Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 03-21-2014, 07:48 AM   #1
4 Rivet Member
 
GaŽl's Avatar
 
1960 26' Overlander
In the North , FRANCE
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 273
Images: 8
Question Rivets, rivet gun and brazier gun ?

Hello,

Can you help to understand the system please ?

I would like make an order for rivet gun and rivets but on a seller website, he say that I need a brazier rivet ? Why ? Because the rivet gun accept 3 rivets size no ?



For a 60' Airstream, the originals rivets are in 1/8" ? I don't understand why I have to use a brazier...



It's the first time I would like to fit new rivets on an Airstream and I don't understand all possibilities...

Of course, I have to use this tool in order to fix the rivet

__________________

__________________
1960 Overlander
2002 Chevrolet Tahoe
GaŽl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2014, 08:27 AM   #2
Rivet Master
 
Belegedhel's Avatar
 
1973 21' Globetrotter
Houston , Texas
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 2,202
Vintage trailer supply has a good description of brazier head rivets at this address:

Solid Buck Rivets

So basically, if you want the new rivets you install to match the originals, you need the "brazier head" style. To install them, you will need a rivet gun, the "bucking bar," and a rivet set that is the proper size for the head of the rivet you are installing. As to the size of the rivets, when you drill out those 1/8" rivets, you will probably enlarge the hole. So the new rivet you install should be slightly larger (5/32)--these are what VTS is selling above.

Bonne chance! (good luck!)
__________________

__________________
Belegedhel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2014, 09:23 AM   #3
Site Team
 
, Minnesota
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 6,940
Images: 59
The original rivets were 1/8" Brazier head rivets. "Modified" Brazier head rivets have the same head size but with an oversized stem.
A 1/8" Brazier head rivet and a 5/32" Modified Brazier head rivet have the same head size, so you can clean up the original 1/8" rivet hole by redrilling to 5/32", and use Modified Brazier head rivets to maintain the same look as the original.

Alternatively, you can use Universal head rivets. These have the same head diameter and stem size as the Modified Brazier rivets, but the head is a little thicker. It is difficult to tell the difference between the Universal head and Brazier head rivets from more than a few feet distance.

The Brazier and Modified Brazier rivets have a thinner edge on the head, while the Universal rivet has a thicker edge.

To be completely accurate, you should use a Brazier set on your rivet gun if you are setting Brazier rivets. If using 5/32" Modified Brazier rivets, use a 1/8" Brazier rivet set. If you use a Universal rivet set it will not match the Brazier rivet head profile and the results will not be optimal.
__________________
markdoane is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2014, 09:30 AM   #4
4 Rivet Member
 
GaŽl's Avatar
 
1960 26' Overlander
In the North , FRANCE
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 273
Images: 8
Thank you very much,

Now, I understand why I have fix bigger rivets... because I'll drill and the foret unlarge the hole... I'm stupid, it's logic...

In the VTS website, I've seen differents references about 5/32",

They specify : 5/32"D 1/2"L or 5/32"D 1/4"L or 5/32"D 3/8"L

The length is different, isn't it ?
If it's the reason, how know the rivet length on my airstream ? because when I remove one for example, it isn't complete and I can't know what is the original length... ?

Thanks again,

Merci !
__________________
1960 Overlander
2002 Chevrolet Tahoe
GaŽl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2014, 09:31 AM   #5
Vintage Trailer Supply
Commercial Member
 
VintageRV's Avatar
 
1956 22' Caravanner
Vintage Kin Owner
Montpelier , Vermont
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 126
Rivet Instructions

Everything said prior is accurate. I do think there is a noticeable difference between universal heads and brazier heads, but I'm picky.

We're nearly finished with a more in depth how-to guide for bucking on Airstreams. It isn't ready for public consumption, but I would be willing to privately send you one and you could give us feedback on how confusing it is. Send me a private message with your email.
__________________
Steve Hingtgen
Vintage Trailer Supply
WBCCI #1573
VintageRV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2014, 09:45 AM   #6
4 Rivet Member
 
GaŽl's Avatar
 
1960 26' Overlander
In the North , FRANCE
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 273
Images: 8
Thank you too for the complement,

When you say universals rivets, there are these ? :



And when you say Brazier rivets, there are these :



The Rivet Set for 1/8" Brazier Head Rivets is to install new rivet ?

I have to install this part into the head of the rivet gun ? Isn't it ?

Thank you again...
__________________
1960 Overlander
2002 Chevrolet Tahoe
GaŽl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2014, 09:50 AM   #7
4 Rivet Member
 
GaŽl's Avatar
 
1960 26' Overlander
In the North , FRANCE
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 273
Images: 8
Thank you Steeve, I send you an email !

For all : wonderful for your help !
__________________
1960 Overlander
2002 Chevrolet Tahoe
GaŽl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2014, 11:09 AM   #8
Rivet Master
 
Belegedhel's Avatar
 
1973 21' Globetrotter
Houston , Texas
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 2,202
Gael,

In your pictures (which are from the interior), you are showing two different types of rivets. The upper picture shows what is commonly referred to as a "pop rivet," or "blind rivet." These are typically used to install interior panels where you only have access to one side of surface you are riveting. These are installed using an entirely different tool than the "bucked, or "solid" rivets that are in the lower picture. Bucked rivets are typically used to hold the exterior shell together (these are the "Brazier" head rivets discussed earlier).

