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Old 03-26-2012, 03:03 PM   #15
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I sure hope the idea of a ducted system gains traction. It seems apparent that ducting will not fit within the shell but there's got to be a better solution than a noisy A/C unit running in the kitchen/living room. I think this problem deserves significant attention from Airstream.
They also have central air built into their roofs. I haven't seen a trailer with this, but plenty of larger class A motorhomes have it.

Here's an idea: find a way to run the ducting through the belly pan. Then have floor registers just like we have at home.
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Old 03-27-2012, 05:24 PM   #16
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They also have central air built into their roofs. I haven't seen a trailer with this, but plenty of larger class A motorhomes have it.

Here's an idea: find a way to run the ducting through the belly pan. Then have floor registers just like we have at home.
We are getting frustrated with trying to find Dudted AC Systems on Motorhomes and we are sure that it shouldn't be a complicated system and of course there is a lot more room in the MOHO to run the ducts.

Jammer

The Armstrong A/C does not have the blower capacity to support ductwork. A larger fan would be required and will not fit
If we look at what would be involved in running A/C from the front to the bedroom you would be looking at a minimum of 4 4" ducts if you were to use round duct. Maybe a 3x12 rectangular duct would do the job.

Well I guess that the fact that the blower won't be enough can't be compensated withe individual blowers per duct or vent?
Now 4x4 ducts....WOW Isn't that like residential size?
I was thinking that may be about 4 or 6 vents of 1.5 x 6 thru the AS with the assistance of blowers or fans will do it...

NEVSTYLY

there's got to be a better solution than a noisy A/C unit running in the kitchen/living room...

Amen!
The heat factor is a major issue for us but the noise is just terrible! is even really hard to sleep with the unit on (We know we are very sensitive..)

There has to be a way! we will find it and we will make sure we get it patented!





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Old 03-27-2012, 05:33 PM   #17
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What about one of those high-speed miniduct systems? My dad is an architect and has used those in historic houses when renovating and not wanting to put in large ducts. The ducts are tiny and the air moves at a very high speed to compensate for the volume of the ducts. Just a thoguht-- I would not think it could go in the roof, possibly in the upper cabinets, but maybe b etter in the same places as the heater ducts, could they share?
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Old 03-27-2012, 06:04 PM   #18
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What about one of those high-speed miniduct systems? My dad is an architect and has used those in historic houses when renovating and not wanting to put in large ducts. The ducts are tiny and the air moves at a very high speed to compensate for the volume of the ducts. Just a thoguht-- I would not think it could go in the roof, possibly in the upper cabinets, but maybe b etter in the same places as the heater ducts, could they share?
Love it!
Please get some info from your Dad....will love to look into it
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Old 03-27-2012, 06:18 PM   #19
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An Easy HVAC Retrofit for Old Houses - Old-House Online

YMMV-- no idea if it could be adapted for trailer use-- just thought I would put it out there!!!
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Old 03-27-2012, 06:37 PM   #20
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An Easy HVAC Retrofit for Old Houses - Old-House Online

YMMV-- no idea if it could be adapted for trailer use-- just thought I would put it out there!!!
Thanks
We will look into it ...that was a good input!
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Old 03-27-2012, 06:38 PM   #21
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Awesome-- this kind of sytem intrigues me! Please let us know what you end up doing!!!
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Old 03-27-2012, 07:58 PM   #22
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One thing I would wonder about would be the suitability of teh fan to work into a duct system as opposed to more or less free discharge.

I don't have any experience in this directly but from an engineering background, I know that fans that are designed to work into virtually zero resistance such as found in a conventional roof/window air conditioner may not be so well-suited to feeding a duct system with its inherent resistance.

You may not move nearly as much air and overall effectiveness might suffer somewhat.

I guess the only practical way to know is to try it!

Brian.
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Old 03-27-2012, 08:15 PM   #23
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Uwe did a nice job running duct work from a residential unit to two different areas in his 63 Overlander.













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Old 03-27-2012, 09:10 PM   #24
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An Easy HVAC Retrofit for Old Houses - Old-House Online

YMMV-- no idea if it could be adapted for trailer use-- just thought I would put it out there!!!

Icocbw, but I think that the smallest airhandlers for Unico and Spacepak systems are 2 tons, or 24,000 Btuh vs. our TT units that commonly range from 11,000 to 13,500 to 15,000 Btuh.

oversizing AC equipment by 70 to 80% is usually not an effective solution....

ymmv.
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Old 03-27-2012, 09:33 PM   #25
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Icocbw, but I think that the smallest airhandlers for Unico and Spacepak systems are 2 tons, or 24,000 Btuh vs. our TT units that commonly range from 11,000 to 13,500 to 15,000 Btuh.

oversizing AC equipment by 70 to 80% is usually not an effective solution....

ymmv.
My guess would be that 24,000 Btu would probably be about right for my Excella. It might still even be a little small.

Sight unseen, I think Smokeless Joe's split unit is the most elegant solution. Running coolant takes much less room than moving chilled air. These designs are reputed to be very quiet, too. You would still need fans to move the air around inside, but an Endless Breeze or two should do just fine.
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Old 03-27-2012, 10:56 PM   #26
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I am a home inspector, so I am familiar with split system heat pumps. They are used where you can not have duct work. Most have a single zone, but some have two or three zones. The advantages are no duct work, reasonably quiet with inside unit sound levels of 22-38 dba and very efficient with 18 Seer efficiency rating.

However one of my favorite sayings is new solutions have new problems. The system I found is made by Mitsubishi. It is 18,000 btu/hr, costs about $2,500 for materials and weighs about 175 lbs. Two inside zones each with dimensions of 30x11x8" (pretty large). Compressors require 240v not 120v. There will need to be 4 penetrations through the Airstream shell for the refrigerant lines.

For me right now, I will stick with my propane furnace, that works fine, and my Armstrong airconditioner, that also works fine, even though it is a little loud and vibrates more than I like- This motivates me to open the windows and turn on the Endless Breeze fans if it is not too hot, so I don't have to listen to the noisy air conditioner. My first option would be to go after a quiet efficient new air conditioner and just run it on low.

Dan

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Old 03-28-2012, 08:02 AM   #27
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Check out this site as they carry a huge quantity of mobile air conditioning components.

Danhard Inc Mobile HVAC components and systems
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Old 03-28-2012, 08:37 AM   #28
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Check out this site as they carry a huge quantity of mobile air conditioning components.

Danhard Inc Mobile HVAC components and systems
A system with components like this may work well. Although I'm not sure if they solve the noise problem. There's nothing that says the condenser and evaporator has to be on the roof of the trailer. Leave the condenser up there if it makes sense and put two or three evaporators around the trailer where needed. I don't know exactly how to plumb this but I'm sure Danhard knows. They could design a system that will be much more effective and hopefully less noisy than a unit that drowns out everything while it's running. Are you listening Airstream?

Back to the ducted idea for a minute. I was thinking of the high velocity units when I chimed in above in support of ducted systems. I don't think simply running duct from an A/C unit to several output locations is the best solution. Yes, it is a solution but probably not the best solution.

I've seen the high velocity systems installed in homes and think they work well. I haven't studied the system to know how it works but the fan is obviously different than a traditional roof mounted unit. The system simply needs to be scaled down to accomodate an RV.

I'm sure the high velocity fan could be put in a cabinet or in the belly pan and make a fantastic improvement over the archaic roof mounted/roof blower system Airstream uses now. Yeah, I know the roof mounted system works but what happened to the thought Airstream espouses - we only make improvements, not changes. Guess Airstream doesn't think the A/C system needs to be improved.

Lucius
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