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07-14-2003, 09:00 AM
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#1
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Rivet Master
Austin
, Texas
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 949
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way too humid!!
I have had this problem with most all of my RV's in the dead of summer. I just got back from a few days in steamy hot San Antonio and at it just gets plain sticky wet inside, especially at night. I got a combo temp/humidity reader and watched it for a few hours and here's what I got, 70 degrees and almost 95% humidity. If you crank the a/c down they will both drop as the compressor comes on but after a while it will get way too cold, almost unbearably cold, then the compressor will cycle off and as the fan continues to blow the humidity zips right back up. I am thinking that most all RV's have the fan wired to run continously and this is what I think causes the extreme humidity. I could wire the fan to run only with the compressor but don't you need the constant airflow to prevent stratification of the air? Maybe I need to get a little dehumidifier? Crack open a window maybe?
I usually deal with large commercial HVAC units and am stumped at this little booger, don't tell me I have too big of an A/C?
Chas
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07-14-2003, 09:24 AM
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#2
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Rivet Master
1959 22' Caravanner
Atlanta
, Georgia
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,197
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Re: way too humid!!
Quote:
Originally posted by Chas
I have had this problem with most all of my RV's in the dead of summer. I just got back from a few days in steamy hot San Antonio and at it just gets plain sticky wet inside, especially at night. I got a combo temp/humidity reader and watched it for a few hours and here's what I got, 70 degrees and almost 95% humidity. If you crank the a/c down they will both drop as the compressor comes on but after a while it will get way too cold, almost unbearably cold, then the compressor will cycle off and as the fan continues to blow the humidity zips right back up. I am thinking that most all RV's have the fan wired to run continously and this is what I think causes the extreme humidity. I could wire the fan to run only with the compressor but don't you need the constant airflow to prevent stratification of the air? Maybe I need to get a little dehumidifier? Crack open a window maybe?
I usually deal with large commercial HVAC units and am stumped at this little booger, don't tell me I have too big of an A/C?
Chas
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Got too big of a A/C.
Hahha
Is it possible that it's pulling raw outside air instead of recycling?
Its amazing how much moisture a person expells. With the Aluminum inside there is noting to absorb that moisture.
I have slept in the back of one of my truck in the winter and had a layer of condinsation frozen to the roof of the fiber glass shell almost a 1/4 inch thick (It dropped down to 15degrees that night). I sure wasn't sweating so that had to all come from my breath. I have been told I'm full of hot air a lot so that may have been part of the problem.
__________________
1959 22' Caravanner
1988 R20 454 Suburban.
Atlanta, GA
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07-14-2003, 09:45 AM
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#3
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Contributing Member
2018 Interstate Grand Tour Ext
Austin (Hays County)
, Texas
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,164
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Chas
You probably know this, but running the fan at the slowest setting will remove the most humidity because the coils get colder. My former house had a humidity control that worked by varying fan speed in this manner.
Beyond that, I really can't help you since I haven't had a humidity problem except when it is right at the outdoor temperature where the AC doesn't run enough to remove the humidity and it is too warm to open the windows..
__________________
John W. Irwin
2018 Interstate GT, "Sabre-Dog V"
WBCCI #9632
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07-14-2003, 09:49 AM
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#4
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4 Rivet Member
1953 25' Cruiser
Canton
, Mississippi
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: 1953 25' Cruiser
Posts: 324
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Welcome to the South. Unless by buy a de-humidifier (that puts the heat back into the trailer instead of dumping it outside), it will get very cold using the airconditioner. I just use plenty of blankets to cover up with. I hate humidity. I would rather freeze.
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07-14-2003, 10:10 AM
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#5
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Rivet Master
1978 25' Tradewind
Metro Phoenix
, Arizona
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,524
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Well, yes...
... your a/c is too big. More info on problems with an a/c that's too big is at http://www.proctoreng.com/articles/bigger.html
But there's not much you're really gonna be able to do about it, so let's talk about how to live with it.
First of all, don't run the fan unless the compressor is running. The fan just re-evaporates mositure back into your trailer when the compressor is off. Use a separate floor fan or something if you feel like you need the circulation.
