Frame Rot

[byamcaravanner]

Originally Posted by monocoque

In order for this to happen the floor would need to be removed close enough to the screw to allow the saw blade to slide underneath the flooring and above the frame.

I bet you have not removed your belly pan. Am I right?

[Gkiesel]

Sorry, I was thinking that you had access to the underside of the floor, from underneath the trailer. ie. no belly pan. From above yes, the floor would be removed piecemeal. Is there an advantage to removing the floor in whole sheets? To use as a template maybe?

[monocoque]

Originally Posted by Gkiesel

Sorry, I was thinking that you had access to the underside of the floor, from underneath the trailer. ie. no belly pan. From above yes, the floor would be removed piecemeal. Is there an advantage to removing the floor in whole sheets? To use as a template maybe?

I do have access to the underside of the floor as the belly pans have been removed. But if the floor needs to be cut out to allow room for the saw it wouldn't matter whether the belly pan is removed or not. With the floor cut out one could make the same cut from above as below. Right? Please excuse my lack of knowledge here. Still trying to picture the Sawzall method. I've never used a sawzall? But if it's easier than what I'm doing I'm willing to give it a try. Does a sawzall allow a cut at a 45 degree angle cut to the saw and without the floor being removed?

And, yes, one advantage of removing the flooring in sheets is having a template for the replacement flooring.

[byamcaravanner]

Todd,

The fiberglass insulation is sandwiched between the frame and the floor. This leaves about an 1/8" "soft" space which is enough room to work the blade in. I used a 9" long blade which is very flexible. If you start the blade slowly at an angle to the frame, it will slide along the bottom of the plywood and work its way into the gap above the frame. Once the blade has pushed away the insulation you can speed up the blade and work your way over to the elevator bolt shaft. At this point... it's zip zip and the bolts are cut.

[vhord]

I just center punched the elevator bolt heads and drilled it with a 5/16" (anything larger than 1/4") drill bit. You only have to drill about 1/4" deep and the head comes right off. Then you can take a pin punch and push the bolt straight through the frame.

On the upside down bolts in the c-channel I used a Dremel tool to cut the square nut in half and then pushed the bolt through.

The hardest ones so far have been the rusted phillips head sheet metal screws in the channel. I've had to grind some of them off with the Dremel tool.

[FC7039]

Originally Posted by byamcaravanner

Todd,

The fiberglass insulation is sandwiched between the frame and the floor. This leaves about an 1/8" "soft" space which is enough room to work the blade in. I used a 9" long blade which is very flexible. If you start the blade slowly at an angle to the frame, it will slide along the bottom of the plywood and work its way into the gap above the frame. Once the blade has pushed away the insulation you can speed up the blade and work your way over to the elevator bolt shaft. At this point... it's zip zip and the bolts are cut.

Hope this picture helps. Its only a recreation.

[monocoque]

Originally Posted by byamcaravanner

Todd,

The fiberglass insulation is sandwiched between the frame and the floor. This leaves about an 1/8" "soft" space which is enough room to work the blade in. I used a 9" long blade which is very flexible. If you start the blade slowly at an angle to the frame, it will slide along the bottom of the plywood and work its way into the gap above the frame. Once the blade has pushed away the insulation you can speed up the blade and work your way over to the elevator bolt shaft. At this point... it's zip zip and the bolts are cut.

Steve, okay I'm finally with yall! Neat! What I wasn't picturing was the 9" long flexible blade. In my mind the machine wouldn't be able to get in close enough to the work but with a long blade I see your point. Pun intended. So this method would work even for removing whole sheets of flooring. I just need to get in close enough to the screw from below to hit it with the blade. Very good!

[monocoque]

Originally Posted by vhord

I just center punched the elevator bolt heads and drilled it with a 5/16" (anything larger than 1/4") drill bit. You only have to drill about 1/4" deep and the head comes right off. Then you can take a pin punch and push the bolt straight through the frame.

On the upside down bolts in the c-channel I used a Dremel tool to cut the square nut in half and then pushed the bolt through.

The hardest ones so far have been the rusted phillips head sheet metal screws in the channel. I've had to grind some of them off with the Dremel tool.

