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Old 10-18-2017, 10:05 AM   #261
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Originally Posted by johnandkris View Post
I talked with Airestream regarding the loud noise with the Fridge Fix. They have put a small thin rubber pad between the fan and the mounting point and that seems to have solved the sound problem.



We are in the process of getting a BC20187 that was used once and the owner moved up to a larger AS. We have discovered that our Unit has the axle recall and the Fridge Fix with 2nd battery so we contacted our dealer in re the rubber pad so we will see how this works out.

John


I hope it works. The rubber can help with vibration and sound transfer, however, it’s the ball bearing system used that accounts for most of the dBA.

I would insist that they use a quieter fan. The stock fans are rated at something like 2-3 times the quieter fans that are 15 dBa or so to move the same amount of air.

The Airstream stock fans are $2-$4, whereas the quieter fans are $15-20.

There is a HUGE difference in noise between the quiet fans and the AS stock fan.
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Old 10-19-2017, 07:30 AM   #262
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Way to go Airstream!

Continuing to cheap out on fixing your extermely poor design testing and shifting the QC burden to the customers.

But that poor thought process is not only applying to the Basecamp model, is it?
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Old 10-28-2017, 04:22 AM   #263
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Originally Posted by RocIngersol View Post

. . .
. . .
In about a week or so I will perform another “test” with a cold food load according the procedure I above described.

. . .
Wondering if you could update us on your fridge's performance, especially in hot and sunny weather?

Would appreciate any new empirical data on fan noise, battery performance while boondocking, fridge interior temps, exterior temps, and so forth.

Thanks,

Peter
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Old 10-28-2017, 04:30 AM   #264
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Originally Posted by Bborzell View Post
While it's not easy to keep up on variations in operating conditions that are associated with any particular Basecamp fridge inability to cool to food safe (40 degrees or less) temps, my experience and that of everyone else who has reported in detail as been that the fridge cashes it in at about 80 degrees outside temperature.
. . .

Do you have any new data to report, similar to the items mentioned in the last post?

Thanks for your contributions to this and the other threads! Have a good weekend.

Peter
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Old 10-28-2017, 09:02 AM   #265
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Refrigerator Performance on Propane

Hello All,

I will be posting on Monday or Tuesday of next week refrigerator performance from shore to propane power parked and also refrigerator performance while on propane after a couple of hours traveling in sunny Tucson. That data will include: Ambient temps inside and outside the unit, db levels inside and outside the unit while the refrigerator fan is on/off, the amount of container water "load" used in the evaluation (last provided data was for an empty refrigerator - not realistic). I have the solar option and two AGM batteries - Based on previous posts, I will not be measuring battery voltage - I will provide solar panel read out and will not be measuring pressure loads behind the propane cover. For db ratings I am using Decibil X application on Iphone to measure noise levels. I am really surprised that know one else has elaborated on the subject due to the amount of posts and also I would expect the latest TSB repair has been performed on other units as well. Anyways, I need to restate this again, the refrigerator has no temperature controls and is a very cheap unit; and also I am only sharing my results. Ultimately, the real test will be field testing (vacation!). Just a note: Tucson temperatures are now 85-92 degF Highs and 57-62 degF lows.

Cheers...RocIngersol
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Old 10-28-2017, 09:07 AM   #266
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RocIngersol View Post
Hello All,

I will be posting on Monday or Tuesday of next week refrigerator performance from shore to propane power parked and also refrigerator performance while on propane after a couple of hours traveling in sunny Tucson. That data will include: Ambient temps inside and outside the unit, db levels inside and outside the unit while the refrigerator fan is on/off, the amount of container water "load" used in the evaluation (last provided data was for an empty refrigerator - not realistic). I have the solar option and two AGM batteries - Based on previous posts, I will not be measuring battery voltage - I will provide solar panel read out and will not be measuring pressure loads behind the propane cover. For db ratings I am using Decibil X application on Iphone to measure noise levels. I am really surprised that know one else has elaborated on the subject due to the amount of posts and also I would expect the latest TSB repair has been performed on other units as well. Anyways, I need to restate this again, the refrigerator has no temperature controls and is a very cheap unit; and also I am only sharing my results. Ultimately, the real test will be field testing (vacation!). Just a note: Tucson temperatures are now 85-92 degF Highs and 57-62 degF lows.