The second thing you can do, and yes this sounds strange, is to heat the inside of the trailer artifically to make the a/c run harder. This is what happens automatically with your car when you turn on "defrost" - the a/c comprssor turns on with the heater, and you get warm and very dry air. Some kind of electric space heater, maybe? A little help from the furnace, even? If you're paying the utilities, use the furnace. If you're at a utilities paid space, get an electric heater.
The usual warnings and admonitions apply - use a proper cord, don't overload circuits, don't try this at home, your mileage may vary, and your mother warned you about this.
If it make you feel any better about what probably sounds like wacky advice, I'm a Registered Professional Engineer and I've been in the a/c and energy business for 30 years.
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07-14-2003, 11:34 AM
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#6
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Rivet Master
Austin
, Texas
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 949
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I told ya'll not to say I had too big of an A/C!!,
As far as the a/c unit goes it is the original Armstrong, not sure on the BTU rating but evidently it kicks butt!! Never thought I'd have to worry about too much cooling. I will look at the wiring diagram and see about wiring the evaporator fan in with the compressor and the condenser fan. (Armstrongs have separate condenser and evaporator fan units) The only thing I may worry about is the startup amp draw, having the compressor, condenser and evaporator fans all hitting at the same time. I have seen some dehumidifiers at Lowe's but really hesitate to have to drag one along, maybe I could build it in somewhere if I got one small enough? Sears maybe? Maybe just wait for
winter??
Chas
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07-14-2003, 11:37 AM
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#7
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Rivet Master
1978 25' Tradewind
Metro Phoenix
, Arizona
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,524
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OK, your a/c is NOT too big!!
...Your trailer is too small!
Feel better now?
I'm absolutely serious about running the furnace. Try it and see.
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07-14-2003, 11:46 AM
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#8
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Contributing Member
2018 Interstate Grand Tour Ext
Austin (Hays County)
, Texas
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,164
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Maybe
I get tired of the constant fan noise. Maybe the fan could be simply dropped back to a lower speed when the compressor is not running, It would just take a triac and a few components and a bypass from the compressor circuit. Less of a startup requirement that way.
__________________
John W. Irwin
2018 Interstate GT, "Sabre-Dog V"
WBCCI #9632
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07-14-2003, 12:02 PM
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#9
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Moderator
2004 30' Classic Slideout
Fenton
, Missouri
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 10,408
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My SOB that I had before the A/S cycled the airconditioner fan off when the thermostat set point was reached. That made a big difference in the humidity control. I would hesitate to say that your airconditioner is oversized because you have to understand that you have to be sized to overcome the heat gain when you are in the hot climes in full sun conditions. Unfortunately your A/S is not insulated as well as your home which means that what may be right for daytime, might be a little over for night.
I do have a link somewhere ( I think it was on this forum) with some detailed instructions on how to convert your air conditioner with the constant on fan to one which cycles with the thermostat. I'll try to find it and post the link. Personally the process was a little too big for me to handle.
Jack
__________________
Jack Canavera
STL Mo.
AIR #56 S/OS#15
'04 Classic 30' S.O.,'03 GMC Savana 2500
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07-14-2003, 12:05 PM
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#10
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Moderator
2004 30' Classic Slideout
Fenton
, Missouri
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 10,408
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Re: Maybe
Quote:
Originally posted by Pahaska
I get tired of the constant fan noise. Maybe the fan could be simply dropped back to a lower speed when the compressor is not running, It would just take a triac and a few components and a bypass from the compressor circuit. Less of a startup requirement that way.
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The only problem with that John is the possiblity of freeze up. I talked an a fellow who handles RV A/C repairs in the Destin Fla area. He says it is quite common to get calls for frozen condensers when humidty is very high and folks dial down the fan speed to low.
Jack
__________________
Jack Canavera
STL Mo.
AIR #56 S/OS#15
'04 Classic 30' S.O.,'03 GMC Savana 2500
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07-14-2003, 02:42 PM
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#11
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Just a member
1978 28' Argosy 28
Lutz
, Florida
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 4,549
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Chas,
I have experienced your situation myself. We ran the furace and the AC the same time, it works. You may get some stange looks from other campers.................
The idea to wire the unit so the fan and compressor work together is a good one, some models of Airsteams had this, others did not. It depends on the model of Armstrong you have.
