Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 10-18-2014, 09:18 AM   #1
Rivet Master
 
1998 30' Excella 1000
Livingston , Texas
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 546
Ribs,Rivets and "Bonding Tape"

I do not know what year Airstream made the change, but my '98 has the reduced rivet frequency on the outside skin along the ribs (compared with more vintage units), with the substitution of a "bonding tape", that Airstream claims adds strength (as well as thermal isolation). In the last few years I've noticed that I can press on the outside skin along several ribs, and for some distance along the rib the skin moves in a short distance before contacting the rib. The skin is clearly is not "bonded" to the rib along its full length. The skin is bonded at all the rivets, no rivets are popped and the exterior skin is smooth and looks just like when it was new.

As I understand it, much of the shell strength in the semi-monocoque design should come from the outer skin being bonded to the ribs. If the "bonding tape" is releasing over time, should this be a major concern? Also, can anyone else tell me if they have noticed that this has occurred on their rigs?
__________________

__________________
Siegmann is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2014, 09:14 AM   #2
Rivet Master
 
1998 30' Excella 1000
Livingston , Texas
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 546
Just thought I'd try one more time. Has anyone else noticed this?
__________________

__________________
Siegmann is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2014, 09:50 AM   #3
Rivet Master
 
1981 31' Excella II
New Market , Alabama
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 5,648
I have also been concerned about the fewer rivets. Seems like it is based on cost savings and not the end result. More rivets is better and I can't imagine any tape staying stuck for long.

If you are not popping rivets or getting cracks in the skin, then you are not in danger of structural failure.

Perry
__________________
perryg114 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2014, 10:02 AM   #4
Rivet Master
 
1998 30' Excella 1000
Livingston , Texas
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 546
Yes, my skin is fine. Not even a wrinkle. Thanks for your comments.
__________________
Siegmann is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2014, 11:17 AM   #5
Rivet Master
 
1974 Argosy 20
2014 20' Flying Cloud
Kooskia , Idaho
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 4,591
High strength bonding tape will last and hold virtually forever. It is commonly used now to hold the mounting for solar panels on the roof of Airstreams and other RV's. This is not the stuff you buy at the hardware store. Don't worry about it.
__________________
idroba is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2014, 10:22 PM   #6
Rivet Master
 
1998 30' Excella 1000
Livingston , Texas
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 546
As I noted in my original post, if I press on the outer skin along a rib where there are rivets, the skin has no give, and is held tight to the rib. As I move down the rib, below the rivets, to an area with no rivets, when I push the skin moves in about 1/8" before contacting the rib behind it. The skin is clearly not bonded to the rib. Maybe it was that way when new. Is it possible that when they built it, they did not press the outer skin in to contact the bonding tape all along the rib? The lack of bonding is along several ribs scattered around the rig, but only for 1-2 vertical feet at each rib, and generally above the mid-height rub rail.
__________________
Siegmann is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2014, 11:45 PM   #7
INSANITY CENTRAL
 
doorgunner's Avatar
 
1986 32' Excella
2014 Interstate Ext. Coach
Citrus Heights , California
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,105
Images: 35
I was once in a hangar looking at a SR-71, it was leaking all over the place. It was explained to me that was a design necessity. At the 71 gained speed the friction would heat up the skin, it would expand and seal. Then hook up to the tanker, fly the mission and return to base.
You need to just tow a bit faster, it'll be fine.
__________________


www.popasmoke.com




Proud Appellation American





Vine View Heights is now closed.

YETI ( 65 Quart )

IGLOO (Ice Cube, 50 Quart )
doorgunner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2014, 08:02 AM   #8
cwf
Rivet Master
 
cwf's Avatar
 
1999 34' Excella
Currently Looking...
Hillsboro , Texas
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 5,934
Images: 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by doorgunner View Post
I was once in a hangar looking at a SR-71, it was leaking all over the place. It was explained to me that was a design necessity. At the 71 gained speed the friction would heat up the skin, it would expand and seal. Then hook up to the tanker, fly the mission and return to base.
You need to just tow a bit faster, it'll be fine.

hahahah!!! That's true about the SR-71.. it was a leaky mess when still.. maybe the fuel made it slide through the air easier.. hahaha...no... the skin did expand.. amazing aircraft.. imagine what they are doing now...

My 1999 Excella recently popped a few rivets at the bottom beltline. Between the C-channel and the skin was a very durable tape. The 'glue' was gone. No mo sticky.