Cheers...RocIngersol


Aww man, a teaser!! Any exec summary info, like it worked and was noise, lol.

Anxiously waiting......
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Old 10-28-2017, 09:09 AM   #267
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Thanks Roc, looking forward to your report.

Have a good weekend.

Peter
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Old 10-29-2017, 08:23 AM   #268
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RocIngersol View Post
Hello All,

I will be posting on Monday or Tuesday of next week refrigerator performance from shore to propane power parked and also refrigerator performance while on propane after a couple of hours traveling in sunny Tucson. That data will include: Ambient temps inside and outside the unit, db levels inside and outside the unit while the refrigerator fan is on/off, the amount of container water "load" used in the evaluation (last provided data was for an empty refrigerator - not realistic). I have the solar option and two AGM batteries - Based on previous posts, I will not be measuring battery voltage - I will provide solar panel read out and will not be measuring pressure loads behind the propane cover. For db ratings I am using Decibil X application on Iphone to measure noise levels. I am really surprised that know one else has elaborated on the subject due to the amount of posts and also I would expect the latest TSB repair has been performed on other units as well. Anyways, I need to restate this again, the refrigerator has no temperature controls and is a very cheap unit; and also I am only sharing my results. Ultimately, the real test will be field testing (vacation!). Just a note: Tucson temperatures are now 85-92 degF Highs and 57-62 degF lows.

Cheers...RocIngersol
I too look forward to your reports. I haven't had the service bulletin done on my fridge, as I'm just not convinced it's the answer. I'm waiting for others to report before I decide to get it done, get a different fridge or just pull mine out and put an ice chest there. Thank your for your report and upcoming results. Gail
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Old 10-31-2017, 10:05 PM   #269
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Refrigerator Performance

Hello Basecampers,

Its RocIngersol, I will be 2-3 days late posting my temperature and noise level test data - work and normal life is taking priority.


Regards,

Roc
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Old 11-01-2017, 05:17 PM   #270
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Refrigerator Performance