If you were to wire in an additional relay that would start the fan motor first, and have a delay to the relay to start the compressor you would be fine. This would take the output of the themostat and have it start the blower instaed of the compressor. This is how most home units are set up to prevent quick on-off-on cycling of the compressor.
Even so how do you start your AC normally? Off to low cool, then med, then hi? Is that not the same as just having the whole thing kick on? The biggest drawback I can seee is the noise factor. These old Armstrongs can cool, but they make a racket doing it!
__________________
Brett G
WBCCI #5501 AIR # 49
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1978 Argosy 28 foot Motorhome
Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something. -- Plato
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07-14-2003, 07:09 PM
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#12
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Aluminut
2004 25' Safari
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, Illinois
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,477
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I ususally keep mine on high, but I will say that although it may not be as noisy as the older units, it still is a very present noise in the camper.
Other than that, no real humidity issues or freeze ups yet. Of course I've used it only about 5 times in some hot and humid and not so humid heat.
Eric
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07-14-2003, 07:20 PM
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#13
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Retired Moderator
1992 29' Excella
madison
, Wisconsin
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 4,644
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figured it out!
chas
you need to get rid of this thing then your problem will be solved!
john
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07-14-2003, 07:24 PM
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#14
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Rivet Master
Austin
, Texas
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 949
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What's that,
The instrument cluster out of a 67 Dodge Polara?
Mine looks different than that, funny and a good try but it has nothing to do with my A/C problems.
Chas
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07-14-2003, 07:32 PM
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#15
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Retired Moderator
1992 29' Excella
madison
, Wisconsin
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 4,644
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ok
my bad,
i thought you were spending too much time looking at your relative humidity gauge!!
why don't you just hook up and visit wisco for a while, it's humid here too.
but it is a wet heat!!
at least we don't have hurricanes!!
the gauge set is from albert's '70 amb. thought it might look like yours.
john
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01-06-2008, 07:48 AM
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#16
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Vintage Kin
Fort Worth
, Texas
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,014
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The AC Enhancer
I'll be retrofitting one of these to the house, soon, as the current A/C unit is oversized.
It suggests a fan vs A/C solution as others have described.
I've purchased a dehumidifier for the trailer, and will likely carry it along on trips for humid areas. Our trailer A/C unit ran for seven straight months with only a few partial days turned off (while towing); some of that for dehumidification purposes along the Texas Gulf Coast in summer. An uncomfortable situation as temps dropped during the night.
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01-06-2008, 08:46 AM
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#17
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4 Rivet Member
Currently Looking...
holland
, Michigan
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 436
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Well most of you have forgotten more than I know about Airstreams, and most of you have been correct about too large of a unit.I have been doing this stuff for over 25 years globally. In the hvac industry we have been trying to teach proper load calculations and sizing units for the past 20 years. Usually contractors oversize, and comfort issues are real due to this common application problem. In this case you need maybe only 3-5k btu running almost constantly. However in the middle of the summer it would not do the job if they even built such a unit. We are also doing alot of zoning in residential and commercial, and this is not an option so it is very much a difficult problem.
Many of the suggestions are interesting and I have not read all of them. The real solution is a variable output ac/h/p and maybe this will inspire me to have such a unit built and brought to the market??
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01-06-2008, 11:03 AM
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#18
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2 Rivet Member
2007 25' International CCD
Martin
, Georgia
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 76
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I've got a portable dehumidifier I carry with us. I run it at night or anytime the humidity gets too high and the temperature isn't high. At night I set the AC temperature where I want it and run the dehumidifier in the continuous mode. The dehumidifier puts out heat so the AC will cycle some to maintain the temperature. This setup will make things nice and dry. The dehumidifier tank is usually almost full next morning.
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01-06-2008, 06:58 PM
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#19
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Contributing Member
2018 Interstate Grand Tour Ext
Austin (Hays County)
, Texas
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dawgfan
I've got a portable dehumidifier I carry with us.
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I noticed some time ago at Flying-J that they had a 12v dehumidifier meant for 18-wheelers. I'm tempted to buy one if I see one again.
__________________
John W. Irwin
2018 Interstate GT, "Sabre-Dog V"
WBCCI #9632
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