Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
 


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 12-16-2003, 06:52 AM   #1
nds
3 Rivet Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 240
Question Attn: Andy of Inland RV

In a previous conversation here, you stated that an obvious indicator of a bad axle was if the tire was partially covered by the tire cut out.

We're getting ready to tow a 1970 22 Ft. Safari to Jackson Center tomorrow morning to put it in for the winter program. I was over at my friend's home (who owns the trailer) yesterday (he's a member of this forum- Boltos) and we noticed that the top portion of his tires are covered by the cut out. Does this definitely indicate a bad axle or could it also be bad shocks?

This is a single axle Safari (I think the 22 Ft. Safari may have gone to a dual axle in 1971). He has already towed it previously to Georgia for a weekend and didn't notice any problem with it.

This is something we can have them check out at Jackson Center while it's there, but I was just wondering if this always indicates a bad axle.

I hope you see this before we leave in the morning. Thanks in advance.
nds is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2003, 07:08 AM   #2
The Painted Pig
 
Moonshot's Avatar
 
1979 Argosy Minuet 7.3 Metre
Hailey , Idaho
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 337
Images: 14
Since Andy is on California time he may not be in for a couple more hours...

I think the top portion of the tire will always be covered by the wheelwell. I think Andy looks at how much of the tire is covered by the cut outs in determining, ballpark, whether the axles are shot.

The best way is to crawl underneath the trailer and visually inspect the torsion arms with the trailer loaded within it's limits. Are they at a positive angle (rearward portion pointing upward)? Then, they need replacing or the trailer is overloaded. Are they horizontal? Should be replaced soon. Are they at a negative angle? They are ok.

http://inlandrv.com/articles/dura-torque-axle-92001.htm

Scott
Moonshot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2003, 07:14 AM   #3
Rivet Master
 
Chas's Avatar
 
Austin , Texas
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 949
Images: 22
Why don't you call Andy on his 1-800 line?

Chas
Chas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2003, 07:25 AM   #4
nds
3 Rivet Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 240
Quote:
Originally posted by Chas
Why don't you call Andy on his 1-800 line?

Chas
I don't think it's necessary to call him on this, since we're taking it up tomorrow morning around 8:00 am. If he happens to see this, great, if not, no big deal... we'll bring it to their attention when we get there and see what they say. Thanks.
nds is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2003, 08:54 AM   #5
Moderator
 
Stefrobrts's Avatar

 
1968 17' Caravel
Battle Ground , Washington
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,254
Images: 50
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally posted by 63wind
The best way is to crawl underneath the trailer and visually inspect the torsion arms with the trailer loaded within it's limits. Are they at a positive angle (rearward portion pointing upward)? Then, they need replacing or the trailer is overloaded. Are they horizontal? Should be replaced soon. Are they at a negative angle? They are ok.

http://inlandrv.com/articles/dura-torque-axle-92001.htm

Scott

I have been going around and around about this axle question. When inspeced from underneith my torsion arms are pointing downward, which is good, but the edge of the wheel is covered by the cutout, which is what Andy always says is bad when he sees a trailer on eBay ilke that! When I asked other old-timers at a rally about it, they all said the axle was fine. I'll be interested to hear what the conclusion is about your friends Safari. Be sure to let us know how the torsion arms are pointing and what Jackson Center tells you. Enquiring minds want to know...
__________________
Stephanie




Stefrobrts is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2003, 09:07 AM   #6
Rivet Master
 
59toaster's Avatar
 
1959 22' Caravanner
Atlanta , Georgia
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,197
Images: 22
Some of the misconception may be the angles the pictures were taken. Andy point blank says from the side. If you take the picture from above the centerline of the wheel it will apear to be sitting deeper in the fender on a photograph. I always thought he ment that the rim is close to being hidden by the wheel opening and that's what he judged it against not the tire. A 225 75 15 Good year is going to be a different hight then a 245 75 15. The tire is not a constant. The rim is for the most part a constant. Even that is going to have exceptions. THe wheel openinge have changed shape many times. Where that lip would be on a 59 is not the same place it would be on a 57 of the same model.

Andy also has been around these coaches for a LONG time. He has an eye for it and knows what it should look like. It's kind of hard for me only having delt with my coach to look at somebody elses and make that sort of call.

I think the bottom line is if the arm angles down at traveling weight your ok. If it's near flat or angle up from the axle tube it's lost its spring. That's the way I have interpeted Andy's statements on how to tell if it's bad.
__________________
1959 22' Caravanner
1988 R20 454 Suburban.
Atlanta, GA
59toaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2003, 09:42 AM   #7
Rivet Master
Airstream Dealer
 
Inland RV Center, In's Avatar
 
Corona , California
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,497
Images: 1
Different time zones!!! It is always difficult to answer early morning e-mail.

Shocks have "ZERO" effect of ther height of anything, not a trailer, not a car. Shocks are motion dampeners, not leveling devices.

The "Dura-torque" article in our web site is all you need to properly check your axles. That way, you don't need a second opinion.

Different year trailers have different wheel well cutouts. In any case, when the top part of the wheel cannot be seen, with your eyes about two feet above the ground, that axle or axles are history.

It all depends on the year. With the new style wheel well cutouts that Airstream has used since 1974, a considerable part of the top of the tire
should be seen. Again, the key is the position of the "torsion arm."

Trailers that will be stored for an extended period of time, should have much of the trailer weight removed from the axles. That's easily done with some jack stands.

Leaving a trailer sit for years, without having some of the weight removed from the axles, can lead to the rubber rods taking a "set." When that happens, the axles will no longer behave as intended. This applies to "ANY" year trailer.

Generally speaking, when the torsion arms are parallel to the frame, when the trailer is empty, they will move upward as the trailer is loaded. If the torsion arms are at an upward angle, at any time, the trailer will very easily bottom out. In either case, the axles should be replaced.