Hello Basecampers,
Below provided is additional refrigerator temperature data (this after TSB 172 was performed) I collected for a “test” on the weekend.
Please read prior posts (from me, Roc Ingersol) for other background information.
As always, my caveat, I’m just sharing this information with you.
So I collected some data, tried to put into spread sheet/etc. but information becomes confusing, the below could be considered confusing too, so anyways, I decided on the below format, this is going to be long winded, so here we go……..RocIngersol….Cheers!
First the Summary:
· Refrigerator @ 25 degF & Freezer @ 11degF., empty, on shore power after 19.5 hours. So if food was in refrigerator it would been frozen and destroyed – so this is an issue – no temperature control feature on refrigerator.
· Refrigerator temperature decrease of only 2 degF. to 38 degF., with 3.7 gallon water container load initially at 40 degF., on propane & solar, after ten hours which included two hours drive time. This is marginal to unsafe temperature which will spoil food.
· I/S noise levels increased (from 44db to 49db): +9db with fan unit coming on. However, from our perspective, the sound is not an issue and not bothersome – best described as quiet electrical hum – we sleep with noise machine or fan anyways.
· No change measured in O/S noise levels (54db) with fan on or off. This I think can be attributed to the ambient noise ‘pollution’ levels (road noise, birds, home HVAC units, canyon echo, etc.) in our environment.There is a significant tone difference outside the Basecamp with the fan on which does draw attention to the sound.
My Conclusions:
· IMO Airstream could have adopted a smaller Basecamp refrigerator with temperature control, having thicker sidewalls for insulation value increase, and to provide more internal volume for air flow venting.On a $40,000 trailer there is an expectation that appliances will work correctly and safely.Honestly, if someone asked my opinion whether to buy a basecamp, with the refrigeration issue at hand, I would probably not recommend it unless that person, like myself, is handy and make things work by doing extraordinary things.
· I have had the Basecamp for about 9 weeks getting it prepped for boon docking trips, but since the refrigerator has such poor performance (after TSB 172) I will bringing along our multiple Yeti Coolers for our trips – having destroyed food (either frozen or spoiled) is not acceptable.
· The freezer section seems to keep frozen temperatures so that is a good thing – at least we can have ice.I am also going experiment and drill a ¾” hole in the freezer door (it will have a removable rubber expandable plug) to remove prior to towing so that cold air can seep into refrigerator section while under tow.I will share my experience with this to the forum after our first boon docking trip.
· Long term – I will look for a smaller refrigerator/freezer unit with temperature control and replace the existing unit with the intention of wiring it into the existing TSB 172 wiring infrastructure which includes the fan unit.
Detail for those interested:
Day 1:
· Basecamp stored outside under roof so it doesn’t get any sun exposure.
· Basecamp is in desert neighborhood at 3000 feet elevation against the Santa Catalina Mountains north of Tucson.
· Pulled unit into full sun with front windows facing due south.
· Outside (O/S) and Basecamp Inside (I/S) temperature at this time (9am) was 63 degF.
· Refrigerator temperature initially at 65 degF.
· Let unit hot soak for 2 hours with refrigerator off, then…….
· Plugged into shore power @ 11am.
· Turned on refrigerator (empty) to operate under shore power.
· O/S noise level was measured at 54db average five (5) feet away from Basecamp on right side even with the propane tanks. The refrigerator vent fan had yet to automatically turn on.
· I/S noise level was measured at 44db average at rear of unit (our sleeping position), again refrigerator vent fan had yet to automatically turn on.
· Noise levels measured using Decibel X (iphone cell phone application).
· When O/S temperature rose to 67 degF refrigerator vent fan turned on.
· At 1pm, O/S & Basecamp I/S temperature at 90 degF. respectively; and O/S & I/S noise levels measured 54db average & 49db average respectively.
o IMO noise level take-away:
§ I/S noise levels increase: +9db with fan unit coming on. However, from our perspective, the sound is not an issue and not bothersome – best described as quiet electrical hum – we sleep with noise machine or fan anyways.
§ No change measured in O/S noise levels with fan on or off. This I think can be attributed to the ambient noise ‘pollution’ levels (road noise, birds, home HVAC units, canyon echo, etc.) in our environment.There is a significant tone difference with the fan on which does draw attention to the sound.
Day 2:
· About 6:30am into the next day, checked refrigerator temperatures: Refrigerator @ 25 degF & Freezer @ 11degF. Under shore power. These are very similar results noted in my prior forum post.(Note: So if food was in refrigerator it would be frozen and destroyed – so this is an issue – no temperature control feature for refrigerator).O/S & Basecamp I/S temperatures were 56 & 59 degF. respectively when I checked the temperature.
· Then I took 3.7 gallons of water in containers that was in our house refrigerator the previous night and placed it into the Basecamp refrigerator.The water was at 40 degF.
o 3.7 gallons is a lot of water and there was still plenty of room left (IMO Airstream could have adopted a smaller Basecamp refrigerator with temperature control with thicker sidewalls for insulation value increase, and provide more internal volume for air flow venting), anyways,
· It took me 1 minute 5 seconds to load the water and rock solid ice into the refrigerator.Then unplugged shore power.The refrigerator temperature rose to at least 40 degF. during this time.Unplugged shore power.Switched to propane and solar.Unit left to hot soak in direct sunlight.
· Then about 2:30pm (about eight hours later in the day) I drove the basecamp for two hours and then checked the refrigerator temperature.I forgot to check the refrigerator temperature prior to driving – my mistake – maybe I will do it for a later trial when I have time).Anyways,
· The refrigerator temperature measured 38 degF. (Extremely marginal performance IMO). So, after ten hours the refrigerator dropped down only 2 degF. from the 40 degF. water load put into the refrigerator.
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Old 11-01-2017, 05:34 PM   #271
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Thank you for taking the time to update us. When you have time to do a multi-day 24/7 test in extreme heat, that would be interesting too IMO, but the proper weather may not be available until next spring or summer.

