Tail sag and separation

[D&D]

How do you get the floor out without taking off the belly pan??

[Inland RV Center, In]

Originally Posted by D&D

How do you get the floor out without taking off the belly pan??

Front or rear?

Andy

[D&D]

Rear, I have my airstream completely stripped out, I took down the belly pan (middle section) from the rear up to the axles and amazingly the frame from black tank forward looks new, no rust!!! However I'm don't see how I can get the rear piece of plywood out without removing the belly pan and the banana wrap? Maybe I missed something? Also we are trying to decide whether or not to move the bedroom to the back and the bathroom to the center curbside? I can make the cabinets and counter top but not sure what to do about the shower, can one be ordered? Also is there a place for the black tank up there? Just thinking it would be better to have kitchen and bath next to each other to reduce the amount of water lines.

[Inland RV Center, In]

Originally Posted by D&D

Rear, I have my airstream completely stripped out, I took down the belly pan (middle section) from the rear up to the axles and amazingly the frame from black tank forward looks new, no rust!!! However I'm don't see how I can get the rear piece of plywood out without removing the belly pan and the banana wrap? Maybe I missed something? Also we are trying to decide whether or not to move the bedroom to the back and the bathroom to the center curbside? I can make the cabinets and counter top but not sure what to do about the shower, can one be ordered? Also is there a place for the black tank up there? Just thinking it would be better to have kitchen and bath next to each other to reduce the amount of water lines.

To replace the rear section of floor, the banana wraps, quarter panels and the panel below the rear window, should "all" be remove, to properly replace that plywood, as it should be, in one piece. Remember the floor is part of the "monocoque" construction. Piecing it, weakens that area.

Extra tie down brackets should be welded to the outside of the frame, just inside of the banana wraps. That will provide extra "hold down." You may find the floor channel cracked. If so, it should be removed at welded. Install more bolts, thru the floor channel, thru the plywood and theu the frame. Add steel plates inside of the floor channel, and then run the bolts thru them, for even greater strength.

Make sure the rear hold down plate is clean and secure. A water leak from the past, will cause it to rust, sometimes very bad.

Moving the bath, I don't think, will be very cost effective, since your old tanks won't fit, as they will have to be turned 90 degrees.

Old, major parts, for the baths, are typically not available.

The "elephant ear" repair is a bunch of "HOG WASH."

Andy

[D&D]

Thanks for your reply Andy, that helps!

Dale

[Inland RV Center, In]

Originally Posted by D&D

Thanks for your reply Andy, that helps!

Dale

Your welcome, anytime.

Andy

[TBird156]

This information has been most helpful. I have a 1969 31' Sovereign with a rear rotten bath. PO lived in it for 10 years at a trailer park. Used a garden hose fished through the wall for his shower. I am trying to save this beauty. I have pulled all the cabinets out and have pulled all bath fixtures out that were on the floor (a lot of damage and wear). Left the upper acrylic shell for now. Unit smelled and I have found lots of rodent nests probably from the belly pan punctures. Bath floor was rotten. Cut away the plywood and removed black tank. Box it was in was rusted through as were many of the rear lateral members. Plan to weld new supports and possibly install new black tank and add grey tank and fresh water tanks mid trailer. Any ideas?

From the information I have read here i really need to replace the entire floor and should remove the entire belly pan and floor insulation to get rid of the smell and check for other rot / rust. I was hesitant at first but I want this beauty to be trouble free when I am done.

Anyone run heater tubing under the floor?

I am thinking seriously about removing the acrylic single piece arcylic bath ceiling / wall shell with built in medicine cabinet and side storage to make the bath smaller. Has anyone else done that? Am I changing it too much? Am I taking on more than worthwhile? Know where I can get shower stalls?

Not sure I want to tackle this major change but my wife wants a rear bedroom, but window placement doesn't work well for that. Anyone move the windows before?

[D&D]

I was going to do just what your thinking. but changing the bath to the center was going to be very expensive so we've decieded to put it back together the way it was. I welded new sections in the frame where needed and replaced the rear section of floor, now we have the fiberglass dome back in, that wasn't easy, and two lower wall sections and as much as I hate to say it, we are now building a new house so the AS will have to wait until this winter Good luck on your project. If you have any questions at all you can find answers here on the forums as people are very helpful!!

