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Old 12-26-2007, 08:14 PM   #29
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hi fred

most (but not all) hitch makers/vendors are gonna suggest...

match the spring bar rating to the tongue weight.

using the 'really light' bars is an insider tip, that works for some.

i like the haha and wouldn't use anything else for towing, along with properly rated spring bars.

but there are LOTS of ways to skin the hitch issue, so check out the HITCH sub forum and read, read, read.

cheers
2air'


here are 2 e-i-zr threads that may add to your understanding of bar ratings...

and the risks of dealer installs...

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f232...use-28204.html

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f232...tly-33350.html
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Old 12-26-2007, 08:17 PM   #30
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One more opinion, backed up by Airstream.
I was reading my owners manual this weekend. (Imagine that) According to Airstream, adding a rack to the rear of the trailer will void your warranty.
Pretty good reason NOT to add a rack, to me.
Dave
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Old 12-26-2007, 11:27 PM   #31
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Hey goran,
I couldn't agree more. I really respect Andy's hitch comments vrs this yahoo at California Hitches answer. Even with my very limited knowledge it was obvious that he was wrong. (F350 vrs SUV suspension discussion with him)
I really appreciate everyones comments on these forums and will go to pick up my rig at least somewhat informed, as i still have 2 weeks ubtil then.
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Old 12-26-2007, 11:30 PM   #32
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I'm a little late - I should have congratulated you on your purchase!
Hope it's all you wish for.
BTW - Where did you purchase?
Dave
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Old 12-26-2007, 11:38 PM   #33
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Hey 2air,
thanks again for the usual insightful posts/links, you da man

Dave,
Ya thats a great point. Had the same worry with installing a catalytic heater (even though my pick up dealer said he could do it) - may void any furnace/line problems. I opted to use a portable one anyway, as i could then shift it from my trailer to camper - dual function, avoiding install in each rig.
Fred
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Old 12-26-2007, 11:40 PM   #34
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Thumbs up Hey flyfish,

I cary my bike inside the trailer with no problems.
Regards from Russell in cold and sunny Tucson Az.
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Old 12-26-2007, 11:53 PM   #35
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Dave,
thanks
I purchased it from Revolution RV, in Santee,CA. Anyone ever deal with them.??? I saved six grand over the best price from the Reno, Nevada dealer. Have to drive 10 hours to go pick it up (from truckee)but for that money saved thats OK ,can also visit/stay with my brother in law in Poway until hitch/everything complete

. When i was a kid my parents had an Airstream when they were retired. I guess it must have been around a 68-75 model. i remember it was a 28 footer ,and thats when they had a lifetime guarantee for exterior with original owner. (Boy have times changed, and it sounds like not for the best!) My dad had a international truck with a shell on it and his alum boat on top,they went to Mexico for 6months each winter. Funny some 40 years later i basically end up with the same rig.
Fred
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Old 12-28-2007, 08:56 AM   #36
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We are off to Cross Fla Greenway camping this weekend. Here are the bikes.

Tom
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Old 12-28-2007, 01:31 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyfishfred
Andy,
So I don't need to go slightly over the hitch weight- like the Reese 800 pound straight line dual cam (like greg suggested) ? its Ok for hitch to be under the rated tounge weight ?
Fred
NO, the hitch should not be under the rated tounge weight or less than the gross trailer weight. I think the rating for gross trailer weight (i.e. class III vs class IV) is mostly to do with the receiver mounting on the truck. There are some light duty hitches that don't use a solid draw bar and I wouldn't trust those. As far as the shank and the ball this will be set by the tongue of the trailer so no worries there. Don't skimp on the actual hitch. You can go heavier if you think you'll be pulling something else in the future. That said remember that there is already a significant safety margin built into the hitch rating so no sense in going overboard.