I think it is possible that as long as the rivets are intact, you should be ok. If you notice any movement along the belittling, address immediately.
__________________
Peace and Blessings..
Channing
WBCCI# 30676
cwf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2014, 09:37 AM   #9
Rivet Master
 
Mixter's Avatar
 
1976 27' Overlander
Tampa , Florida
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 796
Quote:
Originally Posted by Siegmann View Post
As I noted in my original post, if I press on the outer skin along a rib where there are rivets, the skin has no give, and is held tight to the rib. As I move down the rib, below the rivets, to an area with no rivets, when I push the skin moves in about 1/8" before contacting the rib behind it. The skin is clearly not bonded to the rib. Maybe it was that way when new. Is it possible that when they built it, they did not press the outer skin in to contact the bonding tape all along the rib? The lack of bonding is along several ribs scattered around the rig, but only for 1-2 vertical feet at each rib, and generally above the mid-height rub rail.
Are you sure there is tape between? Seems to me that would add difficulty to the manufacturing process... that would mean they would have no flexibility to maneuver the rib once they squeeze it into place, as it would stick every time they touch the outer skin and have no ability to shift into the proper position. (they first prepare the shell skin, then come in after and install the ribs to stiffen up the shell- correct?)

I'm not overly impressed with the quality of manufacturing and workmanship so far..... as many of us are re-engineering even the vintage series. Honestly, I'm to the point where I'm feeling every change they made to (reducing the amount of rivets in this case) is simply a move to reduce costs and they justify because the amount of rivets used is "sufficient".

I can tell you that the bonding tape they used to stick my windows in, simply turned to dust with the heat over time. This leaves a significant gap with an inferior mechanical bond because the rivet cannot seat properly.... If they are using that bonding tape within the structure of the frame at the ribs, this is set up to be a failure point.

My bet would be that theres no tape behind that skin where you can push it in....
__________________
Mixter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2014, 09:45 AM   #10
Zil
3 Rivet Member
 
Vintage Kin Owner
Currently Looking...
egg harbor city , South Jersey
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 209
any possibility of using something like pop rivets to add some support?
__________________
Zil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2014, 09:48 AM   #11
Rivet Master
 
Mixter's Avatar
 
1976 27' Overlander
Tampa , Florida
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 796
I wouldn't. Firstly because they leak. Secondly because they are not strong. I think that would be counter productive.

I think cwf hit it- "if the rivets are intact" it should be ok. They just designed it with less rivets...
__________________
Mixter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2014, 10:06 AM   #12
Rivet Master
 
dkottum's Avatar
 
2012 25' Flying Cloud
Battle Lake , Minnesota
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 7,716
Maybe they used too many rivets on the older models. More holes, more leak possibility.

Are there any failures due to rivet frequency either way.
__________________
Doug and Cheryl
2012 FC RB, Michelin 16, ProPride 1400
2016 Ram 1500 Laramie Crew Cab 4X4 Ecodiesel 3.92 axles

The Truth is More Important Than the Facts
dkottum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2014, 10:43 AM   #13
Rivet Master
 
Mixter's Avatar
 
1976 27' Overlander
Tampa , Florida
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 796
Quote:
Originally Posted by dkottum View Post
Maybe they used too many rivets on the older models. More holes, more leak possibility.

Are there any failures due to rivet frequency either way.
Good point!
__________________
Mixter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2014, 10:20 PM   #14
cwf
Rivet Master
 
cwf's Avatar
 
1999 34' Excella
Currently Looking...
Hillsboro , Texas
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 5,934
Images: 2
I used pop rivets called 'Cherry Max' recommended by Top.. I barely had strength to set them!! they are some wicked PopRivets and I am confident they are equal to the stock. Time will 'tell' for sure.
__________________

__________________
Peace and Blessings..
Channing
WBCCI# 30676
cwf is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
RIVETS, Rivets, and rivets Over59 Ribs, Skins & Rivets 31 10-06-2015 01:53 PM
Insl-X Stix Waterborne Bonding Primer Roadrunner Upholstery, Blinds, Walls & Interior Finishes 1 07-03-2014 07:38 PM
Short Ribs and the best floor/frame repair? m.nolte Repairing/Replacing Floor &/or Frame 10 12-30-2012 04:45 PM
Eternabond bonding tape Gwen General Repair Forum 0 08-06-2003 06:00 PM


Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:37 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.