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07-10-2008, 12:42 PM
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#1
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3 Rivet Member
2005 31' Classic
Gretna
, Nebraska
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 152
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poor refrigerator performance
While at Bozeman I began to experience poor performance of my fridge. It used to cool very well, but during the hot weather it became less effective. Temps now vary from 30's to low 60's depending on outside temp.
So if this fridge is defective, what (other than a fire hazard) will become obvious? Did I lose coolant and not get the explosion? We were on propane.
Guess it is time to find a Dometic repairman.
Dwight
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07-10-2008, 01:42 PM
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#2
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Patriotic
1973 23' Safari
North of Boston
, Massachusetts
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 4,546
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(took the liberty of moving your post to a new thread, as it has nothing to do with the recall being discussed in the other thread...)
Is this the first time you've run the fridge whilst being parked in the wide-open hot sun?
If your cooling unit went south, you'd smell ammonia. see here: Tour of America » Meltdown
It could just be poor air circulation behind the fridge. This is a problem more with newer trailers with side-wall venting, (the old style floor-to-roof type venting creates a better natural chimney effect), particularly those with the trailer doors can actually cover up the fridge vents.
you can get aftermarket kits with little 12v fans that'll help keep the air moving back there. First, though, I'd check the flue area and make sure its clear of any obstructions, etc.
here's a link to a kit that can help, if the problem is poor air circulation:
http://www.snydersrvrefrigeration.com/2301.html
__________________
Air:291
Wbcci: 3752
'73 Safari 23'
'00 Dodge Ram 1500 4x4 QC
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08-11-2008, 07:28 AM
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#3
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2 Rivet Member
2009 25' FB Flying Cloud
Anniston
, Alabama
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 69
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I'm interested in what you find out about your problem. We're experiencing the exact same problem with a brand new 2008 (less than 5 months old). I've emailed the dealer and am waiting on a response.
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08-11-2008, 09:52 AM
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#4
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Rivet Master
Commercial Member
Vintage Kin Owner
Naples
, Florida
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 7,508
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Chuck is right, and his link to Snyder's WILL SOLVE YOUR PROBLEMS.
Technically, the condenser (top section of the cooling unit with the fins on it) is overheating and this extra heat degrades the performance of the fridge (PM me if you want the full, in-depth explanation). Why do you think this section has fins on it???
Anyway, the best way to keep your fridge temps within the specified operating range (36* - 43*) is to have cooler air constantly moving across the condenser. While just a fan might do it, Snyder's kit has a plenum and thermostat which will direct the air properly over the condenser....when it's needed.
If the kit alone is not enough, then you will need an additional boxer type fan sucking the hot air OUT of the upper vent. I have an arrangement like this and the fridge never goes above 40*....even in 110*+ temps or direct sun.
__________________
lewster
Solar Tech Energy Systems, Inc.
Victron Solar Components and Inverters, Zamp Solar Panels, LiFeBlue and Battle Born Lithium Batteries, Lifeline AGM Batteries
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08-11-2008, 10:00 AM
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#5
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Rivet Master
2003 22' International CCD
Kiln
, Mississippi
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,779
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Lew,
I just installed a Snyder cool kit - and it helps but still I feel there needs to be some more decrease in fridge temps for the food to be stored for a while. The freezer is ice box cold now. Did you close all but the fan opening for a better pull out the top vent? I'm afraid that my 2nd fan is still pulling air around the left and right of the large top vent opening and I have some dead air inside the fridge void that remains hot.
Mike
__________________
Michael & Tina with Layla and Preston BZ The family has grown. 2003 22' INTERNATIONAL CCD
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08-11-2008, 10:22 AM
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#6
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Rivet Master
Commercial Member
Vintage Kin Owner
Naples
, Florida
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 7,508
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MIke,
The 2 side door arrangement that A/S uses does tend to trap heated air in the upper section of the refer compartment. I use the second fan to blow OUT thru the upper vent. It is fastened to the top of the upper door frame, and does a good job of pulling the remaining hot air out of the compartment.
__________________
lewster
Solar Tech Energy Systems, Inc.
