Which is better to have 4x2 or 4x4 as Tow Vehicle?

[Bob4x4]

Wow,this maybe the most intense thread I have seen on this forum.It seems a bit biased towards the my way is right for everybody and everybody else is wrong for everybody.
The true correct answer will vary depending on use and budget.
For me,my handle should be enough for anybody to pick up on my use.I am happy to say that I have been happily pulling my(as someone stated earlier) fragile Safari to off road locations for almost 10 years now.Many places I choose to camp are only accessable to capable 4 wheel drives.I stop to give aid to lesser vehicles that have become stuck without trailers-an off roaders code.The amount of money I have invested to be able to camp where I want when I want has been my choice.It may not be for everybody.That's fine with me,this is America.

[Gene]

Originally Posted by Ag&Au

I think it's time to turn to proven scientific facts.

Dogs buy 4X4.

kittens buy 2WD.

Those facts should put this subject to rest.

Ken

That's the way it should go….

Bob4x4, if you think this thread is intense, you need to look around some more, especially at the ones that have been closed to prevent all out firefights.

Gene

[MrUKToad]

Originally Posted by Ag&Au

I think it's time to turn to proven scientific facts.

Men buy 4X4.

Little girls buy 2WD.

Those facts should put this subject to rest.

Ken

Wow! Gender specific vehicles! That's clearly where I've been going wrong all these years.

[MrUKToad]

Originally Posted by REDNAX

Defining "need" is the problem with threads on this topic.

Indeed it is, Rednax. With regard to TVs in general, not just with 2/4WD issues, it seems to me, IMHO, that the marketing and sales people define the need

[Bob4x4]

Originally Posted by CrawfordGene

That's the way it should go….

Bob4x4, if you think this thread is intense, you need to look around some more, especially at the ones that have been closed to prevent all out firefights.

Gene

Generally speaking for this forum............

[ElCamino Man]

Originally Posted by ROBERTSUNRUS

Shame on you for laughing at someone who got stuck instead of helping them. I guess that there has never been a time in your life that someone helped you.

Id lend a helping hand if needed

Im just sayin, if everyone thinks "I dont need a 4wd truck" and goes to the same place your now stuck at, whatdya do?

I wouldnt have to think twice about helping a fellow camper, but Id have to get a chuckle out of the situation

[dznf0g]

Several years ago, I worked the Farm Progress show, which is held in the middle of a midwest corn field. LITERALLY. Anyway, it rained....not a little, but a Woodstock kind of scene. Here are my observations with about 8" deep fine midwest topsoil mud and all four major brand of trucks present:

Saw a dually 4wd with a locker pull a semi tractor trailer out.

Generally graded best to worst:

1) 4wd with a locker
2) 2wd with a locker
3) 4wd with limited slip
4) 4wd with open diffs
5) 2wd with limited slip
6) 2wd with open diffs all had to be pulled or pushed out

So, my point is, not all 2wd's are created equally. For towing, I believe a 2wd with an Eaton LOCKER performs better than many 4wd configurations.

[Ag&Au]

Here is an interesting situation to ponder:

Backing a trailer up an incline from flat ground with a weight distribution hitch and a 2WD (rear wheel drive) TV.

The weight distribution bars are already lifting up on the rear of the TV. As the trailer axle starts up the hill, the trailer frame acts as additional leverage lifting the rear of the WD bars higher and higher as the axle proceeds up the hill. This additional upward force will transfer enough weight to the front axle of the TV to cause the rear wheels to loose traction. I know this will happen, because I have done it.

Ken

[Globie64]

you guys are too funny. The point about need is well put: the TV and trailer are a package, duh, but if you live with the TV every day, does the choice in trailer drive the choice in TV, or do you choose something you'll be okay with driving every day, and buy a slightly smaller trailer? I'd say, be more clear on what size trailer you want before buying the TV, you've got lots and lots of time. As for 4WD, our trailer is little enough that our Pilot tows it easily, and the AWD in the Pilot has been great trying to maneuver on soggy ground.

[dznf0g]

Originally Posted by Ag&Au

Here is an interesting situation to ponder:

Backing a trailer up an incline from flat ground with a weight distribution hitch and a 2WD (rear wheel drive) TV.

The weight distribution bars are already lifting up on the rear of the TV. As the trailer axle starts up the hill, the trailer frame acts as additional leverage lifting the rear of the WD bars higher and higher as the axle proceeds up the hill. This additional upward force will transfer enough weight to the front axle of the TV to cause the rear wheels to loose traction. I know this will happen, because I have done it.

Ken

That's true, Ken. Equally interesting.....get into a twist ditch scenario where opposite corners of the truck are loaded and the opposing corners are "suspended". An open diff (and maybe a limited slip, depending on circumstances) 4wd is going nowhere and a 2wd with a locker (or 4wd with locker) isn't even going to know there is a traction issue.

