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Old 12-22-2017, 11:14 AM   #21
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I Guess The Moderator Is Off For The Holidays

I love this Forum because it’s generally free of the vitriol which seems to have become normalized in today’s USA. Let’s keep our Forum free of it.
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Old 12-22-2017, 11:24 AM   #22
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Social media has the power to sway public opinion. But it's not the public whose opinion needs to be swayed in order to get more public campgrounds built. It's Congress, or the State Legislature, and social media is much less powerful than lobbyists with briefcases full of cash when it comes to swaying elected officials.[/QUOTE]

The RV industry and related suppliers (Dometic, Thetford, Dexter, etc.) might consider their lobbying strategy and how their briefcases of cash are allocated.

As for NC, we traveled there this past fall from Asheville to Raleigh to Wilmington.There is much to see and do in that lovely state. We did have to plan carefully for space, but it all worked out well.
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Old 12-22-2017, 11:36 AM   #23
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It was really bad here in Alabama. The park system continually made money year after year, but the politicians typically raided the surplus (and then some) for pet projects and as expected the parks continually fell into disrepair with some just being closed. Finally the good voters of this state voted to stop that crap. Now, in theory, the money will stay in the park system. Only time will tell if we start seeing improvements and closed parks re-opened, but at least it's a step in the right direction.
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Old 12-22-2017, 11:58 AM   #24
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One of my favorites, The North Abutment Campground, Grenada Lake, Grenada, MS stays booked.
It is a great campground, and add to that they are installing sewer hookups.
There is an annual event in June every year called Thunder on Water with concerts, car show, carnival, arts and crafts, tractor pull...
I know I have to book 6 months ahead, but I couldn't get a spot for the June 7-10, 2018 Thunder on Water even trying to book 6 months ahead.
You have to be at your computer at midnight exactly 1890 days prior to get a spot...
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Old 12-22-2017, 01:19 PM   #25
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Chuck Woodbury of RVTravel.com has been spreading the word on this problem for a LOOOOOOONG time now. He has also noted that EVERY DAY, 11,000+ people turn 65 and, that many of those new seniors are trying the RV lifestyle. Couple those numbers with RECORD numbers of RVs being built and sold and, the RV industry is in for some VERY difficult times in the near future. Chuck also points out that, many private campgrounds are "upgrading" their properties by building camping cabins so that folks without RVs can enjoy the camping experience. The problem is, that every cabin built takes up TWO (or more) RV sites so, existing campgrounds have FEWER RV campsites than they used to have!

Sadly, there are NO simple solutions here. There are, however, opportunities. Who will recognize these opportunities and, have the resources to act, is the $64,000.00 question. Hopefully, we won't have to wait too long for this to happen.
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Old 12-22-2017, 02:11 PM   #26
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Apology

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The boom in the RV industry is resulting in crowded campgrounds and increasingly advance reservations are necessary to secure a site in the more popular public and private campgrounds. Few new private campgrounds are being built to meet the increasing demand due to high land costs and local regulatory issues. States and the national park system have budget restrictions. Unless those of us who use the parks speak out, government will allocate its limited resources to other activities. The squeaky wheel usually gets oiled!

Social media has the power to make a difference. I encourage each of you to post on the blogs and Facebook pages of your state park systems and National Park Service requesting more dollars be allocated to building and improving campgrounds for RV's.

My home state, North Carolina, has been behind neighboring states in developing campsites but additional money is now flowing into the system and some camping enthusiasts are speaking up. I'm linking below an announcement on the North Carolina State Parks blog about $11 million of new funding for improvements. Please go to the link, scroll to the comments section at the bottom of the page, and join me and others in requesting the parks system spend more to add and improve campgrounds.

If you have ideas as to how we in the Airstream community can work together to push for more and better public camping facilities, please chime in by adding your thoughts.