Victron Solar Components and Inverters, Zamp Solar Panels, LiFeBlue and Battle Born Lithium Batteries, Lifeline AGM Batteries
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08-11-2008, 10:39 AM
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#7
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Rivet Master
2006 30' Classic
Farmington
, New Mexico
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 826
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fridge performance
When our 06 31' classic was new we had a similar problem and did all the "fan things" mention here trying to get it cooler. They helped some but never really fixed it. Come to find out the out the switch that turns the interior lamp on was not turning it off. That little halogen lamp will bring interior interior temps up into the 60's. The problem with the switch was the plunger didn't make contact with the door when it closed and shut the lamp off. The best way to check it is open the door and quickly touch the bulb. If it's warm you can bet that's the problem----pieman
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08-11-2008, 01:01 PM
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#8
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Moderator
2015 25' FB Flying Cloud
2012 23' FB Flying Cloud
2005 25' Safari
Santa Rosa Beach
, Florida
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 13,156
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Lucy (our '05 25FB) had all the same refer problems described in this thread. We especially had this problem when on LP in the real hot weather.
About a month ago, I installed a small 12 volt fan (from Home Depot for $23) in the outside refer box, and aimed it up on the coils. I use it mostly while underway. It has made a phenomenal difference in refer performance.
Before I installed the fan, I would bring the refer down below 30 during the night. I would run on gas all day on 5. When I would make camp that night, the refer would be up at 45-50 degrees.
Now I start in the morning at 35 degrees. I run all day on 4. At the end of the day the inside temp in the refer is 30! What a difference.
We do a lot of camping in hot damp weather, so this has been a great find for us.
Brian
__________________
SuEllyn & Brian McCabe
WBCCI #3628 -- AIR #14872 -- TAC #FL-7
2015 FC 25' FB (Lucy) with ProPride
2020 Silverado 2500 (Vivian)
2023 Rivian R1T (Opal)
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08-11-2008, 03:26 PM
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#9
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3 Rivet Member
2005 31' Classic
Gretna
, Nebraska
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 152
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Dometic cooling
At our luncheon today several of us discussed the cooling fan issue. Location, that is.
I see that a fan mounted on the floor of the compartment has brought good results.
Some of us have purchased computer fans (12 volt) to be placed where they will blow upward on the coils. Others talk of installing the fan(or 2 fans) so that air is drawn in the louvers of the door vent. This may blow against the heating element (gas/elec) and cause loss of efficiency?
My fridge has done very well on test runs since we returned home (sitting in the shed). As asked, our time in Bozeman was the first time we have used the fridge in real hot weather. I see the weather channel indicates it was 102 in Bozeman on the 4th of July. That is when we had the problem. Sitting in shade and set on "4" the freezer gets down to -13. That will keep ice cream any day.
Part of this is obviously a learning curve thing. Comments?
Dwight
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08-11-2008, 07:27 PM
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#10
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Rivet Master
Commercial Member
Vintage Kin Owner
Naples
, Florida
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 7,508
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Lewis
When our 06 31' classic was new we had a similar problem and did all the "fan things" mention here trying to get it cooler. They helped some but never really fixed it. Come to find out the out the switch that turns the interior lamp on was not turning it off. That little halogen lamp will bring interior interior temps up into the 60's. The problem with the switch was the plunger didn't make contact with the door when it closed and shut the lamp off. The best way to check it is open the door and quickly touch the bulb. If it's warm you can bet that's the problem----pieman
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Mike,
Are you sure that it was the door contact, and that you don't have a 'low ambient temp' switch somewhere on the door frame. The purpose of this switch is to keep the interior light on, which tricks the fridge to keep working in low outdoor temps...like under 40*F. If that bulb is on in normal temps, it surely will keep the interior over 55*!
__________________
lewster
Solar Tech Energy Systems, Inc.
Victron Solar Components and Inverters, Zamp Solar Panels, LiFeBlue and Battle Born Lithium Batteries, Lifeline AGM Batteries
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08-11-2008, 11:48 PM
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#11
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4 Rivet Member
2005 25' International CCD
1960 18' "Footer"
1959 26' Overlander
Riverside
, California
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 339
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lewster
Mike,
Are you sure that it was the door contact, and that you don't have a 'low ambient temp' switch somewhere on the door frame. The purpose of this switch is to keep the interior light on, which tricks the fridge to keep working in low outdoor temps...like under 40*F. If that bulb is on in normal temps, it surely will keep the interior over 55*!
