We're considering the limited edition David Winick remodel of the 19ft Bambi (07). We checked it out today along with the International 19ft and the 16ft Bambi. There are still some around (4 in New England currently), and I hear from AS that production should complete sometime around September.
David did an excellent job at remodelling the Bambi and bringing back some of the retro styling. (we aren't much for the current style of the Safari or International 19fters). He also improved use of space and changed the bed to a slick bed/couch combo. Was a bit disappointed not to have at least the wrap around window at the front which we love on the 16ft Bambi, but the 75th anniverary is definately more inviting and less confining than any other 16 or 19ft we have seen. Probably a much better choice for longer camping sessions. (we currently camp about 30-35 days a year in a 4x10ft teardrop).
Part of our dilema is having to replace our tow vehicle... definately for a 19fter, on the fence about changing for the 16ft Bambi.
Anyone with either have experience with Jeeps and a 16/19ft Bambi? We have a Jeep Liberty which has a short 104.5" wheelbase, 3.7L and 5000lb rating. Not real interested in driving around a honkin truck or megasize SUV. Will certainly add a dual-cam hitch. Suggestions mucho appreciated.
Anyone have comments/experience with the shower/toilet combo of the 16ft Bambi? I'm wondering if down the road we would be wishing we had the larger shower, separate toilet in a 19ft if we went for the 16ft instead.
Anyone else with David Winick's anniversary model?
I'll comment principally on the tow vehicle question. It doesn't look good for the Liberty. First we need to add up how much load your Jeep Liberty should carry whether you have a trailer behind you or not. Jeep's website says for current models that maximum payload capacity is 1150# for all versions and drivetrains (click 'Specifications' along left column; this figure is located down in the Capacities/Weights section). Your owners manual will give your specific number but I'd suspect it'll be in the same ballpark. Vehicle durability is one issue. More important are the safety issues of maneuverability, emergency avoidance and braking. You do not want to exceed this payload, especially at highway speeds and pulling a trailer. Some will advocate for not having more than 85% of your payload capacity onboard. Now ... the 1150# is for the base Jeep Liberty model without options. If the model as ordered came with options or you added any aftermarket hitch receiver or other options, they all subtract from the 1150# before you turn the key.
Airstream specs state that the 75th Anniversary Bambi has a tongue weight of 530# without options. This is a one axle trailer so I'd assume you'd want the optional spare tire; that is stored underneath near the trailer front, so most of its weight would be transferred to the hitch. Other unavoidable options are your weight distribution gear and putting propane in the tanks; I mention these because a very high proportion of their weight is borne by the hitch only. Therefore I suspect the actual tongue weight of a ready to use 19' Bambi is 675-700# (actually weighing is the best thing to do; it may be higher!). This leaves you with a payload for passengers and everything else on board the Liberty of 450# or less. That is skimpy IMHO!
A word about Tow Capacity and GCWR (see Airstream FAQs for a primer): Tow capacity is weighed with just a driver aboard. You can nearly be guaranteed that you will never exceed tow capacity if you stay within a vehicle's payload capacity. Tow capacity should not be used to rationalize whether a vehicle is appropriate. An auto dealer with direct RV towing experience might know something about this topic and you should be cautious. Nobody knowledgeable would ever tell you to drive above Payload Capacity!
There are some mid-larger SUVs that could handle a Bambi. You would not have to go up to the Suburban-sized vehicles. The payload numbers should be in vehicle manuals and manufacturers' websites.
__________________ Bob
Last edited by CanoeStream; 07-15-2006 at 11:43 AM.
I don't have a burr under my saddle but did think of one more thing. The 16-footer tongue weights are listed at 430#; real life might be around 600# or more. The Liberty would still be pushed to the max. That is a mighty small engine and the wheelbase doesn't do you any favors. You should have a larger tow vehicle with 3000# trailers!
Most state park camping we do will have electric hookups only. I have not yet camped at a site where I could be hooked to "city water" and a sewer hookup -- you'll see that more at commercial campgrounds. I'll use a campground's shower if I have the option. I hate to draw on my water tank and fill my grey water for showers (even of the "Navy" type) -- it makes it hard to get a 3-day weekend out of one tank fill. A family would only add to this capacity issue. So the shower tends to be used less. In my opinion the wet bath in the 16' would be a pain under any circumstance.
I'd like to see the interior of the new 2007. Sounds nice. Are there any pictures on line?
I'm probably in the minority here but I much prefer smaller rather than larger. I like the compact design and the ease of parking/storage. Last week I missed a turn off to a lovely winery and was able to do a u-turn and head back. I have the 16ft Quicksilver edition and have not filled up all the storage space yet. The dealer tried to talk me into a couple of 19ft. AS but I really wanted the 16ft. which happened to cost more than the 19ft. models available there. (Figures, lol)
I agree about the shower situation. It's not an issue at all. I spent 6 weeks traveling in a 16 footer and very rarely (if ever) used the shower. To me it's more for emergency or occasional use as the campground showers are usually available. In my AS the shower hose can also be used outside which is a plus for rinsing off feet or dogs etc. I love the wrap around windows.
