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Old 12-07-2015, 02:45 PM   #85
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I will get a comprehensive list together for Ray this very week, and email individually anyone for whom I do not have trailer lengths.

I think Ray also wanted number of dogs gathering, just for yuks, so will get that, too.

I don't believe I have them all, but wait for me to contact you....no need to post them.


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Old 12-07-2015, 03:03 PM   #86
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.... and Maggie, cannot leave out cats. They are someone's best friend as well.
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Old 12-07-2015, 03:18 PM   #87
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Haaaarummphhh!

Cats.

They don't run around outside, tho, interacting with and trying to out-Alpha each other. It's that nose count we need.

Might be good to know if there are cats, tho, if only so that those of us with dogs that hate cats can steer them clear.

We had quite the pack last summer, and they did very well...for the most part.

They took turns stealing each other's dog food, as I recall, and Lily kept vigil to insure I did not replace her with a younger and sweeter model....not a chance


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Old 12-07-2015, 03:24 PM   #88
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Vedauwoo Campground & Recreation Area

Traveling I-80, exit at MM329 to the north. Those rounded granite boulders are Vedauwoo. Great for climbing around and there is a First Come/First Serve forest service campground. Maybe a bit windy at times, and could be cool at 8,200 feet overnight... but the area is really unusual. The State website says there are 12 pull thrus (throughs, thrus... whatever) and 14 tent sites.

While attending the University of Wyoming in the 1970's, several of us would climb around and run a rope through some of the permanent rings drilled and set into the granite. You can safely climb these by rope, in that case.

One day I was exploring from the tops and noticed a "gun barrel" leaning against a small opening below. I imagined it to be a Henry or Winchester 1860's or 1870's model... but no, it was a fairly modern 30:06 bolt action. It had a round in the chamber and had been there for several years. I did not realize that this area even had deer hunting season...

I took it back to my apartment cleaned the pine needles out of the rifle bore, steel wooled the barrel and stock. Reblued the barrel and refinished the stock... and sold it.

One of the campsites we will visit has a log cabin in the forest, easily hiked to. Near where we will be camped I found two cartridges from a 45:70 rifle and flakes of obsidian at the campsite. Obsidian no doubt from the Yellowstone. Keep your eyes on the ground... and no telling what someone has dropped or left.
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Old 12-07-2015, 11:14 PM   #89
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Wyoming Territorial Prison, Laramie, Wyoming

The Wyoming Territorial Prison is the "proposed" meeting place to depart August 14th, 2016, departing at 9AM.

For those who arrive Saturday, August 13th the WTP is open from 8AM to 7PM, seven days a week and located at 975 Snowy Range Road, Laramie, WY 82070. Telephone number 307-745-3733. It can be found on Zillow with a great areal view of the large parking lot.

I most likely will go into Laramie and take the tour Saturday PM, costing $5 and just spend the night in the lot, as well. It is a rather large complex just off of I-80, exiting on Highway 230 and go East to the parking lot. The Prison will be on the North side of this road. It is also called Snowy Range Road... if you were going west... you would end up in the Snowy Range mountains in the distance.

If you cannot find it... ask anyone in Laramie where is the Prison. You can tell them you have friends staying there overnight. That will end the conversation. Get directions... first. The Laramie resident might run away from you.

If for any reason there is a gate and closed after hours, closing the Parking Area... we will all be aware by Saturday and everyone can get the word out for options and get your first lesson in... Camp Diving. (Actually a great idea for a Boondock Thread... Boondock Camp Diving.)

There is a Walmart on the East end of town. It is best found by going to the east exit off I-80 into Laramie and it is on the north side of this road: East Grand Ave.
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Old 12-08-2015, 12:08 AM   #90
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We have never gone more than about three to four days without having to dump gray. Clearly adjustments are required. Reduction in dish and pot/pan washing is tops on the list. When backpacking, we would use freeze-dried meals. These days the meals are pretty self-contained. Heat some water, pour it in the pouch, wait a while and eat. No dishes, no pots, no gray water. Fresh food could be prepared when in range of dump facilities for some variety, I suppose.

It sounded like the potential for dump sites was near the start. I presume there are places in Jackson, and maybe others.

What was done for meals in NM?

Looking forward to the adventure.

Al
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Old 12-08-2015, 10:48 AM   #91
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Hello Al. This is a big limitation for those not use to Off the Grid camping. Great question and others might want to reconsider this trip, if this does not fit into their camping expectations.

Grey Water:
We use paper plates, styrofoam/paper bowls and reusable plastic cups to drink from.