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I am going to have to follow up on Lewster's information on an ambient temp switch and the interior light bulb staying on, but I will relate our experience with our 2005 25' CCD. Bought used one year old it never seemed to be as cold as the refrigerator on our previous 22' CCD. Even noticed the odor of propane under the cover at all times. Decided the regulator must be leaking and replaced it but no improvement. Talked with Marshall Brass (regulator manufacturer) and did the leak down test as directed. No leaks in over 36 hours.
Decided to put a wireless thermometer inside the refrigerator and record the temps, as high as 54 degrees on a 100 degree day here in Southern California. Ordered and installed the Snyder fan kit. Temps dropped about 2 degrees, to 52 on 100 degree days. Not what I hoped for.
Re-evaluated what I did know, the refrigerator worked well on electricity, ~40 degrees on 100 degree days, but poorly on LP. Decided that maybe I wasn't getting enough heat on propane to the boiler tube so I when through all the instructions about making sure the flame is centered, air adjusted well, etc. Made no difference. I finally decided I would check the LP pressure at the refrigerator, Dometic states it should be 10 1/2 to 11 inches of water. Built a manometer using readily available materials from Home depot (30 year hydraulics engineer and auto/motorcycle mechanic) and finally checked the pressure; WOW only 8 inches of water! Adjusted the pressure to 10 1/2 inches and then redid the wireless temperature monitoring on 100 degree days. Max temps now about 42 degrees.
My recommendation, if your trailer is under warranty or if you are uncomfortable working on critical systems in your car, motorcycle or trailer, take it to a dealer and have them check the gas pressure at both the refrigerator and stove. For good measure have them check it with the furnace burner running to make sure the regulator can maintain the pressure under adverse conditions.
BTW, one of the Sierra Nevada Unit members had the same problem after the dealer replaced the refrigerator cooling unit under warranty. We pulled out the manometer at last years Twin Lakes Rally at Bridgeport, CA. Same problem about 8 inches of water pressure. A quick adjustment and it worked like new.
__________________
Don (KD6UVT) & Gail Williams
What do you want to be in life, a spectator or a participant?
SNU #157
FCU #004
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08-12-2008, 03:48 AM
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#12
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Cyclist
2007 28' International CCD
Windermere
, Florida
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 457
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I bought a small 120v fan at Walmart. There's an outlet inside outside access door.
I just set the fan in there and run it on hot days. Otherwise refridge cools well.
Tom
__________________
2007 28' Int CCD.
2011 F 250 Big Honking Diesel
DTV 5lnb on a tripod.
Wilson wired repeater with YAG.
Two big screens
15dB Backfire WiFi antenna and WaveMagnum
Centramatics.
Hawkshead Tire Monitors.
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08-12-2008, 04:19 AM
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#13
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Rivet Master
2014 25' Flying Cloud
Cuddebackville
, New York
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 4,333
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My 2007 Safari came with a 12v fan from the factory. You turn it ion qith a wall mounted switch, then it cycles on a thermostat as needed. It make a big difference especially when the Safari's door is open or that side is getting direct sun.
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08-12-2008, 08:57 AM
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#14
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INSANITY CENTRAL
1986 32' Excella
Airstream Funeral Coach
Citrus Heights
, California
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,108
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My 86 Excella has the same lackluster performance on both propane and 110V.usually only happens when it's over 90F outside.I put a 110V fan directed up in the area between the reefer and body, helps a little. When not hooked up to shore power I freeze a few water bottles and place them in the fridge section. This has seemed to work best, and I have a small blue cube fan in the fridge section also. The freezer always works superbly!
Funny, I've been monitoring my temps with a indoor/outdoor thermometer recently. fridge always 38-40F in the am then rises up to mid 50 late afternoon.
My findings indicate the use of frozen water bottles to be helpful.
DG
__________________
www.popasmoke.com
Proud Appellation American
Vine View Heights is now closed.
YETI ( 65 Quart )
IGLOO (Ice Cube, 50 Quart )
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09-28-2008, 08:46 PM
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#15
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3 Rivet Member
1995 25' Excella
waynesboro
, Virginia
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 128
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fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by moosetags
Lucy (our '05 25FB) had all the same refer problems described in this thread. We especially had this problem when on LP in the real hot weather.
About a month ago, I installed a small 12 volt fan (from Home Depot for $23) in the outside refer box, and aimed it up on the coils. I use it mostly while underway. It has made a phenomenal difference in refer performance.
Before I installed the fan, I would bring the refer down below 30 during the night. I would run on gas all day on 5. When I would make camp that night, the refer would be up at 45-50 degrees.
