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Old 12-12-2005, 06:31 AM   #183
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ankornuta
So ... what does everyone think?
if you see holes, i would bet the wood around it is rotten as well. you could try replacing a larger piece of the floor in that area, to span 2 outriggers. the structure of the floor is very important (obviously). the more it shifts when you run down the road, the more stress it puts on the riveted seams of the end caps, causing them to leak. i ran a bead of gutter seal down teh inside of all the seams, and it still leaks. so, i sat in the trailer one rainy day, and found out that the water starts wicking into the seams at the rop of the end caps, and runs down between the pieces to the window and leaks behind them. so... to makew a long story short, i'm puting the alcoa gutter seal on the outside of all the end cap seams, then removing the front and rear window frames, and re-vulkeming them in place. if that doesn't fix it, nothing will!

good luck on your floor. a complete floor replacement is a LOT of work, but it does feel nice knowing you have such a good foundation to build on.

jordan
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Old 12-12-2005, 09:29 AM   #184
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Looking great Jordan, I thought you must be having a busy month since I hadn't seen any posts... The trim looks great and I have been thinking the same thing about trimming around the stair - though getting the bucking bar in there would be tough - I might do it with olympic rivets. I also really like the way the trim goes under your trailer and I should have done that! At least it is "reach-able" later. This will be one of those upgrades I can save for when I have nothing better to do.

In regards to the wood interior and condensation: I have none on the wood, but the rivet heads are tiny little frost magnets. I do think my current conditions here are pretty extreme - below zero outside, space heater inside with me sleeping in there (so lots of moisture in the air). The rivets become little ice flowers down by the floor. I don't think this is going to be a problem - the wood is poly-ed on both sides and doesn't seem to show any difference where it is condensing vs. where it isn't (up higher). I wonder, however, how you will install your veneer and if there would be a problem with glue around these areas? Will your rivet heads be exposed? I also suppose when I get my woodstove going it will dry the air and the problem might disappear... This week I hope, I'll let you know.

At any rate, great progress!

Carlos
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Old 12-12-2005, 11:08 AM   #185
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I would replace the whole floor - my floor was solid except for a small area in the front and small area in the rear and I replaced the whole floor - when I took it out the holes around the bolts were rotted and I found a lot of other rotted places. Also it eliminated the foul smell in the trailer - so in my opinion, the whole floor should come out while you have the interior out - you will sleep much better and the trailer will be essentially new...

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Old 12-12-2005, 01:55 PM   #186
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcferguson
Looking great Jordan, I thought you must be having a busy month since I hadn't seen any posts...
yeah, november was pretty much spent travelling. we went back to the UK for 2 weeks, then a week of being on the road here... that plus all the other little "projects" life's piled up for me, ya know!

thanks for the compliment on the trim. i am really pleased with it. thanks again for forwarding the aluminum supply company info. i may end up trying to fabricate a missing window frame out of some of their stock.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcferguson
In regards to the wood interior and condensation...
i have thought alot about this. i assume since you used real wood, that you are actually getting a secondary layer of insulation from the aluminum that i wouldn't have with wood laminate. my initial plan was to laminate the wood directly to the aluminum curved end cap pieces, then seal it extremely well with lacquer, and hope for the best. i haven't gotten to the insulation phase of the trailer yet. i'm HOPING to get there in january, if i get a few more 40+ weekends to play with. i wonder if the aluminum insulation allows the condensation to build up quicker than normal fiberglass batt insulation would? not to get TOO scientific here, but i'm guessing that since the aluminum skin has a direct connection to the exterior skin via the aluminum ribs, it's going to conduct the coldness right to the back of the panels i would essentially be laminating the veneer wood to, regardless of insulation method... unless i maybe offset the inner skins from the ribs with a thin foam tape or similar?

maybe i'm over-thinking this.

all i know is it would REALLY irritate me to go through all the trouble of laminating these panels, etc... then find them bubbling off in the first year from condensation.

how are you liking your insulation, by the way? are you still happy with it after living in it a bit?

jordan
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Old 12-12-2005, 02:55 PM   #187
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A-Merry-Can
if you see holes, i would bet the wood around it is rotten as well.
I should mention that there were not holes.... the holes are just what happened when i pounded on the rotten looking spots with a hammer. So... I don't think there is any more rot since I knocked it all out and made the holes.

