Looking at a 1989 Avion 34XB

[gilldawg79]

Hi,

I am looking at a 1989 Avion 34XB. It is a second owner, he bought it in 1994. It has been under a roof the whole time, except for trips, which hasn't been too many. The trailer is immaculate. There is no oxidation to speak of on the exterior or dents or dings for that matter. Aside from typical upholstery replacement and a general update of lights and what not it seems to be pretty nice......

Anybody have any input on this model? Looking for all I can get.

I have been a member on here before when I used to own a 1969 Overlander, so I am somewhat familiar with this style of trailer. I currently own a Jayco and have been looking to upgrade and lo and behold my neighbor down the street asks me if I would be interested in his Avion. Well, I am, but I don't want to get into too much, I'm plenty capable, but I want to camp, I don't want to remodel.....Seems Like everything I buy I have to redo....That being said, I know these are great trailers, but I don't know much about these basement models. I like the concept, but I don't think they were made too long or Avion's at all for that matter.

What would a fair price be? It's not an Airstream, so it should be a little less I would think.

Just looking for advice......





Jimmy

[idroba]

I had a 83, 34' tri axle Avion for a couple of years, but it was used as a cottage, not as a travel trailer. I only towed it 100 miles.

Nice unit, well made other than all the holes from the underbelly to the inside. It was mouse heaven until I finally found them all. Typical issue of too large a hole cut for a drain pipe, vent etc. and not sealed by the factory.

They are heavy in that they have a full frame, solid wood cabinets and no real attempts to make them lightweight. The insulation is foamed in place, and becomes part of the structure. The exterior metal is fully supported by the foam insulation. Mine was anodized, and thus could not be polished, but then I had no desire to do so anyway.

All interior cabinets, construction methods and bathroom parts were first rate. All appliances were RV, but the best available.

I had no leaks in mine. The solid foamed in place insulation made it hard for water to go anyplace even if it got inside I think.

Standard leaf spring running gear, and of course 6 wheels and tires to attend to. The person I sold it to was told to put new tires on it, but did not, and when one blew, he tore up the side of the wheel well very badly, which was sad to see. Real hard to repair one I would think, especially with the structural foam insulation. Of course Avion is no longer made, or made the way it was. The name may still be around, not sure.

Overall, a very well made unit, but heavy. Not worse than some of the big 5th wheel units I see today, but I am not sure I would like to go "camping" in it. Better base unit, nice park model in my opinion.

I have seen them show up in the NW for $3000 to $7000. For that money, you get quite a rig, if it is in good condition. I know nothing about the repair issues they may have.

[JimGolden]

I have an 87 34X and have towed it thousands of miles. I have been very happy with it.

Not to flame, but I feel they are built much better than Airstream. Their frame is superior in every way. Avion uses three 6" channels running the length of the coach, but they also have an 8" suspension frame that runs the length of the three axles plus a few feet off either side, so you have 14" of frame in the area of highest bending stress. You will never see sag or separation with an Avion.

It is true they are annodized. Avions were produced in the 1950's and 1989 was their last official model year, with some being sold in 1990. In the mid to late 70's, Fleetwood bought Avion (it was its own company prior to that) and they continued to have them built in the same plant in the same manner until 1989. At that point they quit making the silver Avions and slapped the name "Avion" onto large stick built fifth wheels (i.e. like Prowlers).

The basement models were only offered the last couple of years. There is nothing wrong with them, it's just that the company was on the decline when they brought them out and so they were some of the last models produced before Fleetwood pulled the plug on the aluminum trailers.

They were actually quite expensive: I have the sticker from mine and it cost over $33K in 1987.

As to weight, they are heavier than a similar year Airstream, but are lighter than the current Airstreams. They're not that heavy. For example, the gross weight on mine is 9600lbs and I know a later model 34' Airstream was quite a bit more than that.

