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Old 07-30-2019, 12:01 AM   #21
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i use mapping software no my laptop to plan my trips.than it's out with my paper maps. all sorts. [ keep a real compass in my truck, trailer. and backpack. a nice military lenstatic in the truck that comes uot when i leave the truck. i taught some young boys how to read a map and use a compass. it was trying because they were to tied to hi-tech stuff. i like tech, but my maps and compass do not require batteries. happy trails! kurt
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Old 07-30-2019, 04:52 AM   #22
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How do I get to?...stay on this road, turn left at the last signal.

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Old 07-30-2019, 06:07 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Mollysdad View Post
Okay, GPS experts, please explain.
If I go from A to B, we assume the GPS calculates the best/shortest route. So why does it take me a different way when I return B to A? Not even close!

Also, we did an experiment once. I had a Garmin, the rental car had a Magellan, someone printed Mapquest, and another person used his phone's GPS.
None of the instructions matched perfectly. They all got us there, but the route varied a LOT!
I know my Garmin didn't like left turns into the destination, so it always ran you in circles so you could turn right! Even when you could see the destination!

My biggest GPS pet peeve? Telling me to turn around! Example: SFO to Oakland. I like to go over the 92 bridge rather than go through San Francisco. The GPS insisted I make a U-Turn so many times I was across the bay and it still insisted I make a U-turn, drive back over the bridge, up through San Francisco, and then down the 80 to Oakland! No. Stop!
I guess it's my fault for keeping it on when I knew the way.

I'll probably regret this but next trip I'm using two GPS's. (GPI?)
MY RV 770 Garmin doesn't have traffic or a "Detour" function.
My Garmin 1490 has a small screen, but does traffic and detour.
What could possibly go wrong? "Keep left", "Keep right".
Hi

If you look into the code involved in programmatically getting out of a maze, one of the classic approached is "always turn left". If you hit a dead end, you cross off that route, backtrack, and try again. I have a strong suspicion that this sort of thing is still deep in the heart of your GPS nav firmware.

Indeed if you look at a route through even a small city, there are an enormous number of possible ways to go. Run through a major city and it's mind boggling how many there could be. The CPU in your GPS just isn't up to the task of evaluating all of them. Back a long time ago, they would pre-code routes through areas like NYC because of that.

The combination of all this likely means that they have a "good enough" decision that stops the looking and gives you a route. It rarely will be the best route you could take. It may not be the same route you took the other way. It should be close enough to best that you keep using the device.

Bob
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Old 07-30-2019, 07:27 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by Ray Eklund View Post
From what I understand, if you use the Woman's Voice on the GPS... the directions are different.
Ha!
When I had rental cars, I'd get into the menu and change the language to Japanese when I returned the car.
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Old 07-31-2019, 09:19 PM   #25
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mapping app

There is a very cool app and website called (onXhunt or onXmaps). It has become my go to for all kinds of information. It is quite inexpensive 29 bucks for 1 state or 99 for 50 states, per year. The degree of detail and amount of information that it has is pretty amazing. Being a hunter and fisherman we boonycamp mostly and I love this app.

https://www.onxmaps.com/

I still have my paper maps and compass when we go but this adds a whole new layer of information at my finger tips. Just download the areas we plan to explore and we are good to go.

-Dennis
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Old 08-01-2019, 05:39 AM   #26
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I just read about an app on Airstream Addicts called FreeRoam, covers a lot but a focus on free camping sites. Downloaded, looks impressive, will give it a go next month.
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Old 08-02-2019, 07:01 AM   #27
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Hi

One of the things to consider with any "tech" is what happens when it breaks? That's not just a knock on GPS. Maps are fragile as well. Dogs get interested in a variety of "toys" . I have indeed had a map "eaten". A couple have been turned into soggy piles of mush over the years as well.

It's easy to look around at all your cell phones and tablets and say "I'm hip deep in nav info". Get out of cell range (yes that *does* happen ) and a whole bunch of that stuff stops functioning. In some cases the GPS part *might* still work, but the map info is gone. In other cases it's an "aided GPS" setup and no cell means no GPS. Put the device in "airplane mode" and see how well it does and what it remembers.

Why did this pop into mind? Well my laptop went into what looked like a death spiral two days back. I did it running again so false alarm. All the trip planning "stuff" is uniquely on that laptop ( = the entire set of routes and possible stops). Do as I say ...not as I do

Bob
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Old 08-02-2019, 09:58 AM   #28
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After 13 years of towing our Airstreams into and out of places many consider wilderness and not accessible by trailer... we never were lost. An Airstream is not an ATV. These roads are on basic Atlases, BLM and Forest Service maps.

