outriggers

[joaks]

Some of my outriggers on my 61 Ambassador have worn through skin in 3-4 inch vertical slits. I remember seeing a thread or a website somewhere discussing it but I cannot seem to find it now. Id like to find out how serious of a problem it is, and wether my frame will need any work/welding. If the frame is going to be ok, I just need some suggestions on a cosmetic fix.

Seems to me if your going to have to cut out patches to fix it, would be a good time to determine if any parts of the outrigger/frame will need sanding/priming/coating, etc.

Thanks,

Joaks

[59toaster]

No structural problem or worries as long as your floor is sollid but no a easy fix either. That section is attached BEFORE the exterior skin is put on. After pulling off the belly pan on ours today I think I know why it happens. The belly pan has rivets into the crossmembers to suport it in the center. On ours most of those rivets have pulled through so most of the belly pan was being suported by the outer edges. As the coach travels down the road I bet a low pressure are forms under the coach. The pulls on the belly pan even more and cause it to move. The movement causes the wear at the ribs.

Knowing this the first thing you need to do is see if i'm right and the pally pan has pulled free from the crossmembers underneath. If it has hit the local metal supply and pick up a 1 inch stip of aluminum and make a reenforcment plate to put over the original hole and rivet through it to make a stronger attachement.

The easy repair for the damage at the out riger ends wuld be to buy some new .025 2024 or 6061 aluminum sheet. cut it into 10 inch stips and put it up to the bottom of the outer skin over the damaged pannel and rivet it on. If you use Olympic rivets from www.airstreamdreams.com they will look very simular to the original rivets once finished. Line them up under the existing Rivets and only the really observent would notice the extra row and thos same olks would also know why.

I just ordered some aluminum from www.airpartsinc.com and VERY pleased with their service (same with Airstream Dreams). Super friendly folks and they sell the aluminum by the foot. You might ask if it's possible for them to get a square cut and if they could cut it into 10 inch strips for you. The cut on the material I bought was pretty clean but I havent taken a close look at it yet.

Now the down side. 2024 and 6061 is not cheap!. Air parts beat all the local suppliers by a long shot in price. Trailer trash is saying he is picking up aluminum form a marine place in FL for dirt cheap but has not mentioned what it was. It may be something like a 3000 grade not sure how well it would match the existing skin. 2024 t3 AlCad is what the older units are made out of for sure. Not sure about the newer units. The belly is a lower grade. 2024 t0 (not Alcad).

[joaks]

The center area on my belly is still pretty tight. The rivets seem snug and I don't see any sag down the middle. Your previous post about sag got me thinking though and I took a closer look at the area immediately surrounding the outriggers that have broken through the skin. Right under the punctures is where mine has sagged and the rivets are loose. The skin then immediately rises back up and is tight all the way through to the other side where it sags again. The sag can't be more than 1/2 inch. I guess it's just enough to cause it to rub on the outriggers, especially with road vibration and lower pressure underneath. Oer 40 years of gravity doesn't go unnoticed I reckon.

I ordered my rivets today so I plan on working on those areas as soon as I get them in.

Question for you though. When I get sections of the belly removed, will I be able to see and access the frame/outriggers/crossmembers enough to get a good feeling on how much rust I have and possibly address them with a good wire brush and a can of primer?

I plan brushing down the axle housings this week, priming them, and coating them with a thin layer of spray rubber (like Rhino liner). Any comments or critiques on that? I had also planned to do that with what appears to be exposed outriggers in the wheel well behind the second set of tires on both sides. The idea is to prevent rock/salt damage to the metal and provide a coating that plain primer/paint cannnot do. But I may be way off in my thinking here. From a cosmetic standpoint, you wouldn't really be able to see any of it. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

[gerbermania]

Yes, once you have the belly pan pulled away, you will be able to access the steel frame and outriggers enough to inspect them.

