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Old 11-10-2014, 01:48 PM   #71
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I don't want anything to do with a wet bath- claustrophobic for me-
If you can deal with it, a 20 will work. If not I think the full baths start with the tandem axle trailers.
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Old 11-10-2014, 02:04 PM   #72
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I don't want anything to do with a wet bath- claustrophobic for me-
If you can deal with it, a 20 will work. If not I think the full baths start with the tandem axle trailers.
The 20 has one.
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Old 11-10-2014, 03:39 PM   #73
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Thanks for the clarification.


Yes, if I hadn't seen the 20 first, it would be a good alternate choice.
Since it is relatively rare, it is hard to get a feel for its market, or experience with it. Yours is certainly a favorable one.


The bath does put me off some. They could have exchanged the shower for the sink, rearranged. The sink outside the door would be a better compromise IMHO as in other small baths.

-Myles
I wonder if anyone has retrofit the bathroom to have a separate shower. On the electricity issue, the only real need for generator level electricity is AC, in my guess. The whole AC issue is difficult.

CANAM are the ones that mentioned the frame issue to me. They have a 22 that they've been using for display or something. Because it's single axle and I think AS was playing around with getting the frame weight down that year.

To the OP: If you're 71 and your goal is to travel in a trailer I'd say 4 or 5 year old used would be best. Vintage is charming, but you want to go, not deal with a reno project or massive depreciation on new new.
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Old 11-10-2014, 04:03 PM   #74
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We have extensive experience fitting as much function as possible into as little space as possible, because we are veteran renovators with seven kids and their grandmother living and traveling with us. You have some great ideas. A couple of points, if you were willing to forgo to bathroom sink in that 22 you could remodel to do a separate shower if the wet bath bothered you (though I personally would not mind a wet bath, there are many workarounds).... Also as far as sofa beds or gauchos which are comfortable and can hold their bed linens more or less in place it hidden when made into a sofa, check out the ikea karlstad sofa bed. It's extremely comfortable and is an ingenious design which does just what you are suggesting, the arms are removable as well which makes it very versatile with building in.
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Old 11-10-2014, 04:35 PM   #75
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And, as a price point, ours was about $41,000 about 4 years ago from a dealer in Oregon. We're second owner, essentially. The Louisiana one's $34,000 price seems reasonable depending on its exact condition.


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Old 11-10-2014, 08:15 PM   #76
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Originally Posted by timhortons View Post
I
...
CANAM are the ones that mentioned the frame issue to me. They have a 22 that they've been using for display or something. Because it's single axle and I think AS was playing around with getting the frame weight down that year.

To the OP: If you're 71 and your goal is to travel in a trailer I'd say 4 or 5 year old used would be best. Vintage is charming, but you want to go, not deal with a reno project or massive depreciation on new new.
Interesting about the frame. Thanks for that.

Agree on the last point. I am looking maybe perhaps a few years further back also, but
not vintage. No ambition for major work. I kind of like the Safari 20 with the non-pano
window around the bed.

Thanks for that.
/myles
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Old 11-10-2014, 08:40 PM   #77
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We have extensive experience fitting as much function as possible into as little space as possible, because we are veteran renovators with seven kids and their grandmother living and traveling with us. You have some great ideas. A couple of points, if you were willing to forgo to bathroom sink in that 22 you could remodel to do a separate shower if the wet bath bothered you (though I personally would not mind a wet bath, there are many workarounds).... Also as far as sofa beds or gauchos which are comfortable and can hold their bed linens more or less in place it hidden when made into a sofa, check out the ikea karlstad sofa bed. It's extremely comfortable and is an ingenious design which does just what you are suggesting, the arms are removable as well which makes it very versatile with building in.
Thanks for looking into my design ideas. Yes, the 22 has a lot of room for the weight. The adventure of retrofitting plumbing is a negative for me. I think the customization can be kept more affordable by taking the 20 and making only furniture changes.

I recently spent some time at IKEA looking at their sofa beds. The Karlstad iis attractive, but too wide to fit into the 7'7" width. The BRIMNES is a bit closer to the mark. The problems are: those curved walls will interfere; it opens to a full (two twins) so a bit too wide albeit in an ingenious interleaved slat way, keeping the platform at one level. It figures to be heavy compared to the built-in platform bed.. Adapting it might be more trouble than it is worth. (I remember such a remark by SmokelessJoe.)