We wash cooking utensils by heating a metal coffee pot on the cook top, and pour it into a plastic wash pan that fits into our sink. The flat ware is sterilized and cooking utensils are cleaned, rinsed with minimal cold water. The wash pan is then taken out and tossed into a bush or thrown across an area away from the campsite. NO grey water at all.

Personal Hygiene:
We wash ourselves the same way, but outside... or inside if you prefer, with minimal water use. Mixing hot water off the cook top into cold water into the same plastic pan for washing dishes. A face towel and a drying towel. Washing hair is when we go back into town... or wear a ball cap or hat. No grey water at all.

Showers... where we will be going a shower is a luxury, as fresh water is for drinking and food additives. Showers are our luxury the afternoon before we move camp. The grey water can be bucketed and disposed away from the campsite. No grey water.

Walmart sells a small tent that goes next to the trailer that can be used for a shower. A 4'x4' floor work pad as a floor from Lowes gives it support and keeps you out of the mud.

Black Water:
We ALWAYS use the facility available, if any. Otherwise you have two options. Your restroom, or the "Hike and Shovel" when Off the Grid. We have a His and Her shovel, no conflicts of timing. The shovels are also used to dig the fire pit full of charcoal, road work when needed and about anything else you need some leverage.

Chances are you will not need to stop every other day for Black Water and when fueling. But at half tank... you had better start asking. Inquire at the gasoline station for a dump site. Do it the night before, as 9AM is a late start for many Off the Grid campers. I am more of a 6AM riser, as our two Blue Heelers are whining to get out and take a morning walk. We do not want to be looking for an available camp site in the dark... ever.

This is not a RV Park ten days. After the first two days, probably the first day... we all are in the mood and understand that you depend on what you have with you. Need a screw driver to tighten some cabinet screws? Better know where yours is or be borrowed.

Quemado, NM: Because of the scattered rain showers we did not camp Off the Grid, but found a New Mexico State Park in the direction we needed to be. There was water available, trash dumpster and a dry rest room at the site. If anyone on that trip considered this Off the Grid camping... they should be embarrassed. This camp site in nowhere lacked nothing but dry roads!
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Old 12-08-2015, 11:19 AM   #92
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2016 Wyoming... imagine you are tent camping.

Imagine yourself in a New York City apartment on one or two axles.

Imagine seeing nothing for fifty miles in any direction.

Imagine not having a clue if the guy taking you to some remote area has even been there.

Imagine after ten days you have transformed into a confident, dependable and experienced Off the Grid camper and can do this on your own, anywhere, anytime and cannot wait to go again.

That is what you are getting yourselves into. Some may want to reconsider this before you find it not to your liking. It is not for everyone, but those who make it ten days... it will be all for the better for it. Survivors.
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Old 12-08-2015, 11:22 AM   #93
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Neil and Nita have had to drop out, so Kathy and Brian are no longer on the wait list!

Confirmed at this time....15 and holding:

Ray and Nancy
Chris and Carla
Brent and Connie
Ed and Jan
Al and Missy
Jim and Paula
Jennifer
Gerard and Laura
Marshall
Dave and Lupe
Fred
David & Susan
Cris & Elaine
Kathy & Brian
Maggie and Lily


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Old 12-08-2015, 11:31 AM   #94
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Spray bottle for cleaning dishes, etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Al and Missy View Post
We have never gone more than about three to four days without having to dump gray. Clearly adjustments are required. Reduction in dish and pot/pan washing is tops on the list. Al
Hi Al:

When not using paper plates that later serve as camp fire kindling, I use a hand spray bottle of plain water and paper towels for washing and rinsing my plate, bowl and utensils. After wiping off the large food particles and putting that paper towel in the zipped gallon trash bag (more camp fire fodder or just trash), dribble a little dish detergent onto the items. Spray water on them and clean the surfaces by hand, using fingernails if necessary. A scrubber or paper towel is rarely required but nearby if needed. Continue spraying the item to rinse, then place in rack to dry. End by washing and rinsing your hands, now sparkingly clean.

You don't need a running stream of water to wash and rinse cookware, dishes or utensils.
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Old 12-08-2015, 11:42 AM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Al and Missy View Post
We have never gone more than about three to four days without having to dump gray. Clearly adjustments are required. Reduction in dish and pot/pan washing is tops on the list. When backpacking, we would use freeze-dried meals. These days the meals are pretty self-contained. Heat some water, pour it in the pouch, wait a while and eat. No dishes, no pots, no gray water. Fresh food could be prepared when in range of dump facilities for some variety, I suppose.

It sounded like the potential for dump sites was near the start. I presume there are places in Jackson, and maybe others.

What was done for meals in NM?

Looking forward to the adventure.