The only downside I would see on your particular trailer are the rubber axles. I not like them; not Dexter, not Henschen, not Axis, not any of them. But, in 1988 Avion went to a similar type axle as Airstream used. They did it to cut costs. You would probably need to replace the axles because the old girl is 23 years old now and the rubber axles don't last forever. But you'd have the same issue on an Airstream.

My 87 uses what they called "Adjust-a-Ryde" suspension where they take a Dexter axle and cut it in half, then bolt it to a swing arm mount on the center of the trailer. Similar to Ford's "Twin I-Beam" front suspension. So what you get is six wheel fully independant suspension. There are six spring packs and six shock absorbers. It works wonderfully! I tow with 58psi in my Load Range D tires and I can set a plastic fork on the counter top and it's still there 500 miles later. I like this suspension better than the rubber axles because (A) it works great and (B) it doesn't wear out over time.

Google the Silver Avion Fellowship. Look up Dr. Donald Gradeless. There are silver avion forums as well. The guys on there get pretty hard core about them. Don says "...Airstream is built like a can, Avion is a Coach." Maybe a bit extreme, but they are built well.

They are an excellent rig. Very much like an Airstream but much more robust. The 34's tow like a dream too. I really love the triple axle. I towed mine 700 miles home, across the Great Smokey Mountains, with turns where I was almost looking at the back bumper, and then up the interstate at high speeds, just on the ball and it didn't sway at all. I now have a 1400lb capacity Equal-I-Zer and it locks her in tight as a drum.

I have no regrets about my Avion at all. Very happy with it! Yes, I wish I could mirror polish it. And, some guys have ground through the annodized layer and then polished them, but that is way too much work for me. Get some ParFe wax and rub her down and she'll shine right up beautifully.

About the price....if you looked on the Avion forums and found one in that condition, you'd be looking at more like $12-15K. I wouldn't dream of selling mine for less than $15K. But I have installed new everything in it. Like an Airstream, the shells last forever, but the appliances wear out over time.

Oh, look for ZipDee awnings too. They are much better than Carefree. I have five ZipDees on mine. You should too.

You will need a 3/4 ton vehicle for any trailer this size, but they pull great and don't listen to the baloney of "They don't turn" as that's not true. I heard all that mumbo jumbo before I bought mine and its hogwash. The triples tow better than any of them.

One last thought on edit....Cayo Mfg. built them originally and they are still in business. You can get many of the parts for them from Cayo to this day. They even work with Dexter to make new half shaft axles and stuff if you ever run over a Civic and bust an axle Most of the other stuff is RV standard so it's easy to get stuff for them.

Hope this helps,

[Doodle6]

Probably too late to be of any help, but I have an earlier 34 as well as an '89 basement model. The '89 is a fantastic trailer, extremely well built and with tons of under floor storage. In addition, it has two furnaces and two A/C units AND a full width bath in the center of the trailer which uses the hallway as bathroom floor space when the fore and aft doors are closed - creating a very, very roomy bathroom with a huge tub and shower. Plumbing is a weak spot. They used gray plastic with crimping bands at all joints. These tend to be troublesome and it's a time consuming process to replace all the joints and maybe some of the piping if you can't pull enough slack after taking out the gray plastic joints and substituting push-on fittings. Lots of compliments everywhere I go.

[M2HB]

Originally Posted by Doodle6

Probably too late to be of any help, but I have an earlier 34 as well as an '89 basement model. The '89 is a fantastic trailer, extremely well built and with tons of under floor storage. In addition, it has two furnaces and two A/C units AND a full width bath in the center of the trailer which uses the hallway as bathroom floor space when the fore and aft doors are closed - creating a very, very roomy bathroom with a huge tub and shower. Plumbing is a weak spot. They used gray plastic with crimping bands at all joints. These tend to be troublesome and it's a time consuming process to replace all the joints and maybe some of the piping if you can't pull enough slack after taking out the gray plastic joints and substituting push-on fittings. Lots of compliments everywhere I go.