In any event it would appear that, even after the latest Airstream “fix,” the BC fridge is still a thumbs down as a reliable 24/7 unit.

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Old 11-02-2017, 12:30 AM   #272
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Check this web site where we acquired our Vitrifrigo DP-2600iBD4 for the 2014 31' Classic and the DP150iBD4 for the 2015 23D International Serenity.

Here are some of the smaller units link:

http://www.suremarineservice.com/ref...mpressors.aspx
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Old 11-03-2017, 03:12 PM   #273
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Thanks very much for the info. I am scheduled for 11/20 for the fridge fix. We will see. If it continues to be a problem, I will chalk it up to getting a free second battery. I am not going to continue to go back and forth on this with AS. This will be the first and last fix attempt. If it does not work correctly, I'll just get the fridges recommended by switz or others and swap it in myself.
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Old 11-03-2017, 04:59 PM   #274
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Thanks very much for the info. I am scheduled for 11/20 for the fridge fix. We will see. If it continues to be a problem, I will chalk it up to getting a free second battery. I am not going to continue to go back and forth on this with AS. This will be the first and last fix attempt. If it does not work correctly, I'll just get the fridges recommended by switz or others and swap it in myself.
I'm going to wait and see how your fix works :-)
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Old 11-03-2017, 09:54 PM   #275
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Update on fridge issue - I asked the AS dealer here to fire up a fridge on a new 2018 BC with new fridge cabinet setup and I would come in to check out noise level. When I got there the 2018 floor unit was plugged in, fridge on and cold & no fans running. They said they tried a couple new outside units too and couldn't get the fans to kick on using shore power. They won't run off propane to test. They have done a few fridge fixes and said those fans are always on once they install them. FWIW they showed me the fans they use and did not seem unusually loud when they hooked to 12v battery.

So what gives??? Are the fans installed in new units on a thermostat and ones they install with the fix always on?? The dealer did not know the answer. So I'm still unsure about doing the fix yet.
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Old 11-04-2017, 05:46 AM   #276
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. . .
The dealer did not know the answer.
. . .


Is the dealer going to find out from AS and give you an answer?

Thanks
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Old 11-04-2017, 09:37 AM   #277
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Hi

Sounds like yet another rolling change to me.

Bob
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Old 11-04-2017, 09:42 AM   #278
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A full scale model released prematurely before adequate in-house testing IMO.

Profound thanks to the Beta test crew who paid full price for the fun.

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Old 11-04-2017, 10:16 AM   #279
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Is the dealer going to find out from AS and give you an answer?

Thanks


I can tell u that our fridge on propane now works like the North Pole - even the main box temp is below freezing now in our near freezing outdoor ambient temps here in Park City, UT. We wouldn't even be able to tell if a fridge fix worked at this point
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Old 11-06-2017, 02:36 PM   #280
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So, we had the refrigerator fix done on October 17. The dealer tested the system and said it worked. Got home (a 250 mile trip) and tested the refrigerator the next day. It did NOT work on propane, but would work (i.e. cool down) on shore power. The fans NEVER came on (either when using propane or shore power) but the ambient temps here in NH are now in the 50s.

We took the top grill off an put a temperature probe to various locations when the refrigerator was on shore power, and then on propane. It looked like the propane was shutting off on a high temp safety setting before the fans had a chance to come on. Got very hot at the top of the unit, especially by the heating tube gas outlet area, over 400 F. So we wired the fans to be always on, and sure enough, the refrigerator finally cool down when on propane.

IMO, either the temperature switch which controls the fans has the wrong set point, or the temperature switch is at the wrong location. No confidence the unit will work on shore power if ambient temperatures are higher, not sure the fans would ever come on.
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