I'm not arguing one over the other. It is not as simple a question to answer as most would make it. IMO, a 4wd has the most benefit for towing, not from a traction standpoint, but the ability to move into the low set when trying to muscle 9000#s around in a tight uphill spot. The greatly reduced strain on the engine and trans as well as the ability to better control applied torque can't be had in any STOCK 2wd.

[Ag&Au]

Originally Posted by dznf0g

That's true, Ken. Equally interesting.....get into a twist ditch scenario where opposite corners of the truck are loaded and the opposing corners are "suspended". An open diff (and maybe a limited slip, depending on circumstances) 4wd is going nowhere and a 2wd with a locker (or 4wd with locker) isn't even going to know there is a traction issue.

I'm not arguing one over the other. It is not as simple a question to answer as most would make it. IMO, a 4wd has the most benefit for towing, not from a traction standpoint, but the ability to move into the low set when trying to muscle 9000#s around in a tight uphill spot. The greatly reduced strain on the engine and trans as well as the ability to better control applied torque can't be had in any STOCK 2wd.

I can't (and probably wouldn't if I could) argue with anything you have said. I have been around 4WD since my dad bought the first 4WD Jeep station available for sale in the pacific northwest in 1949. I was 6 years old. Unfortunately I have not done a good job keeping up with technological advances lately. I am intrigued by the systems that sense the amount of slippage on each individual wheel and redirect the torque to where it does the most good. I will sooner or later find something to read that explain how that works. I think the ultimate solution is a system that drops a set of tank tracks over the wheels when necessary.

Ken

[dznf0g]

Those are referred, most often as AWD. And they are THE BEST at on road traction. Computer controlled and can send power to each slipping wheel independently in some of the more advanced cases. They, however, are complicated mechanically and are not as robust as 4wd. Other than electronic controls and some auto engagement add ons, 4wd is pretty much the same as it was in your Dad's old Jeep, mechanically.

The Yukon XL Denali I'm driving now, Escalade and others are AWD. No low set though

There is a tank tread system for trucks! they actually bolt onto the existing lugnuts and are used up in the arctic. See here :

Mattracks | Worldwide Rubber Track Technology

[Globie64]

Re: AWD, I didn't mention that I used the AWD lock on my Pilot towing in muck, not anything uneven or steep, but but it locks the four wheels and make a noticeable difference.

[Ag&Au]

Originally Posted by dznf0g

............................

There is a tank tread system for trucks! they actually bolt onto the existing lugnuts and are used up in the arctic. See here :

Mattracks | Worldwide Rubber Track Technology

I wonder if I can get these in chrome for the Airsteam.

Mattracks | Models | Trail-R-Mates | HD-B

Ken

[Ag&Au]

Originally Posted by Globie64

Re: AWD, I didn't mention that I used the AWD lock on my Pilot towing in muck, not anything uneven or steep, but but it locks the four wheels and make a noticeable difference.

Could you post a larger version of your avatar. I would like to see what your setup looks like.

Ken

[Len n Jeanne]

Given the type of camping we do, it is 4x4, hands down.

A big advantage in the more scenic parts of the West, is the ability to drop the Bambi in its campsite, and then take off in the truck for a day in the back-of-beyond. Many of the roads are unsuitable for anything but 4x4.

A pick-up truck with a cap (canopy) on the back adds significantly to our gear storage capacity.

I also feel that Easterners sometimes get a yen to explore the western National Parks, so it might be good to keep your travel options open.

On the other hand, the people at Can Am in Ontario where we bought the Bambi thought that a big old Chrysler sedan was the ultimate tow vehicle. On pavement, I imagine.

[CDONA]

Just to add a bit of a twist to this thread,

That viagra commercial with the cowboy hauling horses gets his 4X4 (straight axle, locker front hubs) stuck with one wheel spinning and has to resort to two horsepower to pull thru the mud hole.


Discuss, , ,

[Ag&Au]

Originally Posted by CDONA

Just to add a bit of a twist to this thread,

That viagra commercial with the cowboy hauling horses gets his 4X4 (straight axle, locker front hubs) stuck with one wheel spinning and has to resort to two horsepower to pull thru the mud hole.


Discuss, , ,

Did that work because he gave the horses Viagra?

Ken

[dznf0g]

Originally Posted by CDONA

Just to add a bit of a twist to this thread,

That viagra commercial with the cowboy hauling horses gets his 4X4 (straight axle, locker front hubs) stuck with one wheel spinning and has to resort to two horsepower to pull thru the mud hole.


Discuss, , ,

That's not what a locker is. He had 4wd with open differentials.

[ROBERT CROSS]

Originally Posted by dznf0g

That's not what a locker is. He had 4wd with open differentials.

WHAT....that commercial isn't real.
But it was on tv...if it was on the cyberweb it would have to be tru.

Bob