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Old 01-04-2012, 08:50 AM   #43
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Around here they use Calcuim Cloride (liquid) in conjunction with old fashioned Sodium Cloride (solid). Now that you mention it, I have seen more dead pines downwind of the highways this last summer. We had a lot of snow and thus salt last winter. NONE this winter.......jinx......
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Old 01-04-2012, 10:24 AM   #44
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It's the bridges that scare me more!!!! ... Kinda puts pot holes in a hole different perspective, at least where I come from!!!! (Do Not Blink) while out and about!
I don't know who said it, but it got to the point: "We can send a man to the moon, but we still don't know how to transition a road to a bridge."
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Old 01-04-2012, 10:40 AM   #45
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I have never heard of mag chloride. That's a new one on me. I am going to check with CalTrans to see if we use any here.
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Old 01-04-2012, 11:32 AM   #46
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I THINK it's just a few of the Western mountain states that do. It's horrible for the environment, so I greatly doubt CA would use it, but a quick google should answer that.
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Old 01-04-2012, 01:02 PM   #47
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I THINK it's just a few of the Western mountain states that do. It's horrible for the environment, so I greatly doubt CA would use it, but a quick google should answer that.
I did a little research and it looks like they are using it here in some places. The materials were a bit confusing and I didn't have hours to read it all, but several chemical de-icers were mentioned as options to road salt and sand.

The gist of what I read is that salt is creating environmental hazards in the streams and wet lands. They tend to argue that the chemical de-icers like mag chlorine are less harmful to the environment. I'm not making any judgment about those claims - just reporting what I read. It gave me the willies.

If I get time this weekend I will read all the materials in detail.
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Old 01-04-2012, 01:05 PM   #48
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Mag chloride is loved by highway depts because it does a lot of work for them—fewer plows to buy and fewer drivers to pay. It does keep the roads clear down to about 20˚. So it probably saves money and lives in the short term. But as noted, it is destructive to roads, cars and the environment.

Since our county has so little money, they seemed to have stopped using it. The state has stopped plowing some rural roads at night and seems also to be using less mag chroride. Glad to see less mag chroride; I got through before it was used and will continue to do so.

Another example of shortsightedness is the quality of asphalt. About ten years ago, Colorado discussed using higher quality as Europeans do because they would not have to resurface roads as often. This saves money in the long run because there are fewer disruptions and less labor involved. I don't know if they actually did switch to better quality asphalt. Lately they have been fixing roads with chip seal—it's cheap, easy to do, and doesn't last long at all.

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Old 01-04-2012, 01:07 PM   #49
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it's cheap, easy to do, and doesn't last long at all.
Job security?
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Old 01-04-2012, 01:10 PM   #50
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They tend to argue that the chemical de-icers like mag chlorine are less harmful to the environment.
Yeah, and like Vinstream said above, it's eating the bridges alive. Suuuure, it's less harmful, people! Either wishful thinking or someone has a contract... *sigh*
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Old 01-04-2012, 02:30 PM   #51
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When all the trees die along the road, nothing will hold the embankment in place and then they have to build walls which the mag chloride will cause to crumble. This will take some time as the trees roots rot and then the walls deteriorate. They will all be retired and many of us will be gone, so why worry? And with a hotter climate, no more snow, so no more mag chloride. The future looks yummy.

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Old 01-04-2012, 08:58 PM   #52
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And hot.
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Old 01-10-2012, 11:56 AM   #53
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The roads in pa are very bad! i hate traveling them. ny is'nt much better. with all the gas wells going in the heavy trucks are ruining the roads. but, i guess the wells going in is boosting the economy but,ruining a smooth ride!
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