For those reasons, I thought up a poor-man's solution requiring only (!) modification of the bed platform to turn it into a convertible by cutting 18" width off the platform, moving back the storage doors 18", and hinging the 18" board so it either hangs down or folds back under the seat. The remaining design issue is the extension support, tbd.
Perhaps the original support can be adapted.

On another topic, I asked in the Floor Forum how to know if OSB was used in the subfloor.

Thanks for the ideas.
/myles
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Old 11-10-2014, 08:51 PM   #78
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And, as a price point, ours was about $41,000 about 4 years ago from a dealer in Oregon. We're second owner, essentially. The Louisiana one's $34,000 price seems reasonable depending on its exact condition.
Guess so. I have tracked asking prices for the 20, so it seems in the ballpark.
OTOH the actual discount to selling price, if any, is opaque.

/myles
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Old 11-10-2014, 09:28 PM   #79
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Ah, but the karlstad can be assembled without the arms, making it short enough to fit. I love the modular aspect. I'll have to check out the Brimmes. We put a fagelbo (an L no longer made) into our last Airstream and really loved it. We have owned a couple of slat - pullout styles from ikea, love the design. Check out the custom sofa bed we built for our 86 32' bunkhouse, that mechanism might suit you as well. Our thread is in the knowledge base under 1986 Excella bunkhouse.
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Old 11-10-2014, 09:38 PM   #80
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No arms? Well maybe, but the 20 is about 1/2' narrower in width than the 25 and bigger models and I don't want to lose too much under-bed storage.

I looked at some of your gallery pix. Huge coach with a family that requires it.
And nicely customized. Your needs are at the other end of the spectrum from mine though. Just me, small is beautiful, all that.

A 20 must look like a midget to you.

/myles
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Old 11-10-2014, 09:51 PM   #81
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...
...
Check out the custom sofa bed we built for our 86 32' bunkhouse, that mechanism might suit you as well. Our thread is in the knowledge base under 1986 Excella bunkhouse.
Do you mean the bunk that drops down to form a sofa back (if I understand correctly?) There are so many beds to choose.from...

I looked up your gallery. Where is the knowledge base?

/myles
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Old 11-10-2014, 10:31 PM   #82
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The airstream KnowledgeBase is just threads broken down by airstream model. We hear you about size, but in some ways size is even more of a premium with so many people-- either way, every inch needs to be accounted for, with special consideration given to sight lines and other design elements to feel as spacious as possible. Our 86 is a narrow body, of course. Fully 14' of the coach is the bunkroom and the side bath, so that leaves the rest for living space and our own bed, plus eating space for ten to twelve and sleeping space for grandma. You have great ideas and are paying attention to the most important part: design and layout. 20' can live much "larger" than twice as much space if it is a well-designed 20'. The sofa we put in our 32 is 9' long, 2/3 of which pulls put via load - rated drawer slides. The back cushions become the rest of the mattress, and there are no legs holding up the extension. There's plenty of space to walk by when extended, and tons of storage underneath. We're really happy with the design and will definitely use the design again. We still decided to do a permanent bed for ourselves this time, and have not regretted it at all even with the space it takes. It has so much storage under it, too, since it's much higher than a sofa. Just some things to consider. Good luck on your project!
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Old 11-11-2014, 08:55 AM   #83
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Another price point for a 2012 20 foot flying cloud - we bought ours this year (2014) or two years old. The purchase price was $38k - including an Equal-i-zer hitch. I think the price was somewhere between what a dealer would have purchased or consigned the camper for (a dealer made several increasing offers for the camper), and the advertised price. The 20 foot works very well for us, a couple, for our brief trips so far. We do like that the 20 foot flying cloud does not have a wet bath. We look forward to taking longer trips in the future.
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Old 11-11-2014, 11:02 AM   #84
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Another price point for a 2012 20 foot flying cloud - we bought ours this year (2014) or two years old. The purchase price was $38k - including an Equal-i-zer hitch. I think the price was somewhere between what a dealer would have purchased or consigned the camper for (a dealer made several increasing offers for the camper), and the advertised price. The 20 foot works very well for us, a couple, for our brief trips so far. We do like that the 20 foot flying cloud does not have a wet bath. We look forward to taking longer trips in the future.
Thanks ukulelel2010. I have seen two 2012s in VA and CO with an average
asking price just under 43K. At about 12% off, it seems pretty fair, esp, with the hitch. Sure would like to know other examples, though, to get a feel for an average selling price vs. age. I would want to be fair to both sides.
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