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01-27-2007, 05:56 PM
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#1
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Rivet Master
1966 26' Overlander
Woodstock
, Georgia
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 8,525
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Clean 12v ?
I recently bought an LCD DVD combo player for my truck , It works great.
I hooked it up in the Airstream, and itplayed with lots of lines running down the screen. It is 12v only, so it was plugged up accordingly in a 12v wall outlet.
Is this due to "impure" inconsistent 12v from the Univolt? And if so , other than buying a new charger/power supply...is there a filter or something that can be done to 'clean' up this power?
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01-27-2007, 06:31 PM
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#2
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Rivet Master
Airstream Dealer
Corona
, California
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,497
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ALANSD
I recently bought an LCD DVD combo player for my truck , It works great.
I hooked it up in the Airstream, and itplayed with lots of lines running down the screen. It is 12v only, so it was plugged up accordingly in a 12v wall outlet.
Is this due to "impure" inconsistent 12v from the Univolt? And if so , other than buying a new charger/power supply...is there a filter or something that can be done to 'clean' up this power?
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Filters are available.
Andy
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01-27-2007, 06:31 PM
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#3
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Rivet Master
1960 24' Tradewind
santa barbara
, California
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,352
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Hello AlansD ,I cant' answer your question ,but it seems I recall a similar
thread about this trouble ,i thought it was a DVD system also and it did
the same thing in the trailer .Im sure someone here will come to your aid soon .
Scott
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01-27-2007, 06:32 PM
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#4
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Rivet Master
1960 24' Tradewind
santa barbara
, California
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,352
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See, that was a fast reply from Andy!
Scott
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01-27-2007, 07:30 PM
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#5
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Rivet Master
Commercial Member
Vintage Kin Owner
Naples
, Florida
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 7,508
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ALANSD
I recently bought an LCD DVD combo player for my truck , It works great.
I hooked it up in the Airstream, and itplayed with lots of lines running down the screen. It is 12v only, so it was plugged up accordingly in a 12v wall outlet.
Is this due to "impure" inconsistent 12v from the Univolt? And if so , other than buying a new charger/power supply...is there a filter or something that can be done to 'clean' up this power?
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IIRC, the Univolt's output does not compare to the current crop of switch-mode electronic converters, making them incompatible with most of the sensitive electronic gozmos that we use now. The output of these are much cleaner than the old style Univolt. Plus, you'll get 3 stage 'smart' battery charging too!
I don't think you'll be happy with the 'filter' results, unless you use a battery in series with the Univolt to act as your 'filter'. These were necessary with all of the ferro-resonant style converters of the past (like the Univolt). You might PM Overlander 68 for his expert opinion on converters.
__________________
lewster
Solar Tech Energy Systems, Inc.
Victron Solar Components and Inverters, Zamp Solar Panels, LiFeBlue and Battle Born Lithium Batteries, Lifeline AGM Batteries
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01-28-2007, 07:34 AM
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#6
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Rivet Master
1966 26' Overlander
Woodstock
, Georgia
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 8,525
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since I am not using a battery right now, think that is causing the problem?
after I posted I found this online quote "
Generally you should not operate the converter without batteries connected because the batteries act as a filter of sorts and provides a more stable voltage to the electronic circuits of modern RV appliances. "
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01-28-2007, 09:24 AM
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#7
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More than one rivet loose
Currently Looking...
Los Alamos
, New Mexico
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,756
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Yes,
The battery will dampen the fluctuations of the Univolt. A Big capacitor from a electronics "junk" place could do the trick as well. However you have to be careful. They can store a large charge and really hurt you.
__________________
Michelle TAC MT-0
Sarah, Snowball
Looking for a 1962 Flying Cloud
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01-28-2007, 09:31 AM
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#8
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Rivet Master
1977 31' Sovereign
1963 26' Overlander
1989 34' Excella
Johnsburg
, Illinois
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,944
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Not having a battery in the system to soak up the spikes and variable voltages output by the old style battery chargers and converters is a definite problem. If you have a Fluke or other digital multimeter, put it in the AC mode and measure variability outputed by the univolt. Then connect in the battery and see how much better it is. You will be amazed. You need a battery anyway so that is cheaper than buying a new converter or a filter. If you want life to be even better go to Radio Shack and buy a filter as well. It will also likely lengthen the life of your set.