If you cannot read a map, follow a compass out of a forest or follow directions written on paper, you have no business away from a RV Park. When you become stuck without cell phone service you had better have several shovels, a strong back and not necessarily a weak mind to get out of trouble.

This is an exercise among experience. The better you become, the easier GPS travel will become. Taking a two rut into the forest is the easiest way to find yourself blocking six ATV's coming out and you are... well, in the way. This is even common place today on Forest Service Roads. ATV's are common place and entire families have their own ATVs. Your trailer is within inches of handle bars of ATV's off in the culvert, patient while you slowly creep past.

GPS is great in our vehicles to navigate within a town or city.

GPS is hit and miss once you are out in the County or BLM. If you tend to get confused with too much information coming in... pull over, figure out where and why you are there. If there is no reason, sometimes just figure out how to turn around and follow your tracks back where you were coming from.

Maps differ considerably. The AAA State map is fine for getting from one town to another.

Then it gets complicated. The why, where and how map is a preference. If you never had a Forest Service map of an area you would like to visit... stop and buy one for that specific area.

Thalweg, on this Forum, IS a 'map guy'. He has access to maps on his electronic devices to make all of us look silly and lost. But even Thalweg cannot explain everything in a few paragraphs.

Lewis and Clark did not have a map... they created maps from experience and help from those who did know where they were going. This will be your experience.

Depending on a GPS or some other electronic gizmo is OK, until it quits working.

We can give directions to our home and some cannot find our home, even though we see them making the phone call. Do not ask these people for directions...
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Old 08-03-2019, 07:11 AM   #29
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Hi

If you read up on Lewis and Clark (and the others who made it through to the northwest) they got a *lot* of help from people who lived there (like for thousands of years) and already knew how to navigate the area. It was done it without maps, GPS, or cell phones. None the less they knew where they were and how to get where they wanted to go. If you think it was just "follow any trail you spot" ... do some reading on just how badly that worked out for various folks.

Bob
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Old 08-03-2019, 12:22 PM   #30
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Bob and I agree, again.

The Journals of the Expedition under the command of Capts. Lewis and Clark to the sources of the Missouri, thence across the Rocky Mountains and down the river Columbia to the Pacific Ocean, performed during the years 1804-5-6 by order of the Government of the United States by Meriwether Lewis.

Look up Meriwether Lewis as author. Journals of the Expedition... should get you some copies listed for sale.

I do not have a canoe or boat, but have the two volume set of the above title. If I wanted to retrace the trip... I would need more than a highway map.

There are 1,479 copies available of various printings from $1.32 to $8,400 for the 14 or 15 volume 1904/05 set. I use the lower end of the price range for traveling, but in leather by Easton Press.

Some of the best 'vacations' are those where you take a 18th century to 19th century book to read during the Winter months, plan a trip around it and... GO.

Do the Custer trip from Fort Riley, Kansas, Washita of Oklahoma to the Battle of the Little Big Horn in Montana...

I use many 19th Century maps from the Geological Survey of the United States Annual Reports, Professional Papers, Bulletins and Atlases. The western USA still has many of these roads, paved, graveled, dirt or two tracks for you to explore.

Follow the Union Pacific Railroad track from Nebraska to the west Coast. Some of the original work can be found in Wyoming, without the track as they pulled the track in the 1890's to straighten the route.

Oregon Trail from Westport, Missouri to as far west as you want. Part of the 2016 Wyoming Adventure followed some of this route!

Not many go this deep into our American and Indian history... but if you need an excuse to try something new... this could be it.

Visit the Big Badlands of western South Dakota, the Black Hills and down to Crawford, Fort Robinson, Nebraska, where Crazy Horse was actually murdered in 1877 and a short trip from the Fort to visit/climb Toadstool Park.

Why settle for the RV Park near a city, when you can be living Indian or Pioneer in your Aluminum Conestoga Wagon glamping and dining out of a Dinty Moore... or restaurant.

The Oregon Trail by Francis Parkman can get you in the mood.

The Custer Myth by Colonel W. A. Graham will 'raise your hair'.

Now I am bored. Been there done it syndrome. Now I have only UP and there is nothing on the Moon that interests me... yet.
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Old 08-04-2019, 07:48 AM   #31
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Hi

If you are out in "big sky" country, you can spend a *lot* of time with an astronomy book. Even more fun - get a book on navigation and start identifying the stars they use ....

