Well it's Here - '69 Tradewind

[Pawel002]

Hi, mrgreen
It looks very good, Working on frame is the worse part of restoration , after that You see the progress.
Did You buy baufol insulation?

[mrgreen]

Marzboy, i've been following your thread on windows as that is one of my sideline things i can do in the cellar whilst the weather is so cold, it looks as though the flat windows are butyl'ed in and then glazing bars snap onto the frame is that correct? i am waiting on Aircraft Spruce to send me the rivet remover and some Lexan( since Christmas!! but they are now on the way) so i can get the front corner windows out and replace them, any tips on getting the frames apart would be much appreciated as this has me a little worried! as for gaskets i'm hoping the shop that cuts the glass will have a massive selection of different gasket material (yeah right!) but hopefully they will have something. I lifted the the body with two floor jacks and two scissor jacks and in all honesty bacause the floor was out it was quite easy as you could see if it was binding anywhere.

Pawel, yes I am going to use the Baufol (thanks for the links) and also going to put the yellow insulation on top of that as this will be a commercial kitchen the less heat getting in from outside the better, i'm hoping to have the frame sand blasted and then i'll paint it myself then flooring/tank and undrbelly and then slip it back under and then the fun begins!! sounds easy!! i'm hoping to have it on the road by July if the weather plays along it should be possible! as alot will be done in the shop.

[marzboy]

Mr green your windows are a bit different than mine. I think that there a few threads on your windows. Check out the thread on major restorations. I think Zepaluminum has a step by step that looks pretty good. I think my windows are much more simple than yours. Good luck!

[perryg114]

I have to agree with ZEP on the interior skins not being all that structural. If you go with a different material like some sort of plastic I would put more rivets in there than Airstream did. I am starting to think AS made the interior panels intentionally loose so that they can adapt to the twisting and bending that the shell will see. Airplanes use the outer skin exclusively for structural support along with ribs and stringers and they are plenty strong, much stronger than an AS trailer. My Aerospace Engineering degree is telling me the interior skins don't do much for structure.

Perry

Originally Posted by Zeppelinium

I don't agree, although I certainly thought this was true for the first several years that I owned an Airstream. The wall panels may add a small amount of strength to the shell, but it is minimal. Take a look at how few pop rivets secure the inner walls and it will be apparent that they are not nearly as structural as the outside skins.

Further, in the 70s models (and maybe that includes 68 and 69) the ceiling panel sits in two channel extrusions and are only secured to the ceiling ribs with a few pop rivets at the ends and another six or so (depending on the length of the trailer) in the middle. The fact that the interior skins are one piece along their length does give them significant strength as a beam, so the attachment of the lower inner skin to the C-channel provides substantial vertical stiffness. Still, however, they are not attached with enough rivets to be really structural.

I wouldn't advocate going without interior skins, but they add only a small portion (certainly less than 25%) of the monocoque strength to the shell.

Dissenting opinions welcome, as always.

Zep

[mrgreen]

O.k it's warming up a bit over here atleast during the day we are out of the negatives!, went and pulled out one of my corner windows out today which went well although i didn't expect vulcram to be so hard to break the seal! anyway got it out and there is a screw in each corner to hold the frame together which were well and truly rusted in so i thought i would just drill them out but whatever metal they are made of is really strong as my drills wouldn't touch them, anyway they finally snapped and i got the frame apart but will need to put screws going the other way on the frame for the rebuild as the rest of the screw is there to stay, i also took off the rear airstream letters and cleaned them up and gave them a paint, i don't know if it's correct or not but my rear letters are riveted on but the ones over the front window seem to have no rivets is that a correct assumption? anyway here's a photo of the ones i've re-painted, does anyone know what to do with the land yacht emblem, mine is in quite flaky condition and doesn't take well to a wire brush, may try sand blasting??

[Zeppelinium]

Take a look at this thread. The letters should have two posts on the back, and are held in place with speed nuts. When the posts pull out of the letter, they sometimes leave a small hole in the face. I filled mine with JB Weld epoxy.

Zep

[pinkflamingoes]

Hi mrgreen,

I have a 67, and when we removed the inner skin, there were rivets attaching the tradewind plate to the outside skin. The rivets are on the inside of the OUTER skin (or they may have been screws, or whatever). Unless you're willing to remove the inner skin right there, it would be better to tape around the letters, get the crud off, and re-paint.

I don't know about the letters in the front...

Welcome to the world of repairing and airstream. We have a long job ahead of us too. I used to post a lot, but financial situation stopped our remodel cold, and I felt stupid posting with no progress. I think I'm back on here, because since 2004 a lot has changed. I'm almost losing my faith that we'll get it done, but with our house barely on the edge of foreclosure, maybe we trade living in our beloved house to living in the Airstream. That I could live with.

[mrgreen]

thanks, I was just wondering what the original format for them was, i will go the re-rivet route as every letter has rivets and the body already has the holes i don't need to make more work for myself i already have enough!

[mrgreen]

Today was window day, so I decided to put the Lexan in the front corner windows to start with, quite an interesting thing to do to try and get all the frames on, screws in, whilst bending the lexan into the correct shape, i then cleaned the excess sealant off with acetone!!! what a mistake to make!! the acetone took the shine off the window and made it go cloudy so I had to start again, I got the second bit in and am now waiting for another order of Lexan luckily I found it cheap on Ebay. in the meantime I put my rear window to the glazers to get glazed and my Baufol insulation arrived so next oppurtunity will be sealing the lap lines and installing the insulation.



whoops!