I pulled the rear quarter of my belly pan down, to find that my black water tank brackets were disintegrated, and the main steel channel of the frame had portions rusted all the way through.

I brought the AIRSTREAM to a shop to have the channel reinforced, new brackets made for the tank, and then had the rear quarter of the frame sandblasted and zinc coated. It should last another 30 years.

I was told by the welder, not to simply wire brush and spray rust-protecting paint on the rusted outriggers and frame, because the rust residue will continue under the paint. Intead, he recommended to wire brush, and spray a rust-converting paint on, and then protect that with a layer of rust-protecting paint.

Christopher

[59toaster]

Originally posted by joaks
The center area on my belly is still pretty tight. The rivets seem snug and I don't see any sag down the middle. Your previous post about sag got me thinking though and I took a closer look at the area immediately surrounding the outriggers that have broken through the skin. Right under the punctures is where mine has sagged and the rivets are loose. The skin then immediately rises back up and is tight all the way through to the other side where it sags again. The sag can't be more than 1/2 inch. I guess it's just enough to cause it to rub on the outriggers, especially with road vibration and lower pressure underneath. Oer 40 years of gravity doesn't go unnoticed I reckon.

I ordered my rivets today so I plan on working on those areas as soon as I get them in.

Question for you though. When I get sections of the belly removed, will I be able to see and access the frame/outriggers/crossmembers enough to get a good feeling on how much rust I have and possibly address them with a good wire brush and a can of primer?

I plan brushing down the axle housings this week, priming them, and coating them with a thin layer of spray rubber (like Rhino liner). Any comments or critiques on that? I had also planned to do that with what appears to be exposed outriggers in the wheel well behind the second set of tires on both sides. The idea is to prevent rock/salt damage to the metal and provide a coating that plain primer/paint cannnot do. But I may be way off in my thinking here. From a cosmetic standpoint, you wouldn't really be able to see any of it. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

I have had our coach completly appart this week. Not counting the long time leaks our coach had, The worst rust areas I found was in the wheel wells where the frame was exposed, In the step cavity and the hitch. The rest of the frame was in remarkably good condition. Still had paint on it even.

The bottom of the frame rails where they were incontact with the belly pan did have some issues. I'm not sure you will have the same. The belly on our has been loose for quite a while and I think that may have contributed to the problem.

Because of the extensive work We are doing on our coach I am re engineering the belly pan. THe rocker area will be indipendent of the pan. I will be able to gain full access to the undeside of the coach by removing forr pannels. The pannels will be suported by stips of 1/8 x 1 inch aluminum stock. I plan to add a gray water tan benind the axle in the future so I need un restricted access for that future upgrade.

[joaks]

I wouldn't mind seeing a picture of that. I have plenty of room on the left side from just in front of the axle all the way down to the bathtub, some 5-6 feet post axle. It's all hollow cabinet space down that entire side except for 2 small areas where the original water heater sits and a new 12 gallon electric the previous owner installed. I haven't decided yet wether to attempt refurbing the original or not.

I wouldn't need to access that area from the belly either, bec the fold out double can be opened up for pretty easy access. The only question for me would be if I can get enough drop from the bathtub drain to do it. The current sewer pipe goes under the subfloor and connects t the bottom of the black water drain pipe if Im not mistaken.

[joaks]

Well, I got a portion of the belly pulled back and there is a lot of rust and dirt laying in the belly. The frame and outriggers are about 70% covered w/rust on the section I pulled back. The pic below shows that there is still some black primered areas untouched but not a lot. Seems to be worse with a lot more flaking towards the edges of the outriggers. I have taken a screwdriver and poked at the frame all around the area, with no soft spots showing up. The subflooring seems solid to as an fyi. That however doesn't attest to the strength of the frame. How much rust is to much for me to scrape off and re-primer? I sure hope Im not past that point yet.

Im hoping as I move away from the wheel wells there will be less rust. The insulation is pretty thin and ragged, so I will be replacing it after I find out about my options with the frame.

James