I tow with a Jeep Grand Cherokee but it has the larger engine. Very smooth.
We are considering trying to hold off on replacing our Liberty until next year. We might get in one or two camping trips by the time we get the Bambi before winter flys here in the north.
So we are wondering about options. I figure we could travel dry (no water/waste) and limit what we take to keep within reason. I'm gaining a good understanding of load capacities in relation to real world weights (stuff in trailer, passengers, gear etc.
What if we have a decent reese or hensley w/d hitch and stick to secondary roads (less speed), ie 45-50mph. Max towing would be 3 hours on fairly quiet roads (upstate NY). Some hills to deal with. This may even be one round trip as we do have a place we could leave the Bambi about 10 minutes from where we mainly camp currently.
Definately safety is a factor and we will either upgrade the tv prior to pulling the Bambi, or wait until next spring if $$$'s are an issue to start using it (uugh! Have Bambi no TV!).
I'll post some shots of the Dave Winick 75th Bambi we visited in CT the other day in a sec...
By the way there are two in stock at the dealer in CT and two in stock at the dealer in NJ. AS says the last ones to be produced (only 75 to be manufacturer) will be sometime in September.
So here are a few shots of the 2007 75th 19ft Bambi (Dave Winick)...
Here is one of the 75ths that JUST came in on the truck about 15 minutes ago!! Bit much maybe for our Liberty...
Roomy design! Dave Winick was looking to open up the 19ft space and did an excellent job of it! You'll notice the small sink by the bathroom is gone making more room for the kitchen galley. Now the fridge is over with the stove and kitchen sink instead of on the other side. This makes this Bambi much more open and inviting. You can't quite see it in this photo, however the dinette is slightly angled so it is easy to slide in and out of. Would have liked the panoramic window at the front, however we can deal with this. I gather Dave was trying to stay with the 'retro' look inside and out.
Kate checks out the convertable/combo bed/couch. Takes 5 seconds to convert it!
Notice the pull out above the lower storage space. Simply pull out to convert it to a bed. Storage area is very accessible unlike the 16ft Bambi.
I went inside several of these last March when I visited Jackson Center. The 75th anniversary model is a very nice trailer. I liked it a lot.
I also looked at the 16'. To me, I would spring for the extra three feet. The interior difference was significant. Both were built well though.
I was shocked at the price tag on that anniversary model though. That alone would drive me to a "lesser" model. If memory serves, it was around $60K. Seemed a lot to me for a 19 footer. Nice trailer though.
A Grand Cherokee with a HEMI should tow any of these nicely.
That is one sa-weet trailer! Winnick did a fantastic job of nailing the vintage look and feel. Looks like now you need to change your avatar 'cause I don't imagine you're still looking after that beauty. I wanna camp next to you.
Just two comments about the Winnick.Sit for a while in the bambi with the wraparound window then go back to the small windowed 19.For me, it was a deal breaker.On the other hand, I love the aluminum walls in my ccd.Would not consider the cloth walls.In any case, it's always a compromise.
I am also interested in the 16' vs 19' CCD. I love the layout of the 16' CCD. With a young child aboard it's nice to be able to close the bedroom screen and give us and her some privacy. I also don't think the 19' corner bed is big enough for two tall people, and I like the increased light & air from the 16' wrap-around windows. But I love the Dave Winick 19' interior.
I have heard that Airstream will be coming out with new interiors soon for the CCD's.
Does anyone know what they will look like?
Does anyone think that it's possible to order a 16' CCD with a Winick interior?
Welcome to the Forums, Marechal! The 19' Bambi corner bed size would be an issue for my wife and I. The Winick 19' goes retro by having that be a fold-up gaucho (couch), so there is the extra issue of having a valley down the middle of the bed. We have very good friends who prefer the 16-footer's double bed also but want a bit more space. Anyway, these friends discovered that the 20' Safari has the same bed with a floor plan they like. They have a Toyota Tundra -- an excellent pairing for this size Airstream. Something to consider anyway.
I have some recall that the limited run of Winick 19' trailers has just about run its course. Prior to this was the 16' Quicksilver limited run. Those were supposedly for the 2006 75th anniversary year. It's anybody's guess if their marketing department has other plans -- I'm sure gas prices will sustain interest in the shorter models. CCD changes? Interesting that you've heard something on this... Model year changeover is usually in the May-June period but Airstream doesn't seem to time every introduction to that time.
Dave Winick has his own custom shop but Airstream commissioned him and probably owns the rights to this specific Bambi design. Dave's website is http://www.vintagetrailering.com/home.htm
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