$11 Million New Funding for NC State Parks
Read my post from last night and need to apologize for my comments and my tone. Not my typical reply nor one that should be tolerated on this great forum. Please accept my apology to you and the other forum members.
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Old 12-22-2017, 02:55 PM   #27
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I love this Forum because it’s generally free of the vitriol which seems to have become normalized in today’s USA. Let’s keep our Forum free of it.
There's a lot of it on the Internet but thankfully I don't see a lot out in the world. Moderators will hopefully delete politics when they see it.
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Old 12-22-2017, 06:10 PM   #28
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StrmyWeather: Thank you for your sincere post this afternoon. Your consideration is a perfect example of what makes Airstream Forums great. Religion and politics discussions aren't needed here. That's good advice for holiday family dinners too. This Forum is all about Airstreams and adventures people have with them.

David
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Old 12-22-2017, 06:48 PM   #29
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Thanks StrmyWeather; Merry Christmas!
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Old 12-22-2017, 07:19 PM   #30
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This was a very interesting read! RVing has always been a way to get away from the stress of everyday living. Let us not change that!
Here is something my wife and I did in 2005. We bought some land next to the Nantahala National Forest in western North Carolina. We cleared a small opening for our camper and camped there on weekends at least once a month. This was a great central location for many enjoyable activities. We have yet to install electricity or sewage. The reason we only spent weekends there, but it has been very enjoyable. Just an idea, make your own camping location.
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Old 12-22-2017, 11:32 PM   #31
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Oregon State parks are some of the best with the most common complaint that there are too many trees. The system is entirely funded by user fees. If you don’t reserve early in the year for a site from June through September, you will be lucky to get multiple nights in the same site or CG.
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Old 12-23-2017, 03:40 AM   #32
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Alabama gets a fix

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Originally Posted by MWBishop View Post
It was really bad here in Alabama. The park system continually made money year after year, but the politicians typically raided the surplus (and then some) for pet projects and as expected the parks continually fell into disrepair with some just being closed.
There are some nice parks in Alabama, but the last time I was there, a few years back, conditions were not good. Park was falling down, to be honest.

Glad to hear the voters revolted!
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Old 12-23-2017, 04:56 AM   #33
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Read my post from last night and need to apologize for my comments and my tone. Not my typical reply nor one that should be tolerated on this great forum. Please accept my apology to you and the other forum members.
Strmy Weather,

Thank you.

Life is good. Best wishes for the rest of 2017 and the new year.
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Old 12-23-2017, 05:02 AM   #34
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Good to see peace among members! You guys have great holidays!
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Old 12-23-2017, 05:36 AM   #35
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State Parks in Arkansas

We have greatly enjoyed state parks across the country. One state that stands out is Arkansas. Many of the state parks were constructed during the Great Depression by the CCCC. By the mid 1990's the park infrastructure was crumbling and the state was considering closing parks. In 1996, Amendment 75 to the state constitution was passed by the voters establishing a 1/8 cent conservation sales tax to repair, renovate and improve the State parks. Since the passage of that Amendment, the state has poured the revenue generated from this small tax into upgrading and maintaining state parks and natural areas.

By creating the small 1/8 cent sales tax in the Constitution, the people of the state ensured the revenue would be protected from the whims of future state legislatures. Twenty years later the state has one of the finest state park systems in the country. It is estimated the 52 parks generate $250 million in economic activity for the state today.

I'd gladly pay a 1/8 cent increase in sales tax if the money was dedicated to maintaining and improving public lands for the enjoyment of people today and future generations. If you haven't visited Arkansas and its wonderful state parks with your Airstream, I encourage you to go and enjoy the investment the people of the state have made to preserve their public lands.
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Old 12-23-2017, 08:44 AM   #36
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Agree. So I have an idea.
Why not have a campground that is owned, themed, and caters to Airstream, as an example. A few around the United States.
Be careful what you wish for. A campground built by Thor? You'd need to replace the power pedestal before using it.
Seriously, here in Tampa, Lazy Days, the mega motorhome dealer, has a very nice campground just behind their property. I like the idea of dealers adding campgrounds, that way they spur sales in their own area. Let Camping World add a campground next to their stores.
Unfortunately, all these good ideas fall on deaf ears of companies who only worry about the bottom line. Maybe now with tax cuts, dealers will have more cash for expansion.

In talking to campground owners, the biggest threat is local government seeing them as a source of "free money". They're being taxed/regulated out of existence.

I still like the idea of "Just passing through" spaces. Reasonably priced, no facilities (or minimal). How many campground spaces would be freed up if those who just wanted to spend the night opened up? (Think: a parking lot inside a campground fence.)