The rating for the hitch is a separate issure from the weight ditribution system. In my opinion and backed up by numerous people that "get away with it" is you don't need any weight distribution bars with the "monster truck". However, I don't know of anything that prevents sway as effectively as a weight distributiion type hitch. Hence the incorrect but widely used term "sway bars" Part of the reason for this is undoubtedly the fact that transfering some of the load to the front axle helps immensely with the vehicle handling characteristics of "passenger" type vehicles used to tow a trailer. But as it's been discussed numerous times on this forum. Heavy duty trucks are designed to ride/handle better when pulling/hauling a load. So, in your case "over rigging" will not only empty the cupboards but adversly effect the handling of your truck

One other advantage of going with the light duty bars is they're a whole lot easier to cinch up
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Old 12-28-2007, 02:04 PM   #38
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Carry bikes on the front of the TV

Fred,
This arrangement works for me.

http://jerryheald.fcpages.com/tellur..._yuk_bikes.jpg

Quote:
Originally Posted by flyfishfred
Have a new 2007 25" Safari SE Front Bedroom and would like to carry 2 bicycles on the rig.
My best idea is to place the bikes in some type of support on the rear flat bumper/ storage compartment. Was wondering if anyone has bikes mounted in this location and if so how ?
Thanks Fred
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Old 12-28-2007, 02:36 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bhayden
NO, the hitch should not be under the rated tounge weight or less than the gross trailer weight. I think the rating for gross trailer weight (i.e. class III vs class IV) is mostly to do with the receiver mounting on the truck. There are some light duty hitches that don't use a solid draw bar and I wouldn't trust those. As far as the shank and the ball this will be set by the tongue of the trailer so no worries there. Don't skimp on the actual hitch. You can go heavier if you think you'll be pulling something else in the future. That said remember that there is already a significant safety margin built into the hitch rating so no sense in going overboard.

The rating for the hitch is a separate issure from the weight ditribution system. In my opinion and backed up by numerous people that "get away with it" is you don't need any weight distribution bars with the "monster truck". However, I don't know of anything that prevents sway as effectively as a weight distributiion type hitch. Hence the incorrect but widely used term "sway bars" Part of the reason for this is undoubtedly the fact that transfering some of the load to the front axle helps immensely with the vehicle handling characteristics of "passenger" type vehicles used to tow a trailer. But as it's been discussed numerous times on this forum. Heavy duty trucks are designed to ride/handle better when pulling/hauling a load. So, in your case "over rigging" will not only empty the cupboards but adversly effect the handling of your truck

One other advantage of going with the light duty bars is they're a whole lot easier to cinch up
Hi bhayden,
I really made an error in the way i wrote that ?. What i ment to say was "don't i need to go slightly over the trailer tounge weight (720lb), for my weight distibution/sway control unit". Andy, from inland rv, suggests using like a Reese straight line 600lb unit with dual cams cauz of the stiffness of my TV rig, while Greg had suggested the 800lb unit (stay over tounge weight) . So that was the issue not the class rating of the Hitch/reciever per se.
At this point in time I'm really just trying to decide if i should go with the 600# or the 800# Reese straight line dual cam. Gonna talk to the AS dealer in Reno, some other hitch folks in Reno, and ultimately the dealer(in San Diego,Ca) when i go pick up my trailer in two weeks who will do the hitch installation work there.
fred
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Old 12-28-2007, 05:35 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyfishfred
...
My main purporse of the bicycle is basically to pull it off, then go check out a (isolated)campground before i pull the rig in and find out it will not fit in any spaces and i have to back out 1/2 mile or so as there was also no adequate turnaround. The bike really won't be used that often so outta sight, otta mind is best. ...
Full size bike will always be either in the way or exposed to the elements.
I've used my folder for what you describe, and I can have it out of the truck and on the road in about 60 seconds (half of which is just getting it out of the truck).
Folder.
Dahon 3 spd

I've a 5 speed version of this, and have ridden it up to 65 miles in a day, although 10-15 is more the norm. What I'm getting at is that it is enough bike for 99% of what we need a bike for. The hub gear and chainguard keep the ick off you and whatever else comes near it, it folds and unfolds in 30 seconds or so, and stores fairly compactly (I park mine under my desk at work). Here's a link to a guy who commutes to work on one (10-15 miles each way):
Kent Peterson blog spot on Folding Bikes West in Seattle

Also, here's a youtube vid of a Dahon getting folded & unfolded in 33 seconds: Folding Dahon Curve
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Old 12-30-2007, 10:43 PM   #41
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We don't need a Peter-Bilt to tow and Airstream.