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01-28-2007, 09:56 AM
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#9
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Rivet Master
1966 26' Overlander
Woodstock
, Georgia
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 8,525
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thanks...I intended to put a battery inline to power the breakaway switch. I will check out the Radio Shack near me also.
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01-28-2007, 11:09 AM
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#10
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Rivet Master
Commercial Member
New Borockton
, Alabama
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,593
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ALANSD
since I am not using a battery right now, think that is causing the problem?
after I posted I found this online quote "
Generally you should not operate the converter without batteries connected because the batteries act as a filter of sorts and provides a more stable voltage to the electronic circuits of modern RV appliances. "
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100% yes Alan. Installing a battery will clean that DC power and you should not need a filter. The battery is the filter and does a nice job. There is one catch though because some fuse boards in the past were split where only a few of the circuits are wired to pass through the battery. Usually the lights, radio, antenna are always filtered but some accessories were not.
__________________
Randy...Converters, Inverters, Trimetric, Surge Protectors, Zamp, Smartplug, AGM Batts
888-828-1893
Bestconverter.com
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01-28-2007, 11:49 AM
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#11
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Patriotic
1973 23' Safari
North of Boston
, Massachusetts
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 4,546
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fwiw, I have the original looney-volt, AND a battery...my late model stereo and TV (9" ac/dc crt) don't seem to like it. TV randomly shuts off, pesumeably with dips in voltage. I've noticed that it can be triggered by big changes in what is being displayed on the screen...like a scene that is dim, and suddenly changes to a brightly lit one...~poof~.
Radio doesn't completely shut down, but sometimes stops outputting sound to the speakers...but the lights and display remain illuminated, so it isn't quite "off"...but this is triggered by turning on a light or some other device in the trailer.
__________________
Air:291
Wbcci: 3752
'73 Safari 23'
'00 Dodge Ram 1500 4x4 QC
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01-28-2007, 11:51 AM
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#12
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Streamline Imperial
Currently Looking...
Bellflower
, California
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 110
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A battery and/or capacitor is good for cleaning your 12 volt signal, but beware the harsh modified sine wave produced by most inverters, for your 120 volt gizmos! On a recent camping trip, I let all the smoke out of an electric blanket controller, and almost wrecked a portable DVD player which got so hot it shut down. I was using a Victor inverterer and deep cycle battery, both of adequate capacity.
"True sine" inverters are expensive! One thing I was going to try is a computer UPS (uninterruptible power supply.) The better ones will groom the AC signal as well as protect from dips and sudden outages. I would plug sensitive things into this, and run lights etc right out of the inverter. I'll report how well this works. Clamp lamps with compact fluorescent lamps are great for lighting up the campsite!
One other thought on 12 filtering... car stereos often have an inline filter in the power inputs. You might get one of those for a sensitive low-power device like the DVD player. A junkyard or stereo place where they discard lots of take-out units would be a good source for free or cheap filters like this.
__________________
It seems I love the mountains and deserts more than my friends do. I sure miss them!
1971 Streamline Imperial project "Silver Snausage", 1985 Coleman tent trailer, 1964 Little Dipper, 1975 Northwest "Proto Toyhauler", 2004 Harbor Freight folding, still seeking my Airstream.
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01-28-2007, 11:59 AM
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#13
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Streamline Imperial
Currently Looking...
Bellflower
, California
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 110
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Chuck, sounds like you have a LOW voltage issue, not dirty. How does that battery test out? Have you measured what the voltage is doing when the devices drop out?
If it turns out to be noise after all, filter capacitors will clean out what the battery cannot. The capacitors should be connected as close to the converter (noisy 12v source) as possible. A 1000 to 4700uf, 18-25 volt unit will do ya, mind the polarity.
__________________
It seems I love the mountains and deserts more than my friends do. I sure miss them!