[Trophycare]

Andy, On my 62 tradewind looking at the rear of the trailer I can see the left side of the bumper is 1/2 to 1 inch lower. Is this frame seperation? I can pull up on the bumper and it moves very little? If so how can you fix this?

[Trophycare]

Ok, Maybe false alarm. I looked at the rear very close tonight in the cold rain! I Opened the rear of my trailer last year to replace to black tank valve. I was able to look into left rear under the black tank. Toilet "sitting" on top of small tank. You can see the frame and the black tank sitting nicely together. No gaps etc. The only gap was the space that the rotten wood was removed about 1/2 inch around the last bolt through the frame before the bumper. Any ideas?

[silverleeper]

Originally Posted by Trophycare

The only gap was the space that the rotten wood was removed about 1/2 inch around the last bolt through the frame before the bumper. Any ideas?

This is a concern. The wood, frame and skin all work together and rotten wood in that area can be the beginning of frame separation.

Posting a picture of this area will help.

[Trophycare]

Ok, I opended up the side that I was concerned about and found that the PO had cut a knotch out of the frame just before it attaches to the bumper. (This allowed the drain pipe to go just under the frame) The drag bar you can see in the picture is still intact and the frame is secure. I can see all the way to the first crossmember of the frame The floor is sitting snug on top of the frame rails. I think im ok now. Just all the talk about tail drag separation just scared me!

[JKnight]

How do I know if I have rear end seperation or rear end sag? Andy I downloaded your illustration from an earlier post on how to fix rear end sag I believe. Is this done with bathroom area taken out or is it possible to do fom the outside?

My frame has approx 3/4" of space from the framce to the shell.

Any help would greatly be appreciated.

Thanks, Judd

[wasagachris]

Originally Posted by JKnight

How do I know if I have rear end seperation or rear end sag? Andy I downloaded your illustration from an earlier post on how to fix rear end sag I believe. Is this done with bathroom area taken out or is it possible to do fom the outside?

My frame has approx 3/4" of space from the frame to the shell.

Any help would greatly be appreciated.

Thanks, Judd

Judd I think you have answered your own question by asking it. If you have 3/4" of space between the shell and the frame I would call that seperation. A sure fire way to test isd to get on the bumper and jump up and down and watch for movement between the shell and the bumper/frame.

[Inland RV Center, In]

Originally Posted by JKnight

How do I know if I have rear end seperation or rear end sag? Andy I downloaded your illustration from an earlier post on how to fix rear end sag I believe. Is this done with bathroom area taken out or is it possible to do fom the outside?

My frame has approx 3/4" of space from the framce to the shell.

Any help would greatly be appreciated.

Thanks, Judd

Judd.

You described rear end separation, "BIG TIME" with the 3/4 of an inch.

1/8 of an inch, is way too much, let alone 3/4 inch.

Sorry, but you asked.

Andy

[JKnight]

I measured last night and the seperation appears to be approx 1/2", not that thats any better but some. It appears that someone has attempted a fix in the past. I noticed this when I was removing the rear bumper and the holding area to clean it up and treat some rust issues. Someone had put grey silicone to close tyhe gap.

I am in the Dallas area, any susggestions with anyone that handles this type problem.

I have attatched some pics.

Thanks, Judd

[Candice]

Andy,
We have just come across this problem and realized we also have this issue on our 31' Sovereign. May I post a couple picture to get your opinion on the problem we actually have, so we are fixing it properly?
Thanks!
Candice

Originally Posted by Inland RV Center, In

Silver suz.

There are many approaches to fixing the frame and/or rear end separation.

It is considerably easier to not confuse the issue, by finding out what the "exact" problem is, first.

Please post a photo ot two, clearly showing the separation. Also please show a photo or two of the area of the frame that is damaged.

From that, you will narrow down the possibles, so a straight forward answer can be suggested.

I will be glad to help you, but, the pictures are worth more than a thousand words.



Andy

[Inland RV Center, In]

Originally Posted by Candice

Andy,
We have just come across this problem and realized we also have this issue on our 31' Sovereign. May I post a couple picture to get your opinion on the problem we actually have, so we are fixing it properly?
Thanks!
Candice

Sure can.

We will try to help, best we can.

Andy