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Old 12-19-2009, 09:49 PM   #1
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Furnace

Our furnace blows black smoke out the excaust. 1983 excella. Is this right or do I need to check somthing.
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Old 12-19-2009, 10:21 PM   #2
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Our furnace blows black smoke out the excaust. 1983 excella. Is this right or do I need to check somthing.
The black smoke is "soot".

Soot is caused by not enough air mixing with the LPG.

DO NOT use the furnace, until it's overhauled.

Unless you know how to overhaul the furnace, take it to a shop and have it done correctly.

The furnace will have to be removed, disassembled on a bench, overhauled and then retested, on a bench.

After that, then it would be safe to reinstall in your Airstream, and use.

Andy
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Old 12-20-2009, 05:56 AM   #3
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83 Excella Repairs

Andy does the furnace just need to be cleaned out you think? I am not a professional, however I have always done my on work. Is this a task that I might be Abel to do my self? I am fairly mechanically inclined. Do you think it would pay to replace it if I cannot overhaul it as you say. With a newer more efficient heater.I just bought this trailer this pass Thursday. It is super clean inside and out. It was our intent to bring it back up mechanically as top shape as possible. The trailer is a 1983 excella 31'. As long as we are on the subject of repairs. The air conditioner compressor does not kick on. Any Ideals on that? Could anyone tell me what a quality air unit and furnace unit would cost for this trailer. Both being efficient. I do appreciate you kindness in trying to help out here. We are new here to this forum and have already noticed the willingness of everyone to help. What a wonderful Ideal in this day and time. Thanks in advance for you help.
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Old 12-20-2009, 09:35 AM   #4
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Andy does the furnace just need to be cleaned out you think? I am not a professional, however I have always done my on work. Is this a task that I might be Abel to do my self? I am fairly mechanically inclined. Do you think it would pay to replace it if I cannot overhaul it as you say. With a newer more efficient heater.I just bought this trailer this pass Thursday. It is super clean inside and out. It was our intent to bring it back up mechanically as top shape as possible. The trailer is a 1983 excella 31'. As long as we are on the subject of repairs. The air conditioner compressor does not kick on. Any Ideals on that? Could anyone tell me what a quality air unit and furnace unit would cost for this trailer. Both being efficient. I do appreciate you kindness in trying to help out here. We are new here to this forum and have already noticed the willingness of everyone to help. What a wonderful Ideal in this day and time. Thanks in advance for you help.
A furnace thats 27 years old, is sort of like a person, in a small way.

It needs a "physical".

Who knows the what the history of the furnace, might be?

That is not something to guess about.

When the furnace is on the bench, it should be disassembled, for cleaning and inspection. Since it's been blowing out some soot, the combustion chamber will need to be thoroughly cleaned out. That cannot, in this case, be done with air. Running plenty of water thru the combustion chambers (several chambers) will eventually clean it out. Next, all the gaskets will need replacing. Then what is the condition of the burner log? If it's look ok, then it's wise to run a "hack saw blade" thru the slots, but gently. That will clean the slots out. The condition of the blower motor is sort of subjective, in that "how well is it running"? Is it up to speed?

Then you can supply some LPG to the furnace, and see how it runs, "ON THE BENCH". You will have to adjust the "air mixture" for a proper flame. You should also determine "WHY" the air mixture went south. If you find it way out of adjustment, then what "caused the mis-adjustment"? It cannot change unless forced to do so.

The air mixture setting can be disturbed by vibration. That vibration can be from several different things or a combination of things. Excessive rated tow vehicle, excessive rated hitch torsion bars, lack of or improper running gear balance, and even axles that have had the rubber rods fail.

Make sure you use the LPG regulator for the hookup. The LPG pressure should be 11 to 13 inches of water column pressure, preferrably 12 inches.

Make sure the battery for the test has a full charge.

If you cannot do the above, then have an RV shop do it for you. If you do that, "MAKE SUPER SURE THEY CLEAN THE COMBUSTION CHAMBER THOROGHLY".

The AC problem can be caused by a loose wire in the thermostat circuit, a thermostat that needs repair, a bad relay in the AC, or even a compressor failure. When you tst the AC, make sure that an extension cord (if your using one) is at least a 10 gauge cord, but no longer than about 25 feet.

Questions??

Andy

I cannot post prices on the Forums on anything that we sell, since we are a vendor.
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Old 12-20-2009, 10:07 AM   #5
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Many thanks Andy. I got my worked cut out. All the information is helpfull. Does not sound to bad. Used to put bushings in a swamp cooler motor at midnight in my boxer shorts , half asleep. When they would go out. Have a great day.