We also don't need 1 ton trucks, dually's and the like.

To me anything over a 1/2 ton spring rate, is excessive tow vehicle stiffness.

The simply test, for any rig is hook it up to your trailer, with the load equalizing bars that you have.

Then get up on the A-frame, and try to bounce up and down.

There should be 2 to 3 inches of bounce.

If not, your over rigged. That over rigging can be the tow vehicle, the load equalizing hitch bars, or both.

I have seen some rigs that wouldn't bounce if you had a 400 pound person jump up and down.

Anything over a soft ride for an Airstream or Argosy trailer, will eventually "GOTCHA" and you will needlessly spend good money for repairs, that could have been 100 percent avoided.

RV service departments love customers who have excessive rigging. Keeps their service department very busy, correcting everything that was torn up.
It's also good for the dealers bank account.

How to avoid the problem, is easy.

Want to improve how a Suburban handles and how it reacts with your trailer??? Soften the springs. You will be amazed.

"Don't over rig." It's a waste of money and gives you and your Airstream, nothing but grief.

Guaranteed.

Andy

I love it, for once in my life I did something right. A ford f 150 and a folding bike. You guys know how to make a bad day good. I just find all these positings that everyone needs a 250 or 350 and diesel interesting. Andy you will laugh all the way to the bank, need any investors?
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Old 12-31-2007, 12:41 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyfishfred
Hi bhayden,
I really made an error in the way i wrote that ?. What i ment to say was "don't i need to go slightly over the trailer tounge weight (720lb), for my weight distibution/sway control unit".
Fred,
I just wanted to make clear the difference between the hitch rating and the distibution/sway control part of the set-up. Consider that with your size of truck there are lots of people that tow trailers as heavy or larger than yours without any sort of weight distribuition hitch. Personally that wouldn't be my choice but that's bias from years of towing with passenger oriented vehicals which is what the weight distribution hitches were designed for. Your truck is designed to carry a load. Heavy trucks handle noticebly better when loaded.

The point being, I think people are looking at this backwards when they try to match the load to the trailer. What you should be looking at, my unprofessional opinion, is what the tow vehicle needs. Look at it this way, the trailer is going along for the ride. As long as the tongue height is correct (that's a biggy) then it should "tag along" just fine.

The trailer however has some major effects on the tow vehicle. Most obvious is you load up the rear of the vehicle. OK, trucks are design to carry a load in the rear. The other effect which is less obvious is you unwieght the front axle. Think of the vehcile as a teeter toter with the rear wheels being the pivot. The more weight you add the more it "picks up" the front. Also, the farther back the hitch is (lever arm) from the rear axle the more pronounce the effect. Again, a truck with it's monster motor in front and almost nothing behind the cab is front heavy when empty. But then they didn't design a workhorse like that to drive around empty most of the time.

With a passenger vehicle the combination of overloading the rear and taking weight off the steering axle is a recipe for disaster. The car wants to wander all over the road and rides like a pogo stick. This is the type of situation that can set up "sway". Some of the sway control devices attempt to dampen this but the best solution is to prevent it in the first place. That's what the weight distribution system does by restoring the "wieght distribution" to the front and rear axles. This is critical with a passenger vehicle. It's much less so, and perhaps counter productive with a large truck.

The Reese system is nice in that it not only moves some of the weight off the rear but adds in the sway dampening. You don't need the weight distribution but you do need a certain amount of tension on the bars for the dampening system to work correctly. The ligher bars will allow more than enough redistribution of the weight. You NEVER want to move all the weight from the back to the front. With the lighter bars the integral sway control will function as designed. The ride of the trailer will be much better and this will actually make the trucks job easier. The stiffer the connection the more shock from the trailer the truck has to control. Last but not least hitching up with the lighter bars is a whole lot easier

-Bernie
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