But thank you for all the good advice. I think I will pull the inside lower skins anyhow and see what the wood looks like near the lower channel.

Thanks everyone. And thanks for this GREAT thread!
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Old 12-12-2005, 03:04 PM   #188
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ankornuta
I should mention that there were not holes.... the holes are just what happened when i pounded on the rotten looking spots with a hammer. So... I don't think there is any more rot since I knocked it all out and made the holes.

But thank you for all the good advice. I think I will pull the inside lower skins anyhow and see what the wood looks like near the lower channel.

Thanks everyone. And thanks for this GREAT thread!
on my trailer, the floor was soft around the entire front curve, and completely ripped out at the rear. i hate to say it, but if you can beat a hole through the wood, it's rotting beyond the hole you punched in it. the main problem with soft wood near the edges (in my guestimation) is it would allow the body to shift around during movement, and loosen other stufff up.

the first goal would be to stop the leak that caused the damage in the first place, then look at the floor really carefully and decide how "committed" you want to be! it's a slippery slope, my friend!



jp
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Old 12-12-2005, 03:24 PM   #189
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Been there done that -- - - "well its only", "what if", "maybe I can" - all those thoughts went through my mind - thinking I would rather have dental surgery than replace the floor - in the end it wasn't all that bad (amazing how time tends to make things look better) but I did it - its done and I'm really glad.......

Ken
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Old 12-12-2005, 03:39 PM   #190
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ha! indeed! rule #1... don't count your hours! you're not in this to make a profit, you're in this to make a trailer! the second one should go faster... so i tell my wife!




then i get this look:






jp
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Old 12-12-2005, 08:44 PM   #191
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A-Merry-Can

i have thought alot about this. i assume since you used real wood, that you are actually getting a secondary layer of insulation from the aluminum that i wouldn't have with wood laminate.

I think that is true - there is a noticeable difference between touching a piece of metal and a piece of wood inside my space. I imagine a veneer would have some of this insulation effect too - it just wouldn't conduct cold in the same way as metal .

Quote:
Originally Posted by A-Merry-Can
my initial plan was to laminate the wood directly to the aluminum curved end cap pieces, then seal it extremely well with lacquer, and hope for the best. i haven't gotten to the insulation phase of the trailer yet. i'm HOPING to get there in january, if i get a few more 40+ weekends to play with. i wonder if the aluminum insulation allows the condensation to build up quicker than normal fiberglass batt insulation would? not to get TOO scientific here, but i'm guessing that since the aluminum skin has a direct connection to the exterior skin via the aluminum ribs, it's going to conduct the coldness right to the back of the panels i would essentially be laminating the veneer wood to, regardless of insulation method... unless i maybe offset the inner skins from the ribs with a thin foam tape or similar?
My conditions have been extreme - probably a 60 degree differential between the inside and outside at times. Even so, I think the frost formation (which happened anywhere there was metal near the floor) didn't seem like a big problem. I imagine if the interior had been all metal I would have had a ring of frost around the entire lower 1/3 of the trailer. Up higher I guess it is warm enough to keep things from condensing? I did use cork spacers between my skin and ribs as I think those ribs are the weak spot in the insulation. Even so, the snow on top melts first where the ribs touch the skin - my heat is finding the way out there.

I think if there was a way to cover the rivets (if the skin was glued to the top of the aluminum as you are thinking) there might not be any condensation at all. There just isn't any condensation on wood areas, even over the ribs, and I would think it's possible your veneer would do the same. Though time will tell. This is the problem with experimenting of course.