Tom C
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Old 12-27-2009, 03:42 PM   #6
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ID:	93083I am going to remove my furnace next week and overhaul it. I was looking at it today and noticed it had stamped on the frame NT30 it also listed 24000 BTU on the furnace for rating. The furnace looked real clean and a fairly nice unit from the outside for 27 years old. It did however have a orange flame while looking through the observation window. I removed the small metal cover to the right of the combustion chamber and adjusted the flame to run richer. This did not have much effect on it. No squealing or roaring either. I did hear it burb though when I fired it back off. I will adjust this when I get it cleaned up before firing it back off. It still burns the black smoke. What would you clean the entire unit with? Would you pull the combustion chamber only? Or the whole kit and caboodle. My service manual Say's this is the thing to do for a proper cleaning. Would this require the full set of gaskets to be ordered. Manual also recommends pulling the cabinet front. See my attached photo's if you would. Andy how long to ship my gaskets?Pulling it seems to be the thing to do. Any advice and or comments would be appreciated. I have the service manual and intend to follow the advice in it somewhat. However you all that have done this probably can give me some good hints and guidance. Much appreciated. This is a 1983 excella 31'.
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Old 12-27-2009, 03:48 PM   #7
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Have it pulled and looked at; it may be junk depending on the usage. Ours comes out with the cage staying inside; we are the same year, I can't believe AS would do it any different in the trailers. Honestly, I'd replace the furnace and have a pro do it; there are propane issues to be dealt with on a coach that old.
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Old 12-27-2009, 04:40 PM   #8
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Thanks for the input Mike. Yes I believe I will pull it. However I think at this time I am still going to look for some encouragement and give it a whirl. Sounds like it needs to be just cleaned up good. I got my curiosity up as to what it might look like on the inside. How bad it is worn and all. Does not look to bad from the outside.
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Old 12-27-2009, 07:33 PM   #9
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One thing Andy mentioned is you MUST use a regulator when bench testing.

I have pulled, repaired and tested 2 of them. You have the manual and common sense will take you a long way. However working with propane can be dangerous and very unforgiving.
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Old 12-27-2009, 08:18 PM   #10
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Regulator

Garry Would you mind giving me the run down on what you mean by using the the regulator to bench test it. Like maybe how you bench tested and the procedure you used? I was thinking about hooking it up to my propane bottles. Using those regulators. I guess I will need a hose or and fitting to make that connection to gas supply. Can you shed some light on that for me? Other than that I guess I need to make a visual inspection of the chamber and burner and clean them up good. Tighten all the fittings good against the gaskets. Let me know what I might be missing or need to do. I am open for input as I said in my earlier post. Andy really laid it good. He gave me the confidence to do this myself. I would also like others thoughts on this procedure. Do I need casket sealer. What type. New furnace tape to tape around duct connection. Surely there is something I am missing. Other dangers to watch for.What else do I really need to watch for. Thanks for any help in advance.
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Old 01-01-2010, 09:12 PM   #11
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Thanks to all the fellows who were kind enough to put in there two cents about removing and repairing my furnace. My wife and I took it out tonight in about 15 minutes. Piece a cake. I will clean it tomorrow and resemble then bench test. Two yellow wires is the thermostat. Red and black to battery. Hook up to some propane and we will bench test it.
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Old 01-01-2010, 09:44 PM   #12
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Having your furnace working properly is a matter of life & death. I considered what you are starting to do now about six months ago & I decided to either get a new furnace, have a professional repairman fix and test it, or re-think my idea of having a furnace at all. The things that a pro will check and test are things you and I might never think of, and you might get less than perfect advise from a well meaning person who is not necessarily more knowledable than you about your furnace's issues. I know there is some specialized equipment needed in some cases as well, such as to measure the gas pressure.
It sounds like you are set on doing this, so I hope that you will at least have it checked out by a pro after you do the work, before you use it to camp in. I get sick when I hear of Airstreams burning up or exploding.
Happy new Year!
Rich the Viking
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Old 01-01-2010, 10:22 PM   #13
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[QUOTE=Okiegent;. Andy how long to ship my gaskets?Pulling it seems to be the thing to do. This is a 1983 excella 31'.[/QUOTE]

Parts are shipped same day, if ordered before noon time.

Take your time with the overhaul. Don't rush it.

Andy
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Old 01-02-2010, 07:47 PM   #14
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I found out my son down south of me has been pulling them and repairing them on the side for a fellow that runs a RV dealership. He has been leading me along. I had this out in 15 minutes with my wifes help. He has the knowledge, on how to bench test the furnace so I don't feel unsafe with him along with me.I will pull the burner as well and follow his ,Andy's and the books guide lines. I have recommended this site to several people already that are purchasing or planing on working on their trailers. You all have been super in my book. Thanks for all your willingness to help!!
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