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Old 11-01-2013, 11:01 AM   #29
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What about the single pole liftgate/trucker connectors vs the camlocks?

I'm fairly convinced to ditch the 4 gauge liftgate dual pole cable/connectors and instead to use the type W cable or DLO (diesel locomotive) or something similar between the bumper and the trailer. That type W stuff and variants seems awesome and flexible. DLO seems to be sold alongside it and if have to check the flexibility and sheathing info. I'm thinking about 1/0 for this last 5 or 6 feet, if not the whole run.

The single pole liftgate setup I believe offers premade cables with much higher ratings.

But the single pole solutions with two separate connectors is really starting to feel too cumbersome. In this regard, I sort of want to go with the sb175 anderson and just call it a day. The connector will get exercised regularly since I'm a full timer, but still, it is exposed, outdoor road level use and I agree they don't seem to be the perfect connector for that.
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Old 11-01-2013, 11:33 AM   #30
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Hmmm this site offers 6 foot 4/0 camlock jumpers for $65

https://www.atidistributors.com/elec...ock-pig-tails/

I would prefer crimps rather than set screw connections though.
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Old 11-01-2013, 03:47 PM   #31
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Type W with camlocks is typically in single conductor setups where a multi-conductor cable would be too heavy and unwieldy to deal with.

Pin and sleeve connectors are the multi-pole equivalent of camlocks. Also something to consider, and eliminates the chance of a traveling companion connecting them backwards.
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Old 11-01-2013, 05:58 PM   #32
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I humbly apologize by contributing to mission creep.

I'm looking to do the same thing, likely will clone what becomes of this process. I've been in a holding pattern on my project for a long time and have been collecting needy items. I glommed onto a 100' roll of 400įF rated 1/0 for $1/ft shipped, and have four 20' lengths of silicone 2000V 4/0 ultra-flex cable that set me back $1.50/ft delivered, have collected the related tools, circuit breakers and fuses and such that are merrily incubating in bins. Just need to finalize the details.

Speaking of, I once thought the trailer side could be hardwired and able to be retracted/coiled in a locked compartment or frame mounted box - to be a multiple-use input. I'm seriously interested in having a tap in for outdoor solar and/or a DC generator, either the Honda Eu3000 type or cell tower backup hutch-style (waiting in the garage actually).

Anyhow, those prefabbed cable/socket answer looks sexy as well... That 4/0 is certainly manly but I agree with the hex-screw clamp being undesirable, though the lug barrel could still be soldered, preheat & pre-solder both halves and join them... Heck, the threaded hex-screw barrels would make it easier to solder . I see the Cooper Posilock have a crimp & solder option.

To jump up a size in the Andersons connector, to the SB350, and have a drip guard covering/hiding each ends' junction area, with wires exiting downward to shed water away - the 'box' cover would have to breath to prevent trapping condensation but there could be some flexible shield to prevent live water entry from towing slipstream air buffeting between vehicles.

This may be one place you could opt to go a size smaller cable but keeping the largest connector (making them yourself) for just that short run where the cables hang in midair for the short distance - I hate to say it but finding the cables missing after coming out of a restaurant would be a little less painful then. The rain shield sure could have a padlock hanging on it too, as well as aircraft cable & spring cable support that would be tamper-resistant...
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Old 11-02-2013, 12:06 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jammer View Post
Type W with camlocks is typically in single conductor setups where a multi-conductor cable would be too heavy and unwieldy to deal with. Pin and sleeve connectors are the multi-pole equivalent of camlocks. Also something to consider, and eliminates the chance of a traveling companion connecting them backwards.
I like the idea of a single connector. I'm trying to find an appropriate pin and sleeve connector. So far, the amp ratings I'm seeing are only up to 200 and 400 amps - but I think that rating is at a much higher anticipated voltage? For example, one is listed as a "400 amp" connector but under brief specs it says Voltage 600VAC/250VDC, 50-400 Hz

So I'm guessing that it will handle more amps at 12 volts, correct?