Now I start in the morning at 35 degrees. I run all day on 4. At the end of the day the inside temp in the refer is 30! What a difference.
We do a lot of camping in hot damp weather, so this has been a great find for us.
Brian
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where do you hook the 12 volt fan for power supply?
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09-29-2008, 05:17 AM
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#16
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Rivet Master
2014 25' Flying Cloud
Cuddebackville
, New York
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 4,333
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One concern I have about Snyder's conversion is that it looks like the cooling fins are completely enclosed by the plenum. To me that would mean the fan HAS to run most of the time. Even though the fan is a low draw I'd prefer to allow the refrigerator work without a fan at times. I like the idea of adding a second fan better. I'm going to do that and replace the original fan, using two quieter models.
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09-29-2008, 08:34 AM
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#17
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Moderator
2015 25' FB Flying Cloud
2012 23' FB Flying Cloud
2005 25' Safari
Santa Rosa Beach
, Florida
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 13,156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waltero
where do you hook the 12 volt fan for power supply?
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I hooked the wires of the 12 volt fan to the 12 volt DC power block in the outside refer cabinet. I just put the fan leads in the the other 12 volt power wires. I used a multi-meter to insure that I was on a 12 volt DC line. It should read out at 13-14 volts DC.
I went out this morning and took a couple of pictures of my setup. The white wires are from the fan.
Brian
__________________
SuEllyn & Brian McCabe
WBCCI #3628 -- AIR #14872 -- TAC #FL-7
2015 FC 25' FB (Lucy) with ProPride
2020 Silverado 2500 (Vivian)
2023 Rivian R1T (Opal)
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09-29-2008, 08:54 AM
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#18
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Rivet Master
2005 28' International CCD
Willoughby
, Ohio
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 543
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Hello -
We had the same problem. I researched the threads here and then went to Radio Shack and bought a medium-large (3") computer cooling fan (12v), a piece of metal strapping, a switch and some wire. I cut the strapping into two equal pieces and fashioned a bracket for the fan. I mounted the fan on the floor of the refrigerator compartment, wired it into a 12v power source and attached the switch. The fan blows air up across the coils and throught the refrigerator vent in the roof. When the weather is hot, I flip the switch to turn the fan on and it keeps the fridge very cold. In cooler weather, I keep it switched off. I don't have access until Friday to take a picture, but if I remember (I'm growing old and forgetful), I"ll take a few and post them over the weekend.
There are kits out there for retail sale, but the two I tried before this solution had VERY noisy fans - this is pretty quiet.
Best of luck!
__________________
Steve & Susan
WBCCI# 03876
AIR# 6511
2005 28' CCD, 2011 Sierra 5.3L, Equal-I-Zer
Empty Nesters - spending our money on OURSELVES for a change!
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09-29-2008, 10:15 AM
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#19
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Rivet Master
1991 34' Excella
Princeton
, New Jersey
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 7,070
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I also have had poor performance with my Frig.
My first approach was to install a 12 volt fan controlled by a 110 degree thermostat. This did not solve the problem. I have removed the fan.
Looking at Dometic's installation requirements and Airstream installation I realized that the Frig was exposed to the heated air of the condenser on 5 sides. With that in mind I removed the Frig and installed pillow type insulation on the 2 sides that would fit tight to the frig when reinstalled. I made a sheet metal False back that reduced the air column up the back of the frig to more closely meet Dometic's requirements of 1 in. clearance. This insures the natural chimney convection.
While this has helped I would be interested in info on where to get info on the Snyder Kit.
__________________
WBCCI 12156 AIR 3144 WACHUNG TAC NJ6
2004 Excursion 4x4
1991 34 ft. Excella +220,000 miles, new laminated flooring, new upholstery, new 3200 lbs axles
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09-29-2008, 02:00 PM
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#20
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2 Rivet Member
2007 27' Classic FB
Havelock
, North Carolina
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moosetags
I hooked the wires of the 12 volt fan to the 12 volt DC power block in the outside refer cabinet. I just put the fan leads in the the other 12 volt power wires. I used a multi-meter to insure that I was on a 12 volt DC line. It should read out at 13-14 volts DC.
I went out this morning and took a couple of pictures of my setup. The white wires are from the fan.
Brian
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Where in Home Depot do they sell 12v fans?
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