That polybutylene piping was real junk. I still need to replace it in my 1988 34' Avion triple axle trailer.

[AirLindsey]

Hi there. Brand new on AirForums and looking for any tips and reviews on the late1980s Avions. My husband and I were looking to buy an Airstream when we came across the Avions. Like many others have said on here, we are sold on Avion's sturdy build and durability over AS. We're going this weekend to look at a 1989 Avion 34V with center twins. The camper looks great inside and out from pictures, but we've been reading about the many issues to look for so we are going in with caution. Can anyone explain the difference between the 34XB and 34V? I've tried doing a Google search for specs but am not overly mechanical-minded (my other half is, thankfully) so I'm still not sure I understand the different models available. Thanks in advance!

[JimGolden]

The floorplans are different. The 34V has the bathroom at the rear with the bedroom in the middle. The front gaucho (fold out couch) is along the street side and opens toward the curb side. Kitchen sink and stove are on the street side with dinette on the curb side.

34X has the bedroom in the rear. Bathroom is full width and in the center. They have a very large tub/shower. There's a door on both sides of the bathroom so you use the hallway as part of the bathroom. Nice and roomy. The stove and sink are on the curb side with the dinette on the street side. In the front, the gaucho runs across the front of the coach and opens out into a bed toward the back.

34XB means it's a "Basement" model. Same floorplan as a 34X, but with deeper storage compartments underneath. They raised the shell and put a bunch of large storage areas all around the perimeter, kind of like a Class A motorhome (the regular V and X have these two, but they are not as tall). They have lots of storage room. Downsides are (1) it makes the trailer taller, which may or may not be an issue, and (2) when Avion made the basement, they made the bottom skin overlap the upper. So eventually, the seal can go bad and you'll get water leaking down into the lower shell. They should have done it the other way around, like house siding, where the upper shell overlaps the lower.

1989 uses the rubber suspended axles, so those will most likely need to be replaced. I believe they switched mid year in 1988 to those. Before that, they used "Adjust-a-Ride" suspension where they had six stub axles attached to a center beam so it was like six individual swing arms and they ride superbly. Before that, they used the Mor-Ryde walking beam type setup which was even better. The rubber axles work fine, and are what Airstream uses and has used since the 60's. The only downside to them is the rubber gets hard after 15-20 years and takes a permanent set. You can't really replace the rubber rods inside the axle (at least not practically) so you have to replace the axles at 20 years or so. Three new axles will probably cost you $2500 or so. I'd get the heavy Dexter's with the large brakes, but have the rubber rods sized for your weight capacity (i.e. get a 5000lb axle but have the rubber rods inside spec'd for 3500lbs).

We really like the X layout. Nice big bathroom with a tub bigger than any I've seen in any other Rv. I'm sure there's a Prevost or something with a larger tub, but I haven't seen it yet. None of the Class A's I've looked at had one so roomy.

Hope this helps

[rostam]

Originally Posted by AirLindsey

Hi there. Brand new on AirForums and looking for any tips and reviews on the late1980s Avions. My husband and I were looking to buy an Airstream when we came across the Avions. Like many others have said on here, we are sold on Avion's sturdy build and durability over AS. We're going this weekend to look at a 1989 Avion 34V with center twins. The camper looks great inside and out from pictures, but we've been reading about the many issues to look for so we are going in with caution. Can anyone explain the difference between the 34XB and 34V? I've tried doing a Google search for specs but am not overly mechanical-minded (my other half is, thankfully) so I'm still not sure I understand the different models available. Thanks in advance!

The XB is the "Basement" model. They have large exterior storage compartments on the outside. They are also very heavy. From what I've read non-basement models are preferred as, apparently, basement models leak in the storage area. You can find lots of info on Dr Gradless' website:

http://my.execpc.com/~drg/avion.html

He is very helpful and responds to emails quickly.

I searched for an Argosy/Airstream/Avion trailer for 3 years and ended up with an Avion. I inspected 4 trailers for purchase, 2 Airstreams and 2 Avions. Avion's build quality is just incredible.