1971 Streamline Imperial project "Silver Snausage", 1985 Coleman tent trailer, 1964 Little Dipper, 1975 Northwest "Proto Toyhauler", 2004 Harbor Freight folding, still seeking my Airstream.
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01-28-2007, 12:10 PM
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#14
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Rivet Master
Commercial Member
New Borockton
, Alabama
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,593
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Chuck,
You are indeed describing low voltage and if you have a battery connected, it too must be low too for those symptoms to occur. One easy way to tell is to connect a household battery charger to the battery. If it is capable of holding a charge and there are no bad cells, those problems should go away, even during charge.
__________________
Randy...Converters, Inverters, Trimetric, Surge Protectors, Zamp, Smartplug, AGM Batts
888-828-1893
Bestconverter.com
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01-28-2007, 12:11 PM
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#15
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Patriotic
1973 23' Safari
North of Boston
, Massachusetts
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 4,546
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilvrSausage
Chuck, sounds like you have a LOW voltage issue, not dirty. How does that battery test out? Have you measured what the voltage is doing when the devices drop out?
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could be...doesn't seem to last long, thats for sure. first battery I had, I made the mistake of leaving it plugged in too long, and probably cooked it. Brought it back and got a pro-rated replacement (sears...that could be yet another mistake...I don't know ), and this one has never been left to cook...I check the water regularly, etc, etc...
yet, I don't have to turn much on in the trailer to see the voltage at the battery terminals get surprisingly low. Looney-volt seems to be putting out around 13.5v when its plugged in.
from the way it acts, I wouldn't be surprised if a load test showed "junque". but why? even if the UV is putting out the correct voltage, could it still be "mis-treating" the battery in such a way as to cause an untimely demise?
__________________
Air:291
Wbcci: 3752
'73 Safari 23'
'00 Dodge Ram 1500 4x4 QC
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01-28-2007, 12:48 PM
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#16
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Patriotic
1973 23' Safari
North of Boston
, Massachusetts
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 4,546
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 68 Overlander
Chuck,
You are indeed describing low voltage and if you have a battery connected, it too must be low too for those symptoms to occur. One easy way to tell is to connect a household battery charger to the battery. If it is capable of holding a charge and there are no bad cells, those problems should go away, even during charge.
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didn't see this before my last post...
TV seems to work fine as long as we're on shore power; but I believe the radio has had the same behavior regardless. main point was that newer "stuff" is more sensitive.
__________________
Air:291
Wbcci: 3752
'73 Safari 23'
'00 Dodge Ram 1500 4x4 QC
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03-02-2007, 07:08 PM
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#17
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4 Rivet Member
1967 30' Sovereign
Leavenworth
, Kansas
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 382
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I am putting a new dsi/gas water heater in and am now worried that I may have problems with the old univolt messing up my circuit board. What do you think?
silver 67
__________________
Beth and/or David
67 Sovereign, double bed, rear bath-"Moby"
2005 Dodge Ram 2500 Hemi, Quad Cab-"Ahab"
"Vintage trailer, vintage owners"
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03-02-2007, 09:35 PM
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#18
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3 Rivet Member
1964 26' Overlander
Alameda
, California
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 161
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The RV500 heater I put in had very stern instructions not to connect it to an unfiltered 12V source, I think (would have to check the manual) that it was more than 1V AC on the line.
My converter without a battery puts out 5V AC on the 12V terminals...
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03-02-2007, 09:40 PM
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#19
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Naysayer
1968 24' Tradewind
Russellville
, earth
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 4,965
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I changed my stereo and it is causing considerable static. I am taking it as a sign to change the 40 year old univolt to a three stage charger....
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03-03-2007, 05:30 AM
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#20
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Rivet Master
Commercial Member
Vintage Kin Owner
Naples
, Florida
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 7,508
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gen Disarray
I changed my stereo and it is causing considerable static. I am taking it as a sign to change the 40 year old univolt to a three stage charger....
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I think that is a good move..............................................
__________________
lewster
Solar Tech Energy Systems, Inc.
Victron Solar Components and Inverters, Zamp Solar Panels, LiFeBlue and Battle Born Lithium Batteries, Lifeline AGM Batteries
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