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Old 03-04-2009, 12:59 PM   #15
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Andy,

Thanks for the info. I'm very aware that my axles are bad and is the likely candidate of why my frame got fatigued, which is why I haven't towed the trailer since I bought it. (it makes me sad every time I want to go hit the road).

Here are some pics of the crack:





It seems to me that the PO must have hit a large pot hole or something, as the frame just beneath the crack is also bent.

Any suggestions on the proper way to repair this. I'm not a welder, but I know that I better become friends with one real soon. I'm starting to consider pulling the frame out to fix everything, but don't know if I'm ready to do that yet.
Your picture clearly shows a downward deflection at the point where the frame is cracked. Can you explain how or when that deflection occurred?

Could that deflection be the cause of the crack? I can't see it being the result of the crack. Is the cross member also cracked just inside the frame?
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Old 03-05-2009, 08:04 AM   #16
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frame failure

howieE
that crack is very similar to the ones i have had and it is caused by metal fatigue not hitting any bumps. i had a mechanical engineer look at mine and that is what he concluded. this guy took a lot of measurements of my frame and ran a computer model---if you never tow the tr and kept it in an air conditioned building it will last a very long time he said. other than the design problem the protective coating (paint) is poorly applied and not effective. the frame should never rust under normal circumstances. mine is rusting all over and i live in central Texas.
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Old 03-05-2009, 08:53 AM   #17
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howieE
that crack is very similar to the ones i have had and it is caused by metal fatigue not hitting any bumps. i had a mechanical engineer look at mine and that is what he concluded. this guy took a lot of measurements of my frame and ran a computer model---if you never tow the tr and kept it in an air conditioned building it will last a very long time he said. other than the design problem the protective coating (paint) is poorly applied and not effective. the frame should never rust under normal circumstances. mine is rusting all over and i live in central Texas.
Don,
Just curious..which computer model did the ME run and, could you PLSE post the actual results from the model test here?
Thanks
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Old 03-06-2009, 08:06 AM   #18
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Don,
Just curious..which computer model did the ME run and, could you PLSE post the actual results from the model test here?
Thanks
I'll see if i can get it from him. the program simulated various loads,road conditions,time,temp and a whole lot more that did not mean anything to me. there was no conclusion, just a lot of numbers that he interrupted. i remember he said load was a real problem and i guess that means no grey or black water during towing [i rarely do]. oh, rust was a factor also. if i can get the data I'm not sure how to post it all. now you understand this only applys to the 22'int model which has a different frame than any other AS.
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Old 03-06-2009, 09:55 AM   #19
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Just my ranting..

I understand that your results were menu driven for the 22ft frame but, the program itself, is still a program that could be re-configured for any input data. It would interesting to see what, if anything, shows up for..say , A 1971 model with a rear bath, etc..
I am assuming it had a material input for strength ratio?
Would be interesting to throw in different materials and, design factors..
About the frame rust..You can expect this to happen..when you have a water based painted frame..
It's just as well to leave it unpainted and, let the owner put his own on..
In fact, I wished the factory would give you an option here..
Paint it with POR 15 or, use whatever material the new owner wished for a frame.
My recent experience:
While I was working at a A/S dealership here in NH, (they are now closed) I saw many 2004/2005 models that were arriving straight from the factory with spots on the frames already started to show rust...Shame on the factory and, unforgivable. Their answer was..Blame it on the EPA BECAUSE IT WAS TOO COSTLY to build a facility to handle the fumes from the other types of paint. Go figure now what the "real" cost will be to deal with..disgruntle owners etc..
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Old 03-06-2009, 12:05 PM   #20
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HowieE,

I haven't the foggiest of how this happened. Once I get the shell off this weekend, I'll be sure to snap some different pictures, especially on the outside portion of the frame. I can not see yet if the opposite side is cracked, but can only assume that it is. As you can see in the pic, the frame is bowed in where the crack occurred and is also bowed one the plate that the axles are attached to. I'm going to have one of my experienced steel worker buddies take a look at it and help me repair the area. Like I said earlier, I've decided to pull the frame completely out to get a better look and make the repairs a little easier. I'm hoping to get a lot of this accomplished this weekend while the weather is nice.

Also, where the crack is on the cross member is the original welding bead and looks like it just separated due to the deflection. Once I have a clearer look of the problems, I'll let you all know and certainly pass on any advice that my friend gives me.
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Old 03-06-2009, 03:34 PM   #21
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Brain

We just all assume that the frame rails were straight when the frame was assembled. However if you do remove the frame please sight down the lenght of the top and bottom of the frame. I am curious if the drivers side frame rail was bent inward just forward of the cross member during assembly and thus cause that deflection at the center of the crack.

Also was the lower flange of the frame ever welded to the lower flange of the cross member or just along the vertical seam. The picture doesn't seam to show any welding on the inside but it may have been welded along the bottom.

This is what I found on the receiver when I returned from Alaska. Not sure I can blame Alaska but that when I looked.
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Old 03-06-2009, 06:50 PM   #22
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I certainly will, HowieE. If everything works out tomorrow, I should be pulling the frame out. Took me a little longer to get started today and have been having problems getting the elevator bolts out from the c channel. Finally sharpened my chisel and snapped the heads off. Duh....should have did that to begin with.

I've got my first brace almost built and it seems like it will be pretty strong. I'm using the same concept that's in the very first thread in the frame repair forum.

Anyhow, going to get some R and R after a full days work.
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Old 03-07-2009, 12:15 PM   #23
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if this plate corrects a design fault in the frame, should not the factory give this part to anybody that needs it?
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Old 03-07-2009, 04:26 PM   #24
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I think what you are gonna see is this.
It's a temporary fix and, just accept it as such..
The problem, as such, is not gonna go away..
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Old 03-08-2009, 08:59 AM   #25
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of course your right. i have many welds and patches on my frame and it is still cracking. I'm thinking of buying a MIG welder and carry it with me when i travel. i always carry a 3000w gen so pwr will not be a problem. ever wonder why you never hear of pick-up truck frames cracking? you always assume the frame of a vehicle as being the strongest link.
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Old 03-08-2009, 09:04 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by DON GUBRUD View Post
of course your right. i have many welds and patches on my frame and it is still cracking. I'm thinking of buying a MIG welder and carry it with me when i travel. i always carry a 3000w gen so pwr will not be a problem. ever wonder why you never hear of pick-up truck frames cracking? you always assume the frame of a vehicle as being the strongest link.
In a word Don,
It's known as "cost cutting"..
You know where, each penny counts.
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Old 03-08-2009, 06:07 PM   #27
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yes indeed, each penny counts. i wish i has all the pennies i put into this frame repair. if i put all of the pennies [100,000] in the trailer i doubt if the frame could hold it up. yes, i have spent over $1,000 in welding cost ....so far.
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Old 03-08-2009, 07:45 PM   #28
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That's not even close to being fun...
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