Wow! Another great method. Maybe even easier than using the sawzall or the grinder since the belly pan wouldn't need to be off and one doesn't need to breath lots of smoke!

I just bought a dremel tool and lots of bolts in the u-channel are up ahead. What attachment to the dremel did you find works the best for this?

[SafariSS]

I bet the nehibors are loving it!!!...
I admire your attitude, you will enjoy this trailer for years to come when you are complete.

[monocoque]

Originally Posted by SafariSS

I bet the nehibors are loving it!!!...
I admire your attitude, you will enjoy this trailer for years to come when you are complete.

It's been an adventure and the journey continues. Kinda like Alice's adventures in wonderland or more likely Ahab's pursuit of the white whale. The neighboors are into it actually. So far lotsa smoke rolling out the windows of the trailer and frequent banging and cursing haven't, amazingly, gotten me an eviction notice or even a single code compliance citation. I think this old trailer really needed saving from the AS bone yard. Even the local cop on the neighborhood patrol likes to stop and check on the progress.

[vhord]

Originally Posted by monocoque

I just bought a dremel tool and lots of bolts in the u-channel are up ahead. What attachment to the dremel did you find works the best for this?

I have been using the #426 Reinforced Cut-off Wheels with a #402 mandrel.
http://www.dremel.com/en-us/attachme...=66367&I=66371 They are very thin and about 1-1/4" dia. When they wear down and need changing I save the worn down wheels. They come in handy for tight places.

These wheels are pretty tough. I even used them to grind out the welds on my rusted out rear crossmember. That area was too tight to get my 4-1/2" grinder into.

I have ordered a new EZ Lock attachment http://www.dremel.com/en-us/attachme...=66367&I=69877 . It should make it easier changing the wheels but the shaft may be too large for some tight places. I will let you know how it works.

BTW, here is a picture of one of the elevator bolt heads removed with the drill method. I did not center punch it so I got a little off center but it came off just the same.

[monocoque]

[quote=vhord]BTW, here is a picture of one of the elevator bolt heads removed with the drill method. I did not center punch it so I got a little off center but it came off just the same.[quote]

Keep me posted about the dremel researches. I don't remember seeing those style discs at HD or Lowes. Not a very wide range of attachments in either place. Are you ordering on-line?

What is the metal plate in your photo? Is that u-channel? We're talking about floor screws, yes?

P.S. Ahhh...I see what you mean. This is a photo of the drilled out head of the screw. The metal plate is only in the photo for contrast. Good!

[vhord]

[quote=monocoqueKeep me posted about the dremel researches. I don't remember seeing those style discs at HD or Lowes. Not a very wide range of attachments in either place. Are you ordering on-line?

What is the metal plate in your photo? Is that u-channel? We're talking about floor screws, yes?[/quote]

I own an Ace Hardware store and so I ordered the attacment from them. You can order from them online Ace and they will deliver them freight free to your local Ace store.

The metal plate is actually the backside of a piece of inner skin that was placed around my water heater.

And yes, I am using this drill method to remove the elevator bolts (screws?) that hold my plywood floor to the frame. I use the Dremel tool in the c-channel bolt and screws.

[Wabbiteer]

Gents - I've used up a bunch of Dremel wheels over the years... The fates of a few of them are listed here:

Religiously remove the cut-off disc spindle from the tool while it's not being used as even a mild strike against the end will bend it or shatter the spendy wheels, at 25,000 RPM even the smallest out-of-round will vastly shorten the life of the discs and Dremel supplies those spindles without much if any temper.

And also remember let the RPM's do the work, as in no/low pressure just enough to get the sparks flying. And try to keep the plunge depth shallow since the lateral wear that widens the cut trough just means less overall cut length since any contact eats away disc thickness.

Also note that screw should be tightened with a screwdriver each time, simply allowing the rpm and fingertip contact to spin it down won't get it tight enough and the slippage will cut through the screw itself.

Wal-Mart discontinued carrying the Dremel quick attach aluminum oxide discs and spindles; my local Wal-Mart still had the blister packs on the close out red-tag price shelves for $4 a few weeks ago (I bought 4 packs) which I have yet to try.

[UpNorthAir]

Try this on your rusted phillips head screws. Saved my $%^ a couple of times.
This thing is a must have for the "Working on Old Stuff" tool box!

