Bearing race question for the experts.

[PensacolaJim]

I am in the process of changing wheel bearings. After pressing the new outboard race into the hub, the race spins. This didn't seem right, so I asked my dad for advice. Sure enough, he says bearing races aren't supposed to spin. He called a friend who advised us to use a cold chisel to check mark around the area where the race sits. This will add significant friction to the area and keep the race from spinning. Sounds like it will work, but I would like to get a few opinions. So...what do you guys think?

Merry Christmas,
Jim Showers

[markdoane]

The method you describe is a great shadetree technique. A machinist would chuck it up on a lathe and use a knurling tool.

I would use either method, if new drums weren't so inexpensive.

[Jim Foster]

A center punch will do the same thing. Makes little craters. As the punch goes into the cast iron, some of the material is lifted out around the edge of the hole. Every 1/4 inch or so, perhaps two rows offset. Should work just fine.

[ROBERTSUNRUS]

Originally Posted by Jim Foster

A center punch will do the same thing. Makes little craters. As the punch goes into the cast iron, some of the material is lifted out around the edge of the hole. Every 1/4 inch or so, perhaps two rows offset. Should work just fine.

Hi, I call this a Mickey Mouse repair, but in a pinch, [parts or money not readily available] we used to use the center punch method, punching randomly all around the race area and install race with red loctite. This will work, but first, check to see if the old race had spun in the hub or that the new race is the correct size. Was the old race tight when you drove it out? If so double check everything before trying this fix.

[TBSarfari28]

Bearings that have spun in their bores, is usually caused by improper adjustment, contaminated lube that doesn't allow the bearing to rotate, old age or the vehicle is operated over-loaded. The best repair is always a new part. I have worked on commerical trucks for many years, and have seen bearing bores center punched, as stated above, it is a shade tree type of repair. All you end up with is a bunch of little high spots trying to hold the bearing in place. Under load the high spots beat down and the bearing spins again. even if adjusted correctly and lube is clean. If cost of the new part is a problem, use one of these Loctite products, 638 retaining compound, my first choice and 2nd would be Loctite 603. They will do a much better job of holding the bearing race in place. Keep everything clean and adjust the bearings correctly, .001 to .005 of end-play would work. Good Luck

[PensacolaJim]

Thanks for the great advice. I went with the cold chisel and red loctite method (a new drum costs 75 dollars in Pensacola.) I really appreciate the way you responded so quickly. This is twice that I've asked the forum for advice and gotten the same wonderful response each time.

Merry Christmas ,

Jim

[Excella CM]

You can bed the race in lead wool.

[dwightdi]

I can not concure with the lead wool approach. You can not guarentee it will properly retain the alignment the bearing. I am not sure you want to use Red Loctite, if you ever want to get the bearing race out some time in the future. Ask the local bearing guy if blue grade would be enough. I have used red grade to replace welding in the past for OEM driveshaft assembly. If you have to replace the roller bearing element, you should replace the race at the same time as the angles can vary a little from manufacturer to manufacturer and that can lead to premature failure.

[overlander63]

Here we have two versions of red Loctite, low strength and high strength.
Low strength red would be more than enough, while little short of a plasma cutter will remove the race if you use high strength.

[Janets Husband]

Uh... I've got to ask a question. Why is the race spinning in the hub?
This is not a normal condition, with the proper race and an undamaged hub. I would want to find out the reason for the loose fit. I would suggest that you might want to bring it to a machine shop to find out what is going on with the hub, cracked, beat out, overheated...

[ctdair]

Agree with Janetshusband why is it spinning? Wrong parts? bad hub? If going the locktite routine, I dont recall the number but green stud and bearing retainer would be the one to use.

[garry]

I have to go with the "why is it spinning" crowd. While there are ways to get around a problem you may be fixing a sympton and not a cause.
Could be you have a new race & bearing that is out of spec.
If you do the quick fix remember a spinning race can cause a complete axle failure so make sure you get it right.

Garry

Garry

[Excella CM]

As several others have pointed out by now, notwithstanding that there are several ways to tighten a bearing race in the drum or hub assembly, they should ALL be considered stop-gap solutions. Bearing races are a "press' fit, period(the press could be a hammer and a brass drift). If you cannot get an oversize hub recess welded up and recut to size, then replace it.

[Inland RV Center, In]

I cannot imagine anyone wanting to "dimple fit" a race in place.

Surely they would have absolutely "NO" regard for their safety or anyone else.

A lost wheel, locked wheel and the like, can and "DOES" cause roll overs and absolute "LOSS OF CONTROL."

GUARANTEED

Andy

[jfowler218]

Never use a punch or chisel to seat a bearing. A properly installed bearing should never spin but it should creep!! very slowly. Loctite can be acceptable in some applications. If you do not properly repair a spinning bearing race you will sonn have even worse problems.
50 years in the bearing business.

[Royce]

Originally Posted by jfowler218

Never use a punch or chisel to seat a bearing. A properly installed bearing should never spin but it should creep!! very slowly. Loctite can be acceptable in some applications. If you do not properly repair a spinning bearing race you will sonn have even worse problems.
50 years in the bearing business.

I was not aware that a race should creep. Could you explain the reason for the creep?

[Inland RV Center, In]

Originally Posted by Royce

I was not aware that a race should creep. Could you explain the reason for the creep?

Worn out drums allow the race to move, well really the hub part.

Over tightening of the bearing retainer nut, can in time, cause the race to start moving within the hub.

When that takes place, the hub and drum is finished.

To try and save the drum, is absolutely foolish.

Sometimes, like with the old vintage trailers that used small bearings, drums are no longer available.

If that's the case, then an axle replacement is necessary.

To avoid that issue, or to try to "beat the system" would be the absolute height of foolishness, once a race becomes loose in a hub.

Bearings, drums, races, axles, all can be bought.

Lives "CANNOT" be bought, at any price.

Once a race becomes loose, bite the bullet and correct the problem, properly.

Once a race becomes loose, you cannot, no matter what method you use, make sure that the race is "exactly centered."

That being the case, vibrations can quickly take place, causing further failures, faster than you think.

Safety procedures and practices, gives a person great comfort and a great distance from that human grave yard.

Lack of safety or ignoring it, shortens that distance, "FAST."

BE SAFE, ALWAYS.

If you cannot afford the repair, then for your sake and others, get rid of the trailer.

Andy

[RBolton]

I know what bearing creep is and I have seen evidence of it on different assemblies, either the outer ring creeping in the housing or an inner ring creeping on a shaft. I have successfully replaced bearings with sufficient interference (tight) fit where creep has occurred. But, I have never felt that a bearing should creep. If Jim's original bearing spun in the housing, it probably crept first.

I'm with Andy. The hub on a trailer is not a good place for a "this might work" repair. If it were on your tow vehicle, it would be different. You would know if it didn't hold long before the wheel came off or your windows fell out.