If you are removing your interior, do not drill out any "bucked" rivets, only the "pop" rivets. The panels that are bucked together can be removed without taking out the bucked rivets.

If you are looking for a rivet gun to reinstall interior panels, then the tools that you show in your first post are NOT what you need. You need pop (or blind) rivet tools.

Good luck!
__________________
Belegedhel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2014, 12:11 PM   #9
4 Rivet Member
 
GaŽl's Avatar
 
1960 26' Overlander
In the North , FRANCE
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 273
Images: 8
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belegedhel View Post
Gael,

In your pictures (which are from the interior), you are showing two different types of rivets. The upper picture shows what is commonly referred to as a "pop rivet," or "blind rivet." These are typically used to install interior panels where you only have access to one side of surface you are riveting. These are installed using an entirely different tool than the "bucked, or "solid" rivets that are in the lower picture. Bucked rivets are typically used to hold the exterior shell together (these are the "Brazier" head rivets discussed earlier).
Yes it's for the interior but I have to separate the body from chassis and in exterior I have Solid rivets

Quote:
Originally Posted by Belegedhel View Post
If you are removing your interior, do not drill out any "bucked" rivets, only the "pop" rivets. The panels that are bucked together can be removed without taking out the bucked rivets.
Really ??? So good ! I'll look for what you tell me and I'll write if I arrived to remove all panels !

Thank you for your help !

PS : I have a stantard rivet tool at home
__________________
1960 Overlander
2002 Chevrolet Tahoe
GaŽl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2014, 07:02 PM   #10
4 Rivet Member
 
1964 22' Safari
1962 28' Ambassador
enosburg , Vermont
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 297
There are some exceptions on older airstreams. You may find bucked [solid] rivets used to connect interior panels together. They connect ONLY the panels, usually on the ceiling, they do not connect the panels to the body. There is no need to drill these rivets, as stated above take the connected panels out as one piece. However you will find bucked rivets connecting interior panels to the framework around the entry door and some hatches. These will need to be drilled out to remove the interior panels.. You can count on V T S for the right rivets and tools.
__________________
putback is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2014, 05:20 AM   #11
4 Rivet Member
 
GaŽl's Avatar
 
1960 26' Overlander
In the North , FRANCE
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 273
Images: 8
Thank you to everybody, I understand now how it is made

Soon, I'll remove all interior panels,

I've already 1/8 & 5/32 forets and Clecos (with tool) to fit panels but it's isn't for today... ! So I have to make an order for fit new solid rivets (rivet gun etc...)

For pop rivets, I have already at home all that I need

Thank you again for your advises ! I tell you when I remove all interior panels (with succes of course and I hope !)
__________________
1960 Overlander
2002 Chevrolet Tahoe
GaŽl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2014, 06:24 AM   #12
Rivet Master
 
mimiandrews's Avatar

 
1966 22' Safari
Weatherford , Texas
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,425
Riveting information from aircraft standards

The minimum length of a rivet is the total thickness of the metal to be joined plus 1 1/2 times the diameter of the rivet. The bucking bar mashes down that extra length to make the bucked head that secures the rivet.

Airstream solid rivets are aircraft technology, so the riveting standards for airplanes contain everything you might want to know and probably more. The US government's version can be found here:

http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance_Library/rgAdvisoryCircular.nsf/list/AC%2043.13-1B/$FILE/Chapter%2004.pdf

If this link doesn't work, look it up on Federal Aviation Administration under Advisory Circular 43.13B, chapter 4.
__________________
mimiandrews is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2014, 08:19 AM   #13
Moderator
 
HiHoAgRV's Avatar

 
1991 34' Excella
1963 26' Overlander
1961 26' Overlander
Central , Mississippi
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 5,326
Images: 29
Blog Entries: 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by GaŽl View Post

For pop rivets, I have already at home all that I need ...

GaŽl,
An additional item. Make sure that your pop rivets do NOT have steel shanks (the center shaft), they should be all aluminum.

Removing a pop rivet that has a steel shank is a horrible, messy job when you eventually have to re-drill one out.
__________________
Hi Ho Silver RV! Vernon, Sarah, Mac the Border Collie -
A honkin' long 34' named AlumaTherapy http://www.airforums.com/forums/f205...num-54749.html
and a 26' '63 Overlander, Dolly http://www.airforums.com/forums/f109...ome-71609.html
HiHoAgRV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2014, 01:23 PM   #14
4 Rivet Member
 
GaŽl's Avatar
 
1960 26' Overlander
In the North , FRANCE
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 273
Images: 8
HiHoAgRV : It seems there are in aluminium, but if they are in steel, what is the problem, it more difficult to remove, is it ?

mimiandrews : thank you for the length info, the direct link is good, and I keep the link and I'll read it, at least the chapter I need and as soon as I have more time, I'll try to read all.

Other question, perhaps silly for you... :

What is the best way to remove solid rivets ? I've read that it's possible to remove without drilling, but "by hunting it" (sorry I don't know the word in english...)

Thank you !
__________________

__________________
1960 Overlander
2002 Chevrolet Tahoe
GaŽl is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Building Airstream From Scratch - What would you do? bass-o-matic Exterior Restoration Forum 39 07-21-2015 11:20 AM
Structural riveting rippie Ribs, Skins & Rivets 21 01-30-2014 08:24 PM
Correcting Skin and Structural Damage Related to Leaks Steve Bryant Ribs, Skins & Rivets 16 05-22-2012 06:24 PM


Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:27 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.