Quote:
Originally Posted by A-Merry-Can
all i know is it would REALLY irritate me to go through all the trouble of laminating these panels, etc... then find them bubbling off in the first year from condensation.
yes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by A-Merry-Can
how are you liking your insulation, by the way? are you still happy with it after living in it a bit?
I do really like it. I think it works pretty well - it has been darned cold here, down to -10 a few nights ago. On a warmish day I looked at the roof and the one place where I used fiberglass insulation (around the woodstove flue) the heat from inside had melted the snow off the roof. Outside this circle of insulation the snow was still on the roof. I take this to mean that the silver stuff is working better than the fiberglass insulation.

Let me know what you are thinking about the interior when you get around to it.
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Old 12-16-2005, 07:31 PM   #192
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Hi- I have a 66 22' that has
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Old 12-16-2005, 07:37 PM   #193
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belly pan, 66 safari

HELLO TO ALL! Reading all these belly pan issues and I am totally new to all this. Recently purchased the trailer and I know the rear tank pan is shot and rear bellypan is bad too. I had planned to remove the entire pan, replace the tank pan and fabricate a new belly pan. Guess a BIG RED FLAG just got raised....can anyone tell me what to bo with this scenerio in a 1966? Thanks John
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Old 12-18-2005, 08:00 AM   #194
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcferguson
Let me know what you are thinking about the interior when you get around to it.
hey man,

sorry for the delay. these holidays have me all behind the 8 ball. i still have to shop for the misses! man, time flies.

anyway, here's my thoughts on the interior. as mentioned, i plan on laminating the end caps with maple, then seal everything SUPER-good, re-rivet it all together, and cover the rivet seams with a small piece of trim in a contrasting wood (like cherry). the cabinets i plan on using cherry on all visible surfaces, with pine or something less expensive (and LIGHTER) for structure.

the way i'm planning on doing the skin, i'll still end up with rivets that have a direct contact to the outside, visible inside the trailer... just not as many as you do. i'm not doing the lamination stuff in the bathroom, behind the closets, or the kitchen, so really teh only place you'll see the wood is in teh front room, and around the bed.

i'll attach a jpg of the final layout i'm going to go with. i've even started laying out how i'll be building the furniture. i had to MAKE myself put the mouse down... otherwise i'll just keep changing everything all around.

my ETA for starting on the interior is looking like spring. it's too cold to work on it every weekend, and i still need to install the side windows and re-seal the front and rear frames before insulation can start.

speaking of window frames, i DESPERATELY NEED a rear window for the pickle! does anyone know where i can find a replacement? the total window frame is 41X20, with a glas window framed opening of 39X18. (see pic) right now, it's got a nice piece of plexi gooped into place. HORRIBLE! i can't leave it that way!

cheers!

jp
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Old 12-18-2005, 08:37 AM   #195
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jp -

Love the interior layout and the rounded edges are way cool. What program did you use to draw those up? Looks like Illustrator maybe?

As for the missing window, what is the Hehr number on the window frame that's riveted to the shell? It's in the center of the bottom frame. Or is that part missing too?

There is a '60 Overlander on ebay that was laid over on its curbside. The seller is under the impression it can be fixed, it could with tons of $, and it has lots of useable parts including windows. I'll just bet one of those would work. Its located in Barstow, CA and is missing one axle. Seems a PO thought it was a parts trailer because he sold it. You know, if enough forums members were needing the parts, it may be worth all going in on it and stripping it down. Starting price is $200 but not met the reserve. I just don't have the room or I may be tempted.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...RK%3AMEWA%3AIT

Take a look.

Brad
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Old 12-18-2005, 08:46 AM   #196
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My on-going research suggests that I don't get any condensation unless it is about 4 degrees or less outside. Then only the lowest rivets condense ice. I think by covering the rivets with the contrasting wood you would eliminate this kind of problem.

Are you missing just the glass or the frame too? I can't tell as it looks like there is a frame there in the picture, just that the glass part is replaced with plex? I had the same problem and just got a piece of double strength glass to go in there with the weather strip from vintage trailer supplies. I have been looking for an extra window frame - and if you need one of those I think Brad's suggestion is probably the way to go - I have been watching ebay for about a year without a window that would fit my trailer showing up. I would have liked an extra to add some window in my "studio" area.

Hope your holidays are good and you get some warm weather.

Carlos
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