Another thing is that I'm finding very few options for this or other connectors with just two pins. I'm going to ponder the possibility of moving to four pins and wire conductors, using two for positive and two for negative and then smaller gauge for the two then if it were a single connector for each. Could make doing this in a single cable more manageable.
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Old 11-02-2013, 10:56 AM   #34
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Like how about this type W rated for 600v and 152 amps at 2awg with 4 conductors? Would using two conductors be equivalent to 1/0 or 2/0? And is the 152 amps at 600v leaving me with more amps cushion at 12v? Not sure if it works like that but I know that in watts conversion the amps double when volts halve or something like that.

http://www.wireandcabletogo.com/Type-W-Cable/
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Old 11-02-2013, 10:58 AM   #35
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I hate to say it but finding the cables missing after coming out of a restaurant would be a little less painful then. The rain shield sure could have a padlock hanging on it too, as well as aircraft cable & spring cable support that would be tamper-resistant...
Ack! I hadn't contemplated wire thieves. Hmmm.
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Old 11-02-2013, 11:31 AM   #36
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Here's what 4 conductor 2awg looks with an arktite connector. This is from ebay. These things can be expensive! Also would need to fabricate a box for it to sit in on the truck and find a flap to protect the front when not in use.

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Old 11-02-2013, 03:04 PM   #37
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Maybe I'm backwards on my thinking that I could use more amps at a lower voltage on these connectors vs the ratings... Since in thinking about it, I know the recommended wire for my solar was a lot smaller at 48v than 12v. Hmmm. Also, they are showing you can use a higher horsepower motor with the connectors at higher voltage. If that's the case, these crouse hinds connectors may not be suitable, which seems like it would be surprising since they are so beefy. The connectors are only rated to 400 amps at the most on top (prohibitively expensive) units. The lower end is 40 to 100 amps.
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Old 11-02-2013, 03:23 PM   #38
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have you looed at connectors for snow plows? they might be beefy enough and weather resistant.

wasn't this issue tackled when they first started running power lines? (DC lost) the comment to go from dc generator > dc to ac converter > ac to dc converter, sure is starting to look easier.

a nice TT-30a outlet mounted on the bumper might also be a possibility and let you use more of what you already have in the trailer.
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Old 11-02-2013, 07:07 PM   #39
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Interesting idea but looks like they are too small. My search for snow plow connectors also came up with Anderson connectors which reminded me of that option. Thinking about it again is making me want to just go for that and be fine with it. Seems like it is coming down to either that or the ones for carnival rides unless someone can help me understand if these pin and sleeve have the capacity.

The nice thing about an anderson connector is that installation would be a breeze and it could be tucked out of the way on the truck side, behind the bumper, when not in use.

A bit of welding and torch cutting to my current ranch bumper would probably be needed to create a spot for the pin and sleeve receptacle. Those connectors are also really bulky on the umbilical side.
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Old 11-05-2013, 12:54 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CA_Tallguy View Post
I like the idea of a single connector. I'm trying to find an appropriate pin and sleeve connector. So far, the amp ratings I'm seeing are only up to 200 and 400 amps - but I think that rating is at a much higher anticipated voltage? For example, one is listed as a "400 amp" connector but under brief specs it says Voltage 600VAC/250VDC, 50-400 Hz

So I'm guessing that it will handle more amps at 12 volts, correct?
For wire and connectors, typically the current handling capacity is unaffected by voltage.

Unless I'm missing something, you're not going to get 200 amps because the truck alternator doesn't produce that much. And you think 400 amps is too small? If you're really pushing that kind of power -- 400 x 12 = 4.8 kW -- you're probably better off engineering something that runs at higher voltages.

The reason it is hard to find connectors of larger capacity is that any sort of portable cabling becomes unwieldy at the sizes necessary to support that kind of current because of the weight and the high minimum bend radius.

