Visit our Popular Forums

BoldAdventure · 07-29-2015, 09:36 AM

Holy Moly does it ever. One night of use and I wake up to 11.9 volts! Does anyone have any recommendations for alternative systems? I think I have seen pictures of propane heaters, but not sure how that works/how that vents without murdering me.

We boondock/dry camp a lot. The past two days in Montana have been particularly chilly, and we've been running the furnace at 66 and even still it's draining the batteries faster than my solar can keep up. Especially at night. I keep waking up to depleted batteries.

I guess that fan motor uses a lot of power blowing.

drboyd · 07-29-2015, 09:41 AM

What kind of furnace do you have? I have a 2 year-old Suburban, and we ran it all night at roughly 50 outside and 70 inside, plus (2) CPAP machines, with plenty of juice left in two group 27 marine deep cycle batteries in the morning. I did run the generator for a couple hours in the afternoon, as we were parked in a shady spot where the solar panels weren't getting much sun.

SCOTTinNJ · 07-29-2015, 09:47 AM

Subscribing. I have the same issue as Bold.

drboyd · 07-29-2015, 09:48 AM

Looks like the Suburbans usually run about 9 amps when the blower is on. At 100% duty cycle, 9 x 12 = 84 amp-hours, which would take my batteries down to about 50%.

Now, the furnace doesn't run at 100% unless the front door is open (and maybe not even then); my rule of thumb is to start at a 50% duty cycle estimate (since that way I can't be off by more than 50%) and work up or down from there.

I would think you should be fine overnight, with juice left in the morning. With a couple hundred Watts of solar and full sun, you should be good again for the next night, too.

jdalrymple · 07-29-2015, 09:48 AM

We use a portable catalytic heater when boondocking.

Some here will pile on about how dangerous these heaters are and how they would never use one, but the truth is with some common sense and proper use these heaters are safe, efficient and simple.

And, one doesn't have to listen to the furnace cycle all night.

Regards,

JD

drboyd · 07-29-2015, 09:56 AM

I have a fire and carbon monoxide detector, plus I leave at least one roof vent about halfway open using the furnace. I don't trust gas. I use it, but I don't trust it.

"There's a big hole in the theory that gas is as safe as electricity"

Lance M · 07-29-2015, 09:59 AM

I've been looking at these Propex heaters from the UK. They only consume about 2amps max.
Westy Ventures / Propex heaters
Propex North America • Propex Heatsource USA and Canada

daveswenson · 07-29-2015, 10:09 AM

How old are your batteries? It's probably time for new ones. They shouldn't be discharging that quickly.

BoldAdventure · 07-29-2015, 10:22 AM

Ok, I have a 2007 International, so whatever furnace comes in the new ones, my batteries are brand new, group 27 deep cycle, they are fine, and I have 405 watts of solar to recharge during the day.

The furnace comes on about once every hour throughout the night. We use reflectix to seal up the windows.

daveswenson · 07-29-2015, 10:30 AM

I'd be looking for some other drain on the battery. You shouldn't be killing the batteries overnight with the furnace.

KJRitchie · 07-29-2015, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Top

I've been looking at these Propex heaters from the UK. They only consume about 2amps max.
Westy Ventures / Propex heaters
Propex North America • Propex Heatsource USA and Canada

They only go up to about 9k BTU. Our AS furnaces are all above 20k BTU.

Kelvin

tommyp123 · 07-29-2015, 10:38 AM

We have two separate modes when we travel with our AS ( 31' 1976 Sovereign) Primary is the Suburban furnace with blowers that treats us like we were home, but we only use when we have shore power.

The other is a simple catalytic heater that is plumbed into our propane system and mounted in the front room which will fend off all but the most frigid nights in the trailer. In addition, our trailer came with a propane lantern that we used to use as well when boondocking to reduce our electric needs. Now that LEDs are in place over 90% of the trailer, I have reduced my dual batteries back to one and can go three days powering refrigerator circuit board, lights, and water pump without a problem. ( I have an old-school pilot light on the water heater)

Our family of four treats it like an adventure, and they alter their clothing and sleeping habits to stay cozy or cool as amenities allow. Full hookups are a true luxury, and when we have them we always take full advantage!

After 20 years on the road in our trailer, this system works very well. It truly can add another dimension to any trip! Our kids say it is more "Campy" when we are off grid that way. I agree.

dkottum · 07-29-2015, 10:47 AM

We do most of our travel in winter months and use the furnace a lot while boon docking. Our logic tells us conservation is as important as supply, in all things. So we set the thermostat at 60, sometimes lower in cold weather, and make up the difference with blankets layered as needed. Socks, long johns, and two in the same bed help when it's really cold.

Lance M · 07-29-2015, 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KJRitchie

They only go up to about 9k BTU. Our AS furnaces are all above 20k BTU.