[PaulnGina]

Originally Posted by AirLindsey

Hi there. Brand new on AirForums and looking for any tips and reviews on the late1980s Avions. My husband and I were looking to buy an Airstream when we came across the Avions. Like many others have said on here, we are sold on Avion's sturdy build and durability over AS. We're going this weekend to look at a 1989 Avion 34V with center twins. The camper looks great inside and out from pictures, but we've been reading about the many issues to look for so we are going in with caution. Can anyone explain the difference between the 34XB and 34V? I've tried doing a Google search for specs but am not overly mechanical-minded (my other half is, thankfully) so I'm still not sure I understand the different models available. Thanks in advance!

Any of the Avion models that have a "B" in the model number indicate that they are "basement" models. Although all of the later-model Avions have hinged storage compartments along the lower edge of the trailer, the basement models were taller and provided almost a foot of extra storage area between the floor and the lower skin of the trailer. That also allowed Avion to put the hot water heater in that area as well as the furnace. All of the basement models are 34-footers. (body is 31 feet, tip-to-tail is 34 feet).

A "V" floorplan means that it has a large rear bathroom, twins or full bed ahead of that. With the full bed, you got the bed on the curb side and a dresser kind of storage area on the street side.

A "W" floor plan means rear bedroom (full bed with the head of the bed along the street side wall) or twin beds, smaller bathroom ahead of the bedroom on the street side, and LOTS of storage along the curb side that includes closets, drawers, and a couple of hinged doors for storage compartments at floor level.

An "X" floorplan means rear bedroom with either a queen bed (centered with the head of the bed against the rear wall) or twin beds, a mid split-bath setup with a tub on one side and the stool and sink on the other.

Try this link to a 1989 Avion brochure. It will show all of the floorplans and also the basement model details.

http://nebula.wsimg.com/3fe95250c148...&alloworigin=1

[PaulnGina]

Also, the basement models were very distinctive. Here is a picture of a 34VB:

[Alluminati]

You can view the various Avion years and models here:
http://www.viewrvs.com/travel-trailer/avion/avion.php

Basements were added to the lineup for the 34v and 34x for ‘89-90 only. Also in ‘89, Avion switched from anodized aluminum to what they called “Dura-Brite”, an electroplated(?) finish which does not get chalky like the earlier models.

Basement models obviously have increased lower level storage. But there is also more storage inside the coach. The wheel wells are below the floor, as are the furnaces (Two furnaces in basement models, all others have just one), water heater, and a variety of other things, which leaves more space for personal items inside. Also the water and waste tanks are larger. The frame is an inch thicker. The entrance steps are beefier, and have a supplemental hand rail. Propane tanks are laid down and tucked under the front too. All of these added features come at the cost of a heavier taller trailer. But I’ll confess I was smitten by its regal looks.

Just like you, we researched long and hard to find the perfect classic Airstream. But the research led us to Avion instead. There are so few basement trailers out there, we planned to buy a cheap white box to use until we could find the trailer we wanted. But miraculously a 34vb basically dropped in our laps! That was two weeks ago, so we’re still pinching ourselves for our good fortune.

[PaulnGina]

Alluminati.... I'm glad to hear that you found a fine trailer! Welcome to the Avion world!!

If I stumble upon a basement model that I just can't pass up, I'll add it to my back yard!

[xrvr]

The cargo capacity of my 30P is around 2500 pounds. Wonder what it is for a basement model? We don't need anywhere near all the storage room we have as it is. Basement model looks good, have a good time camping!

[Alluminati]

In round numbers, the 34vb is about 8K lbs empty, with a max 10K lbs weight. We have about 2K lbs for cargo. No advantage here.

Commonly a family of 4 will load about 1K lbs in their trailer. The basement models won't hold more weight, but it does make room for more stuff to be put away. Yesterday here on the forum I read someone saying they didn't like too much furniture in the front of their trailer because they liked to pile all their picnic gear in there. Grills, chairs, tables, rugs, etc. We have all that stuff too, but most of it goes below deck.