Al

I set out on the NM trip with a fair amount of food in my frig that was ready to eat....tuna salad, deviled eggs, yogurt, cheese, etc., and supplemented that with simple things that required little preparation.......kind of like an extended picnic. . You could go to freeze dried meals, but that probably isn't necessary.

Paper plates and those paper French fry boats you can purchase at Sam's or a restaurant supply place work well for both hot and cold food....and can then be burned in a campfire.

I did dishes once a day....forks, spoons, coffee cup, etc., and could have done less than that if necessary.

We ended up in a state forest park in NM that had pit toilets and water, because of the wet roads into the chosen spot, so most of us were grossly overstocked with fresh water in jugs and solar showers.

As for washing ....for me, a person who sweats and whose head soaks readily ....going days without adequate bathing and head washing was just not an option.

Doug and I had picked up a couple of 2 1/2 gallon solar showers for our Rocky Mountain dry camping trip a few years ago, and those are great for head scrubs and perhaps bathing outside. They also can be refilled from a clean mountain River. . Worked great for us.

I also tried dry shampoo in NM for the first time, which did the trick between shampoos for the dried-sweat-head.

I ordered online some collapsible water jugs, to carry extra drinking water for myself and Lily. Many of us had them, and filled them to take with us. These are inexpensive, and tuck away empty without taking up too much space.

A lot is personal need and preference, and where there is a will...there is always a way. Some are minimalists, others require a little more.

I will see you at Alumalina in a few months, and we can talk some then, if you like.


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Old 12-08-2015, 12:11 PM   #96
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Prepare for Dump Station Stops before leaving...

Great advice 47ReWind.

We will all be eating at Maggie's Diner at Double Cabin.

With the convenience of the Internet, I just looked up DuBois RV Park Camping and several turned up. Those who expect to need a RV Dump while traveling, might want to pre plan legs of the trip.

Laramie.
Rawlins. (Truck stop we will stop has a dump station for free.)
Lander.
DuBois. (I see three possibilities on Highway 26 near town)
Jackson.

Double Cabin has Forest Service water at the tent campsite pumps. Excellent water. Also dry rest rooms. I always leave some cash in a Forest Service envelope to cover their costs. There is water, restrooms and trash dumpster at the tent camp site.

Laramie & Cheyenne water is excellent if you want to top your fresh water off... do it there.

Rawlins truck stop when we top off our fuel... usually water at the pump station.

Maggie probably will not need a shower at Double Cabin. I see a cold river soaking will be more than enough when crossing Frontier Creek to actually SEE the Double Cabin.

I see no need to carry much water as ballast in your tow vehicle. You might be surprised how little fresh water you need when understanding that when Off the Grid, water is for drinking and for food preparation. The rest are luxury options.

Had we camped at the designated Off the Grid site at Quemado... having extra water could come in handy. When leaving, we would dump any unused water containers to reduce weight... or shower the afternoon before and bucket the grey water.

We wish Neil and Nita the best. They will expect some on this adventure to post photographs so they can be a part of this trip as much as they would have. This gave Kathy and Brian an opportunity and leaves the waiting list empty.

Thalweg will have his camera ready when Lily and Maggie are soaked from their first mountain creek crossing.. float trip.

I have emailed the Wyoming Territorial Prison about having up to 15 Airstreams parked overnight on the south side of their parking lot. A couple trailers would not be noticed... but... this would be a bit of a distraction to say the least.
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Old 12-08-2015, 12:40 PM   #97
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Maybe we will pull out the Dutch Ovens at DoubleCabin, and do a couple of loaves of bread.

Ray....I reserve the right to refuse to cross that River, or to force Lily to do so....just so ya know not to be counting toooooooo much on the hilarity you are anticipating.

I am on blood thinners, so if it looks too treacherous, and that I might go down on the rocks....I simply won't. There, I said it.

We'll see what it looks like when we get there....if it is hip deep, I will probably pass on the river crossing.


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Old 12-08-2015, 02:37 PM   #98
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Thanks everyone. About what I had figured. We have never come close to filling the black tank, only gray, even in almost a week on site. I have never understood why our trailers have the same capacity black and gray.

I think we will likely use our internal toilet and shower, with this plan dependent on some test runs between now and August. We are pretty good at Navy showers and I may change our shower head to improve the performance. We have a great one on our boat. I'm going to see if they are still manufactured. Properly managed use and timely bucket dumping should suffice I think. During our dry runs I'll keep a journal of use. Based on Maggie's experience I bought some 5 gal. folding water jugs. It will be interesting to start with an empty water tank, partially fill it with jugs, and see how long it lasts, and how much gray water is generated.

I'm not a fan of the shoulder-to-shoulder RV parks and state parks, but I'm too old for backpacking and sleeping on the ground. Looking for a happy medium.

Al
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