Kelvin

<insert CPT Obvious photo here>

If you only need a furnace for when the overnight temps are 35-50, 9,000 BTUs is more than enough. If you want, you can add another for 18,000 BTUs at 4 amps. The fact that they are a forced air furnace that can be added on in the space below the floor and they only draw 2 amps make them appealing to me. There is no need to waste BTUs heating the holding tanks in temps above freezing. I like to boondock in the winter in Texas, so this would be an ideal furnace to replace the big, old, noisy, energy hog 30,000 BTU Suburban furnace.

RangerJay · 07-29-2015, 11:04 AM

Our normal routine for cool weather "generator" camping is to go into energy conservation mode from the get-go - meaning TV is hooked up to an alternate power supply with an inverter, LED lights get turned on in favour of the trailers own lights, an extra comforter gets thrown onto the beds at night, the thermostat gets set way, way down and daily showers move to a an two day cycle.

Our single battery will likely show somewhere around 12.2 volts in the morning - very rarely lower than that. Generator will get turned on for a couple of hours - and then again for the same amount of time in the evening before bed. The alternate power source for the TV is charged up at the same time. If we are away from the trailer for the day time then the furnace is turned way down again - or even off.

If needed we can and have gone two days/nights without the generator being used - but don't really like to do that - think we, with a lot of care, could go 3 nights but have never tried it.

Seems to work OK.

Jay

KJRitchie · 07-29-2015, 11:12 AM

Are the Suburban furnace motors a brushed or brushless design? Also could you put a baffle in the duct that goes down to the tanks and close it when you don't need it to supply more warm air to living areas? I think in my trailer under the fridge there is a T junction in the ducting. If you closed it off there would you feel a difference in the living area and the furnace would cycle off sooner.

Kelvin

BoldAdventure · 07-29-2015, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daveswenson

I'd be looking for some other drain on the battery. You shouldn't be killing the batteries overnight with the furnace.

I've been continuously dry camping without hookups for 25 days now. Problem only occurred on two days of overcast weather and very cold temps. No drains on the system, otherwise it would show up already.

I measure voltage via shunt at the batteries directly with my IPN remote and I have a second voltage meter installed at the aft of my Airstream.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dkottum

We do most of our travel in winter months and use the furnace a lot while boon docking. Our logic tells us conservation is as important as supply, in all things. So we set the thermostat at 60, sometimes lower in cold weather, and make up the difference with blankets layered as needed. Socks, long johns, and two in the same bed help when it's really cold.

We sleep under a large comforter, do the same. But with the babies, we need to keep it a certain level of reasonable. Otherwise I would go lower, I like cold pillows.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tommyp123

The other is a simple catalytic heater that is plumbed into our propane system and mounted in the front room which will fend off all but the most frigid nights in the trailer.

See this is what I'm interested in discussing in this thread. I already have LED's everywhere, everything runs on 12V but one monitor, I turn off my inverter at night. We don't use a microwave, etc. 405 Watts of solar on the roof plus a eu2000i Honda generator as backup.

Curious about these, how folks plumb them, recommendations.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Top

If you only need a furnace for when the overnight temps are 35-50, 9,000 BTUs is more than enough. If you want, you can add another for 18,000 BTUs at 4 amps. The fact that they are a forced air furnace that can be added on in the space below the floor and they only draw 2 amps make them appealing to me. There is no need to waste BTUs heating the holding tanks in temps above freezing. I like to boondock in the winter in Texas, so this would be an ideal furnace to replace the big, old, noisy, energy hog 30,000 BTU Suburban furnace.

This also looks interesting. This is the idea I think we are following too. I know we will head south in the winter. I think my only concern would be a night on a mountain where weather could drive it down to freezing.

Here in Montana, the other night it dumped a ton of snow up on the mountains.

BoldAdventure · 07-29-2015, 11:35 AM

Anyone know about the Olympian Wave 3 catalytic heater? Perhaps plumbed into the oven propane line.

Lance M · 07-29-2015, 11:41 AM

I installed an Olympian in a '66 Trade Wind. The owner is very happy with it. It is the only heater in the trailer.

I would recommend you tap into the propane supply under the trailer.

nrgtrakr · 07-29-2015, 11:50 AM

Our 75 Overlander was bought equipped with a catalytic heater as far as I can tell. The range top is next to the door, the furnace is below the range top, the catalytic heater covers the magazine rack facing the goucho. The gas is branched off of the furnace gas line with its own shut off valve.

One note on catalytics, you will need fresh air to breathe, leave a window open just a crack as well as a ceiling vent in another area, and always have functioning CO and propane detectors.

In many more tropical countries central heat and air is seldom found in homes. The homes are not air tight like most in the USA and catalytic heaters are used for the cold spells.

An example of USA air tight construction. Some small private retreat cabins (similar in size to those at many KOAs) had gas ranges with a pilot light for the range top and a pilot light for the oven. One winter a group wanted to use the cabins (this had never happened before). So the gas was turned on and the pilots lit. Shortly after the CO detector goes off. The range top pilot was turned off since it had a valve, but the oven pilot was left on (no valve, flame 1/4-3/8" like normal), and an electric sniffer used to check. Nope, still too high. Gas was valved off and hot plates supplied until the guests departed and the ranges replaced with electric.

In mountain communities there are many stories less successful.