For added fun, try noon sights and see how close you get to your real location. No fancy gear required (though indeed you can do better with fancy gear .... ).

There's a *lot* of ways to find your way around (and no, you aren't going to get to within 3 meters with a set of star sights ...).

Bob
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Old 08-04-2019, 04:00 PM   #32
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Treat your RV like a boat, or a plane

“The Prudent Mariner will not rely solely on any single aid to navigation” = words on the bottom of nautical maps: “ & basic rule of flying... "aviate, navigate, communicate"....note neither says anything about requiring a GPS to get anywhere
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Old 08-04-2019, 08:28 PM   #33
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Navigating with your GPS Boondocking

Learned Spherical Trigonometry with a surplus aviation sextant and my dad’s 1940 edition of Bowdich’s “Practical Navigator” when I was in high school.

With that and an accurate watch you can figure out where you are anywhere on the planet-in an hour or so of mathematics and careful measurements. No GPS required.

Yeah, I’m sticking with my GPS for everyday navigation, but it can put me close enough on a good paper map if all else fails. They still output accurate latitude and longitude numbers even if you are off the GPS internal maps.
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Old 08-05-2019, 06:31 AM   #34
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Hi

If you *really* need a deep dive on getting to the right place on a map:

http://www.afterthemap.info/index.html

Does a pretty good job of explaining the "why" of it all. For some odd reason, you can buy the book on Amazon or you can download it from that site via the "images" tab. The next time somebody wonders why their GPS altitude is "wrong" you can go on and on for hours explaining just how that came to be

Bob
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Old 08-05-2019, 08:19 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ray Eklund View Post
Thalweg, on this Forum, IS a 'map guy'. He has access to maps on his electronic devices to make all of us look silly and lost. But even Thalweg cannot explain everything in a few paragraphs.
I've been called a lot of things, but "map guy"....hmmmm

I've evolved into the use of an app on my phone: Avenza, when I'm oot and aboot. I work in seriously remote areas regularly, so I've loaded all of the BLM maps in the area onto my Avenza. I've also loaded all of the 1:24,000 USGS topo maps in the region. This essentially gives me hundreds of maps on my phone. The GPS portion will put a dot on the map at my location. The app will automatically roll between maps as you travel. I can pick my own route without directions. I do concede that phones break and batteries die, so I have a stash of real paper maps in my truck at all times.

Many of the maps are free through Avenza. Official forest maps have a fee, as do the BLM maps. Many of the vintage/antique maps that Ray mentioned are available on Avenza as well. They're pretty cool. Maps are fun.

Some government agencies have started providing specialized Avenza maps at certain places that can be downloaded through the use of a QR code.

I'm fortunate that I've got the ability to make my own maps through the use of Geographical Information Systems (GIS). Custom made maps are easy to load onto Avenza if you have that ability.
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Old 08-06-2019, 09:31 AM   #36
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Thalweg... always the show off.

I was having difficulty yesterday navigating through south Las Vegas. No matter what I did this 'modern device' resisted to cooperate. I had to revert to land marks and actually read street signs.

Later I discovered I had my Television Remote and not a cell phone with me.

Hey... S*&% happens.

Thanks Brent.
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Old 08-06-2019, 10:54 AM   #37
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Lost

Use GPS to get unlost!
The other GPS works better (Grandpa Position System) to not be lost.
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Old 08-07-2019, 08:01 AM   #38
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Hi

Having a setup that goes down due to a single point of failure is generally not considered a robust design. Cell coverage goes out and everything you depend on goes away - that's a single point of failure. 12V power goes out and everything goes away - another single point of failure. Those are pretty obvious.

Do you wear glasses? Do you need them to read? Do you have a spare set? (no I don't either ... )

Bob
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Old 08-07-2019, 08:17 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by uncle_bob View Post
Hi

Do you wear glasses? Do you need them to read? Do you have a spare set? (no I don't either ... )

Bob
*******
My wife sees me as young and handsome, without her glasses.

She is still... well, looking for them. She obviously misplaced them again and I have volunteered to help her find them.

Obviously, Bob... you need to do some serious consideration in reducing the number of glasses you own. Works for me.
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Old 08-07-2019, 08:49 AM   #40
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Remember when you could pull into a gas station and ask for directions?
Not anymore.
Most likely, the clerk won't know anyplace, even if it's a block away.

I once called a local high school for directions to a sporting event.
The person who answered the phone couldn't tell me where they were in relation to the highway. "I don't know north or south, I just know left or right." The school was a "magnet school"!
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