saw how many failures there were with Goodyear Marathons I immediately replaced mine (had less than 1000 miles)and upgraded to 16' wheels and Michelin tires.
It is amazing that they still allow theses tires to be sold.When I Googled Goodyear Marathon problems one discription kept coming up repeatably "Catastrophic failure".That was enough for me.
Centramatics can not cure poor build quality in my opinion.
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