[AirLindsey]

Just wanted to thank you all for your advice and links to Avion info. We're on our way to look at the '89 34V, and after reading your responses we are wishing it was a 34X or a basement model...but keeping open minds. Like Alluminati said, it is REALLY hard to find a 34VB. I understand why people hold on to them. The downside for the 34V model for us is the twin beds. Our two dogs are used to taking over a queen bed. If we end up purchasing the 34V, I'm wondering if we can take out one of the twins and convert the other to a full bed. Of course, would lose the storage under the removed twin. Has anyone seen this done? Thanks again for your responses and warm welcomes

[PaulnGina]

Good morning, AirLindsey.
Good luck on your trip to check out that 1989 34V. Might that be the one listed in Ocala??? If so, that looks like a beautiful, well cared-for trailer.

As for converting the twin bed setup: With some basic framing, you can convert one bed to full-size. On the other side, you could reframe that side to make some sort of storage area, reusing the existing frame, possibly, then adding to it upward. Would end up looking like one of the optional floorplans for the 34V.

Have fun on your trip

Originally Posted by AirLindsey

Just wanted to thank you all for your advice and links to Avion info. We're on our way to look at the '89 34V, and after reading your responses we are wishing it was a 34X or a basement model...but keeping open minds. Like Alluminati said, it is REALLY hard to find a 34VB. I understand why people hold on to them. The downside for the 34V model for us is the twin beds. Our two dogs are used to taking over a queen bed. If we end up purchasing the 34V, I'm wondering if we can take out one of the twins and convert the other to a full bed. Of course, would lose the storage under the removed twin. Has anyone seen this done? Thanks again for your responses and warm welcomes

[PaulnGina]

AirLindsey, I just realized that the 1989 brochure that I provided a link for doesn't show the optional full-size bed. Here is a link to a 1983 brochure that shows the basic floorplan:

http://nebula.wsimg.com/702a23a969b3...&alloworigin=1

[RareStream]

BEAUTIFUL trailer!!!

[Alluminati]

We would rather have the 34XB, but the rear bath is awfully nice too. So we are seriously considering how to remodel the bedroom on our VB. The biggest obstacle will be the utilities under the beds. There are heat ducts and wiring under there now.

The simplest change would be to enlarge the curb side bed to full size, and move the bathroom door over where the bed won’t block it. Then you can install dresser drawers where the driver’s side twin was. Be aware that Avion did not use standard size mattresses.

But we don’t like climbing over each other getting in/out of bed. So we’re thinking of setting a full size bed crosswise with the head of the bed against the driver’s side wall, and a path to the bathroom around the foot of the bed. This will be tricky. We’ll have to remove all the cabinets on the curbside wall. The utilities under the bed will have to be relocated too. This may not work on the 34V model if the wheel well is under the bed. But on the VB, the wheel wells are under the floor, so we should be okay.

[AirLindsey]

Hey PaulnGina,

We put down a deposit and will take her home in a couple weeks when we get back from a trip!

Yes! It's the one in Ocala, and it has been well-cared for. All awnings and the rock guard intact and in working condition. As the ad mentions, there is a soft spot in the bathroom that will need to be repaired along with the belly pan work (which appears to be minimal). (Look at me acting like I know what I'm talking about). I'm going to try to post a picture.

Originally Posted by PaulnGina

Good morning, AirLindsey.
Good luck on your trip to check out that 1989 34V. Might that be the one listed in Ocala??? If so, that looks like a beautiful, well cared-for trailer.

As for converting the twin bed setup: With some basic framing, you can convert one bed to full-size. On the other side, you could reframe that side to make some sort of storage area, reusing the existing frame, possibly, then adding to it upward. Would end up looking like one of the optional floorplans for the 34V.

Have fun on your trip