As far as the feds providing more funding to public recreation areas, just remember the "budget" says we spend $4.5 TRILLION a year. Twenty years ago, we spent $1.7 trillion. I could opine where the money went, but then I'd be too political. Suffice it to say, politicians buy votes, and campgrounds aren't PC enough.
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Old 12-23-2017, 08:56 AM   #37
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The Need for More Campgrounds

Owning a private campground has got to be a challenge. First you need upfront money to build it out, then you need operating capital until you are "discovered". Then you need to keep up the maintenance, deal with demanding clients, late night antics, vandalism...

And even if you get through all that, you have to worry if a Walmart (Cabelas, Flying J...) is going to plop down nearby and siphon off all your overnight business. Is somebody gonna drop a black tank full of their "home brew" tank treatment into your septic system and kill it?

I wouldn't do it -- don't have the patience (or the $$$)
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Old 12-23-2017, 09:05 AM   #38
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I wouldn't recommend it, either, unless you really know what you're getting into.

But if you are interested, I'd probably buy a "used" park, not build new. There are quite a few available. The site linked below is the one we used to sell our park over a year ago; it lists quite a few for sale -- which is why we listed our park there a few years ago. (No connection to us otherwise.)

https://www.rvparkstore.com/rv-parks-for-sale


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Owning a private campground has got to be a challenge. First you need upfront money to build it out, then you need operating capital until you are "discovered". Then you need to keep up the maintenance, deal with demanding clients, late night antics, vandalism...

And even if you get through all that, you have to worry if a Walmart (Cabelas, Flying J...) is going to plop down nearby and siphon off all your overnight business. Is somebody gonna drop a black tank full of their "home brew" tank treatment into your septic system and kill it.

I wouldn't do it -- don't have the patience (or the $$$)
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Old 12-23-2017, 09:27 AM   #39
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Missouri, where I used to live, has a small percentage tax for parks in the sales tax. The voters approved of it again a couple of years ago. Missouri has added two more state parks but the process can take a decade. You still have to book during the high season for most of the parks.

We are planning to be in Oregon in June and have already booked our sites in 5 state parks along the coast. Most of the RV sites had been booked so if we waited another month they would all be gone. We are also already booked in Crater Lake for September since the concessionaire allows more than a 6 month booking window. We are starting to book for July 2018 and next month it will be for August 2018 for milestone destinations.

Just the way it is.
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Old 12-23-2017, 12:12 PM   #40
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The Need for More Campgrounds

In California, and perhaps other places with national parks that are more outdoors oriented rather than historically oriented, a strong trend has been evident over the last 20 years or so to remove development from national parks and restore wilderness. This trend has been most evident to me in Yosemite Park. “Development” to be removed is not limited to McDonalds hamburger stands and game arcades, but includes established campgrounds, historical bridges, and even a string of back country huts that have been used by backpackers for many decades. Often the excuse is that the campgrounds to be removed were poorly situated to start with and susceptible to flooding, etc., but when they are removed they are not replaced. I'm sure that given the difficulty of finding an open campsite in Yosemite, Airstreamers and tent campers alike would welcome a primitive campground that has been minimally restored after flooding to clear debris and open the roads.

The driving force behind these closures is not practicality, but a mission to restore the national park as nearly as possible to the condition it was in prior to being used for recreation. If you believe this is a good idea, fine. I don't think it's a good idea, but there are lots of worse ideas floating around these days.

However, realize that the percentage of the land in national parks such as Yosemite, Yellowstone, etc., that is “developed” is less that 10%. The remaining 90% is as natural as anyone could want it, and only accessible to hikers (no dogs, no hunting). Given that, I am in favor of increasing access and camping in the areas of the parks that are already developed, provided it can be done in a manner that preserves the experience for people who use the park.

“The experience” that the vast number of people who use the parks are looking for is not necessarily being alone with nature, but seeing the sights and camping with their families. What detracts from the experience, for me at least, is lack of traffic control, which has to do mainly with day users and not campers. I think there is a lot that could be done to reduce traffic without reducing campsites, but this goes beyond the issue raised by the original poster.
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