OTC 1/2" IMPACT DRIVER KIT - JCWhitney Auto Parts

Good Luck!

[vhord]

Originally Posted by UpNorthAir

Try this on your rusted phillips head screws. Saved my $%^ a couple of times.
This thing is a must have for the "Working on Old Stuff" tool box!

OTC 1/2" IMPACT DRIVER KIT - JCWhitney Auto Parts

Good Luck!

That's a good idea. I actually have one of those somewhere and had forgot about it. It is Great Neck brand however but works on the same principal. Thanks for the heads up. Now where did I put that???

Vernon

[malconium]

What I did to remove my plywood was the following:

1.) Made a sketch of the floor and noted all important dimensions before removing anything. I also made templates of the curved ends while the original floor was in place.

2.) Using my circular saw set so the blade is a hair less than the floor thickness I cut along the base of the outer walls as close as I could reasonably get (1 to 1-1/2"). I then cut cross wise of the floor on each side of the cross members - close to the bolts and screws. This allowed me to remove large rectangles of the flooring.

3.) Using a combination of a sawsall, an air powered cutoff wheel and a hand-held hacksaw blade I was able to remove the remaing strips of wood pretty easily. The extra stuborn screws at the bottom of the wall were typically cut using my cutoff wheel right through the plywood if necessary.

Note that on early 70's and newer models it would be very dificult to get full sheets of flooring out in the middle areas because their ends are inside of the c-channel on the bottom of the u-channel at the base of the walls. You will likely have to at least cut the plywood sheets in half lengthwise to be able to get them out.

Malcolm

[monocoque]

Originally Posted by malconium

Note that on early 70's and newer models it would be very dificult to get full sheets of flooring out in the middle areas because their ends are inside of the c-channel on the bottom of the u-channel at the base of the walls. You will likely have to at least cut the plywood sheets in half lengthwise to be able to get them out.

Malcolm

Thanks Malcolm. I wondered how folks were removing and reinstalling full sheets of flooring given the way the flooring fits inside the c-channel at the base of the midship walls. What about reinstalling? To reinstall it seems it must be necessarily to create an extra front to back seam. Of course there are no factory seams lengthwise. So I am trying to imagine how the factory installed the full sheets? Possibly flexed the walls out slightly? I posted a photo of the floor channel in no. 54 of this thread.

[monocoque]

Originally Posted by vhord

That's a good idea. I actually have one of those somewhere and had forgot about it. It is Great Neck brand however but works on the same principal. Thanks for the heads up. Now where did I put that???

Vernon

Thanks guys. The impact driver tool sounds like something I could have used a few weeks back. As you can imagine there are lots of rusted phillips head screws on this rig inside and outside. I have been using a pair of vise grips to get the rusted screws moving securing the window screens and interior window molding. I'm not sure, however, that the impact driver would work in such a delicate setting such as around windows.

During the process of removing the banana wrap on either side of the door frame I didn't realize that the wrap wasn't riveted behind the door frame. So I began removing two philips head screws on the bottom lower corners of the door frame. Those screws were rusted and stuck tight in place and very quickly the phillips head rounded out. This process was going downhill fast and before I knew it I had knocked the heads off the screws with an angle grinder. I think my idea was to obtain a flat surface and drill the screw out.

My little hand held miketa drill doesn't seem to have the horsepower to tap those screws. Now I'm not so sure how to remove the old screw. Probably need to try an electric drill to get a tap hole started. Someone suggested an "easy out" which is based, I think, on the tapping process. Here are a few photos showing where I am at this point with these screws.

[monocoque]

I'm in the process of removing the lower interior skins to access the floor channel. Eventually this shell is going to float! As I suggested previously the screws around the window molding are either stubborn or rusted or both. After I removed the window molding I discovered that the lower window frame support (not sure if this is the correct term) was completely detached from the window frame itself! I suppose it was only being held up by the molding screws! Now how did that window frame support detach from the window frame with all those rivets!? I was guessing that the window frame rivets somehow missed attaching to the support frame but the holes are there in the support framing and the window frame seems securely attached to the outer skin. I love the mystery and discovery involved in this work!