Look at any kids "low rider car" as is hits the slightest of bumps. It bounces all over the place. The same thing happens to an Airstream trailer, if the axles are bad. That then generates many different types of damage to the frame, shell, furniture, appliances as well as rapidly promoting rear end separation.

Life is really simple, once we know the answers. Life becomes difficult, when we know the answers, but chose to ignore them.

Andy
__________________
Andy Rogozinski
Inland RV Center
Corona, CA
Inland RV Center, In is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2003, 10:39 AM   #8
nds
3 Rivet Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 240
Thanks, Andy

It's really only the upper portion of the tires that are covered, so I think we're OK. The way the trailer sits in his driveway, there's not much room to get under it to visually inspect the torsion arms.

We'll have the guys at Jackson Center check this out along with the other things that are to be fixed.
nds is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2003, 06:45 PM   #9
Rivet Master
 
Tin Hut's Avatar
 
2005 28' International CCD
Pagosa Springs , Colorado
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 811
Images: 1
wheel not tire

Andy is referring to wheel while some posters are speaking of tires. The top of the tire is often hidden, look at the wheel, not tire.
__________________
"would you rather have a mansion full of money or a trailer full of love?"

Tin Hut is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2003, 02:11 AM   #10
Rivet Master
 
53flyingcloud's Avatar
 
1984 29' Sovereign
Savannah , Missouri
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 3,478
Images: 17
Blog Entries: 1
Thumbs up Another view..

nds
Here's a view of the tires/wheels on my unit and, you can see the height between the top of the wheelwell/wheels.

Btw, enjoy your 'tour' of the factory`!

ciao
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	854dsc00970-med.jpg
Views:	713
Size:	43.7 KB
ID:	4193  
__________________
WBCCI 5292 AIR 807
NEU #64
New England Unit
53flyingcloud is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2003, 09:23 AM   #11
Rivet Master
Airstream Dealer
 
Inland RV Center, In's Avatar
 
Corona , California
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,497
Images: 1
53Flying Cloud

Your photo shows very clearly, how much of the tire and wheel should show on trailers built since 1974.

Andy
__________________
Andy Rogozinski
Inland RV Center
Corona, CA
Inland RV Center, In is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2003, 07:36 PM   #12
2 Rivet Member
 
overlander76's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 84
Send a message via ICQ to overlander76 Send a message via AIM to overlander76 Send a message via Yahoo to overlander76
I was worried that mine looked like it was bottoming out but I think it looks OK. I haven't looked at the torsion arms yet, I will in the summer. Andy, what do you think?

Thanks
Brian
Attached Images
 
overlander76 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2003, 09:05 AM   #13
Rivet Master
Airstream Dealer
 
Inland RV Center, In's Avatar
 
Corona , California
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,497
Images: 1
Could be "iffy" depending on how much weight you have in the trailer.

The real proof, always, is to check the torsion arms.

Andy
__________________
Andy Rogozinski
Inland RV Center
Corona, CA
Inland RV Center, In is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2003, 09:23 AM   #14
nds
3 Rivet Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 240
The axle appears to be in good shape

While Brian (Boltos) was going over what he wanted done to the trailer, I went outside with one of the technicians and he got down and looked and said the axle was OK.

I highly recommend anyone that is able to make the trip to Jackson Center and take the tour, to do so. Very interesting and as SilverTwinkie pointed out, you can see the effort that goes into the Airstream in assuring quality assurance.
nds is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2003, 11:56 AM   #15
1 Rivet Member
 
fritzs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 14
Having read all the posts here on Torsion Arms, I immediately had to go out and check mine.(They're horizontal!) However, I also noticed that the bracket that attaches the Torsion Arm axle to the trailer frame has TWO adjustments slots for bolting. Mine is in the Bottom slot, therefore, it looks as though I could jack up the trailer and move the axle to the Upper slot and gain some height and the Torsion arm would then again be slightly below horizontal. Should gain back some action from the system.

Anyone know if this is "right" thinking? Sure, I can see someday replacing the axles, drums, tires, etc. , but for now this looks like an option. Perhaps the factory knew the system would settle after some years and allowed for it?

Looks like it wouldn't be "that" hard to make an adjustment.
fritzs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2003, 12:52 PM   #16
1 Rivet Member
 
fritzs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 14
Excuuuuuse me. Wishful thinking apparently. Upon further inspection I see that there really isn't room for adjustment. Perhpaps the other holes were for another trailer or some attachment. I'll learn someday.
__________________
69 Sovereign 31 Int'l
2004 F-150 4WD 5.4L Triton
Spaniels, kayaks, biking,cross-country.
fritzs@usfamily.net
fritzs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-19-2003, 02:32 AM   #17
uwe
418
 
uwe's Avatar
 
2007 25' Safari FB SE
1958 22' Flying Cloud
1974 29' Ambassador
Yucca Valley , California
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: 1963 26' Overlander
Posts: 4,804
Images: 41
Send a message via Skype™ to uwe
fritzs,
Rotating the axle tube to a new hole, or moving it up in the slots would not help any, even if it was possible.
The problem with most axles is that the rubber inside the axle tubes is fatiqued to a point where it does not supply much suspension any more. Not only does the rubber material compress, but it also gets stiff with age, further limiting it's suspension capabilities. Now the once softly sprung trailer is riding very rough, causing undue stress on the shell, frame and interior components. It is believed that this phenomenon is a major contributor in rear end separation and sag.
Basically, bad axles slowly beat a trailer to death. Rotating the axle mount plate to gain more visible tire sidewall is definitely not the answer.
__________________
Uwe
www.area63productions.com
uwe is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Airstream, Inc. or any of its affiliates. Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:17 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.