Had to bring it upstairs as the sealant won't set under +5 degrees


can't wait to get that and the windows in and run a heater!



on another note:

I want to put an order into Air Spruce as i would like a piece of Alclad to patch a few bits and pieces but i don't want to just order that so was wondering if anyone knew the size of the rivets that go in the belly pan so i can order them at the same time,
many thanks.

[Zeppelinium]

Originally Posted by mrgreen

... so was wondering if anyone knew the size of the rivets that go in the belly pan so i can order them at the same time, ...

#11 drill, so that would be a 3/16" pop rivet. You need to get the style with the "large flange," and I don't think Aircraft Spruce has them. I order them from Vintage Trailer Supply.

Zep

[mrgreen]

so progress is slowly moving forward although my welder is dragging his feet somewhat got both of my front corner windows glazed and the flat back one should be ready to puick-up tommorrow, I removed all the tape residue from around the windows which was a hell of a job having been on there for so long but i managed to find some 3m glue remover from the jobsite which i'm on at the moment which was probably 20 years old which worked a treat but is not to be found anymore, oh well i had just enough to get it all done.

I measured up for the axles today but alko or knott don't make exactly the right size but my welder said if i order one at 1600mm we can cut it and take 40mm out of the axle, is this possible or will that ruin the integrity of the axle, the only other way i have found is to order them specially made from England which would cost a bomb in Transport, maybe i can find them closer to home made to order but my German isn't that good to find such a place!

[Pawel002]

Originally Posted by mrgreen

I measured up for the axles today but alko or knott don't make exactly the right size but my welder said if i order one at 1600mm we can cut it and take 40mm out of the axle, is this possible or will that ruin the integrity of the axle, the only other way i have found is to order them specially made from England which would cost a bomb in Transport, maybe i can find them closer to home made to order but my German isn't that good to find such a place!

Hello Mr Green
I buy alko axles with changed mount bracket position directly from alko dealer
I pay 900€ for set like this




If it's good price for you, I can help you , but you need come to Poland for pick up
I live in Katowice so you have 700km to me.

[mrgreen]

Pawel that is really a good price i have been quoted with shock absorbers €1400 without transport! so you are lucky, are your brackets at 1560mm apart?

[Pawel002]

Yes my bracket is 1560mm and outside is 2040mm

[mrgreen]

Well bad day yesterday the owner of the barn wants his space back! and the glass i had cut is the wrong size, luckily they measured up it so they will have to replace it. Luckily the workshop that is doing the frame has space for me and i will atleast be under cover even if it's open at one end but on talking to the welder he's decided a new frame is easier to make than repairing the old one and he's going to teach me how to weld in the process so it's win win and he is going to galvanize the frame as well! can't wait to get the bill for all this but oh well do it once do it right!!


Pawel that is a great price, although i am rating my axles to 3500kg to put the kitchen in there and i geuss there is a difference in price, how long did your order take to make and could you ask what the cost of them would be?, a trip to Poland maybe in my future!! thanks!

[Pawel002]

I check the price and for 3000kg rating axles they want 1230€ , for 3500kg - 1680€
All price are for sets like on photo on previous post, with changed position of mount bracket.
So if you found for 1400€ it is very good price.

[mrgreen]

Well it's been a while thought i better post an update, I have finally started the frame build I have the base all laid out and the outriggers all cut and ready to weld, i made it out of 24 gauge steel so it's definately going to be strong enough to hold a kitchen!, now i'm just waiting for the axles and coupling to turn up before i finish it and then it will go off to be galvanized ( only a little more than por-15 and no work!!), should be here next week some time fingers crossed, in the meantime i started to polish! holy **** what a dirty job and man does the grey cover alot of blemishes!(scratches) my plan of attack is to hit the whole tub with F7 then go back around removing the stubborn bits of clearcoat and try and sand a few of the scratches out, but if i can get the F7 done before i have to move it (to the body shop) it would be good. attached is a picture of the progress thus far, haven't got one of the frame yet but will post one when finished, the white scrubby marks on the body are from wiping down with white spirits.

[mrgreen]

whilst waiting for my axles to Arrive i've been playing around with my lights (upgrading to e-marked, damned EU regs) well i couldn't find 4" ones so had to settle for these and goo them in a bit but they came out o.k, what i'm really looking for is a set of reversing lights to go into where the reflector sits (as rear reflectors in the E.U must be triangular, you can get round ones with triangular reflectors in them but not at 3") otherwise i'll have to settle for a set of reflectors to fill the holes and i'll have to cut new holes for reverse and fog lights or i'll just mount them under the bumper, choices choices!, on another note does anyone knoe where to get the stabilizor jacks from, I am going to place an order from rvshop.com but they only have the "C"type jacks? are these jacks still available? mine has a 20" leg on it (one missing, one bent!)




My axles should leave the factory on the 17th, my order from Spruce aviation should come Monday or Tuesday so it should be a fun packed week, finishing welding my frame and finally being able to patch the pieces of bodywork which need patching!!

[marzboy]

I got my stabilizer jacks from Inland RV. I love them!! Lookin good!

[mrgreen]

Well I've just about got my frame all welded up i just need to weld the outriggers on, the tank holder is two angle iron frames sandwiched together with threaded bar, had problems finding a place for the stabilizers then as the tanks are right in the rear and run 1.5 metres down the frame so the stabilizers are right at the back now and i will make my grey water exit sideways, I managed to get new stabilizers which are rated to 2600kg so I will see how they go as they look very Asian to me!. the steps were another story as they were really rusty so i had them sand blasted and then primed but in that state they cant be galvanized so i opted to weld two outriggers on and then slide the steps onto them and bolt the whole thing together

i will add some more photo's but i forgot my camera yesterday,