Quote:
Another thing is that I'm finding very few options for this or other connectors with just two pins. I'm going to ponder the possibility of moving to four pins and wire conductors, using two for positive and two for negative and then smaller gauge for the two then if it were a single connector for each. Could make doing this in a single cable more manageable.
The typical application for pin and sleeve is the connection of 3-phase AC power. Yes, you can run two wires in parallel, but you have to be careful to be sure that one of the two isn't open, which will lead to overheating.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CA_Tallguy View Post
Maybe I'm backwards on my thinking that I could use more amps at a lower voltage on these connectors vs the ratings... Since in thinking about it, I know the recommended wire for my solar was a lot smaller at 48v than 12v. Hmmm. Also, they are showing you can use a higher horsepower motor with the connectors at higher voltage. If that's the case, these crouse hinds connectors may not be suitable, which seems like it would be surprising since they are so beefy. The connectors are only rated to 400 amps at the most on top (prohibitively expensive) units. The lower end is 40 to 100 amps.
A given number of watts, VA, or horsepower requires less current at higher voltage, so ampacity limited cables can carry 2x the watts, hp, etc. when the voltage is doubled. Also, the amount of power lost due to voltage drop (resistive heating) goes by the square of the current, in a design limited by voltage drop, you can carry 4x the power when you double the voltage.

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have you looed at connectors for snow plows? they might be beefy enough and weather resistant.
I have a snow plow. The connectors on it are small and unreliable and only work because the pump motor is an intermittent load.

Some plows use Anderson connectors.

Quote:
wasn't this issue tackled when they first started running power lines? (DC lost) the comment to go from dc generator > dc to ac converter > ac to dc converter, sure is starting to look easier.

a nice TT-30a outlet mounted on the bumper might also be a possibility and let you use more of what you already have in the trailer.
Well this is what happens when you start overbuilding all the components. On my trailer and tow vehicles everything is engineered around a 40 amp charge circuit and uses either 6 or 8 gauge wire. At that point there are all kinds of workable cable and connector choices.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CA_Tallguy View Post
My search for snow plow connectors also came up with Anderson connectors which reminded me of that option. Thinking about it again is making me want to just go for that and be fine with it. Seems like it is coming down to either that or the ones for carnival rides unless someone can help me understand if these pin and sleeve have the capacity.
The Anderson connectors are cheap and are widely used for battery connections. I can't imagine why they wouldn't work. If they fail from road salt and grit, well, replace them every few years. No connector lasts forever, and you can buy a whole box of Anderson connectors for the price of one of those carnie-rat lashups.

Quote:
The nice thing about an anderson connector is that installation would be a breeze and it could be tucked out of the way on the truck side, behind the bumper, when not in use.
Bingo.

Quote:
A bit of welding and torch cutting to my current ranch bumper would probably be needed to create a spot for the pin and sleeve receptacle. Those connectors are also really bulky on the umbilical side.
A hole saw might be a better choice, but it's your bumper.
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Old 11-05-2013, 08:41 PM   #41
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Thanks for helping me sort out the deal with amp capacity.

On the pin and sleeve, I was just meaning to point out that 400 amps seemed to be towards the max. Those 400 units also seemed to be hundreds or even thousands of $$. You're right, the current setup probably isn't going to generate even 100 amps. I was just trying to size the system with some buffer on the upper end and room for a high output alternator, and I guess to lower the voltage drop. I think a 100 amp plug is a little tight in capacity than I'd like, at leas that's what I'm thinking... But a 200 amp seems fine.

I wouldn't be surprised to find out a system sized for 40 amps like yours would have worked fine. I have no idea how much power the charger is going to milk from the alternator, though the company said I should probably try for 1/0 cable... So that suggests to me it very well could be over.

The more I think about it, and hear feedback like yours, the more I think I will get anderson connectors. I found out they have a variation on the sb175 model that can take 2/0, so that gives me some room if I stick with big cables.

Also, replacing my fridge with a danfoss unit is where I started junto this project... But now in installing the fridge, I've ended up finding some frame/outrigger issues that I'm distracted on. So I'm out of time for research on this project and I just have to order some parts.
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Old 11-08-2013, 01:31 PM   #42
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I ended up ordering 2/0 "entertainment cable"

http://www.skycraftsurplus.com/enter...able00awg.aspx

I hope this to be the "extra flexible" spec with 1290 strand count. This is the carol "super vu tron" brand and is sure sounds swell based on the name LOL. I believe this is either type W or very similar to it.

For now, I am goi to go with the anderson SB 2/0 connector - same size as sb175 but will take 2/0. I can upgrade connector later if I really feel he need, but I want to get moving on install.

Guess I will also order some type T fuses.
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